Are gold watches less susceptible to magnetism?
Discussion
Zio Di Roma said:
gregs656 said:
If I was checking my watches regularly during the day for magnetism, I'd sell them and move on.
I don't. Only when they are new and I am trying to find out how they run.If you buy watch you like, then does it really matter if it is getting magnetised or not? You wouldn't sell a watch you really liked just because it was getting slightly magnetised.
You would just live with it, and accept that mechanical watches can be slightly inaccurate for all manner of reasons. It's just a factor of ownership.
Lord Marylebone said:
Zio Di Roma said:
gregs656 said:
If I was checking my watches regularly during the day for magnetism, I'd sell them and move on.
I don't. Only when they are new and I am trying to find out how they run.If you buy watch you like, then does it really matter if it is getting magnetised or not? You wouldn't sell a watch you really liked just because it was getting slightly magnetised.
You would just live with it, and accept that mechanical watches can be slightly inaccurate for all manner of reasons. It's just a factor of ownership.
After that, I just check occasionally to ensure that the watch is running correctly and not magnetised. It isn't a regular thing.
With regard to your other comments, you're speaking for yourself there, not me.
Lord Marylebone said:
As far as I am aware, I can't say I have ever had this issue, with any watch, ever.
I'm guessing the telltale sign is a watch running noticeably fast or slow, as in a couple of minutes or more per day?
Me neither.I'm guessing the telltale sign is a watch running noticeably fast or slow, as in a couple of minutes or more per day?
However, my youngest has managed to magnetize any watch that I've ever given him except for the G-Shock that he wears now.
And no, I have no idea how he does it only that I never do.
DJP said:
Lord Marylebone said:
As far as I am aware, I can't say I have ever had this issue, with any watch, ever.
I'm guessing the telltale sign is a watch running noticeably fast or slow, as in a couple of minutes or more per day?
Me neither.I'm guessing the telltale sign is a watch running noticeably fast or slow, as in a couple of minutes or more per day?
However, my youngest has managed to magnetize any watch that I've ever given him except for the G-Shock that he wears now.
And no, I have no idea how he does it only that I never do.
Zio Di Roma said:
No. None of mine run more than 10-20 seconds a day wrong when magnetised. All of them run well within COSC when not magnetised.
Test your mechanical watch with a compass, if you have one. Wait for the needle to become still and lower the watch over it. If the needle deflects noticeably it's magnetised.
I think magnetism is far more widespread than people think. Before anti-magnetic mainsprings, watches WOULD run very fast if magnetised. Nowadays, other components still become magnetised and cause less noticeable deviations. That may be a loss or a gain and often only a few seconds.
Every mechanical watch I have owned in recent years has become magnetised at some point. Some are worse than others. My Sub is fairly immune and then actually runs BETTER when magnetised. I had a Sea Dweller than magnetised easily and ran poorly.
Fascinating - never thought this could happen and am as surprised as the writer above that it happens with a keyboard.Test your mechanical watch with a compass, if you have one. Wait for the needle to become still and lower the watch over it. If the needle deflects noticeably it's magnetised.
I think magnetism is far more widespread than people think. Before anti-magnetic mainsprings, watches WOULD run very fast if magnetised. Nowadays, other components still become magnetised and cause less noticeable deviations. That may be a loss or a gain and often only a few seconds.
Every mechanical watch I have owned in recent years has become magnetised at some point. Some are worse than others. My Sub is fairly immune and then actually runs BETTER when magnetised. I had a Sea Dweller than magnetised easily and ran poorly.
FWIW anthing with steel / iron in it can become magnetised - only austenitic stainless is largely immune. What is magnetising your watch is a DC current flow but it should be tiny from a keyboard. Just waggled a compass over my keyboard and the deflection is about 5 degrees which suggests a very weak magnetic field highly unlikely to put any significant permanent magnetism in your watch
But to answer your original question changing the case to gold would not make the slightest difference apart from making it prettier and costing you twice as much. If the effect you are noticing really is magnetic then its likely to be magnetism affecting internal steel components but TBH I dont believe it.
Edited by bordseye on Saturday 25th September 16:26
Edited by bordseye on Saturday 25th September 16:29
bordseye said:
Fascinating - never thought this could happen and am as surprised as the writer above that it happens with a keyboard.
FWIW anthing with steel / iron in it can become magnetised - only austenitic stainless is largely immune. What is magnetising your watch is a DC current flow but it should be tiny from a keyboard. Just waggled a compass over my keyboard and the deflection is about 5 degrees which suggests a very weak magnetic field highly unlikely to put any significant permanent magnetism in your watch
But to answer your original question changing the case to gold would not make the slightest difference apart from making it prettier and costing you twice as much. If the effect you are noticing really is magnetic then its likely to be magnetism affecting internal steel components but TBH I dont believe it.
Well the watchmakers I spoke to yesterday, and they are proper makers of watches, said that magnetism is pretty much a guaranteed situation with a skinny dress watch. Which is a conclusion that I was coming to myself.FWIW anthing with steel / iron in it can become magnetised - only austenitic stainless is largely immune. What is magnetising your watch is a DC current flow but it should be tiny from a keyboard. Just waggled a compass over my keyboard and the deflection is about 5 degrees which suggests a very weak magnetic field highly unlikely to put any significant permanent magnetism in your watch
But to answer your original question changing the case to gold would not make the slightest difference apart from making it prettier and costing you twice as much. If the effect you are noticing really is magnetic then its likely to be magnetism affecting internal steel components but TBH I dont believe it.
Edited by bordseye on Saturday 25th September 16:26
Edited by bordseye on Saturday 25th September 16:29
Zio Di Roma said:
Out of interest, do you test your watches for magnetism, or are you just going by the fact that they keep time OK?
Just that they keep time OK, for me, for years. And then my son has them and the hands are practically whizzing round within days...And nope, I have no idea what he does to them.
Except that I gave the last to a friend of a friend who had it running right in minutes and said that it's problems were down to magnetism.
Edited by DJP on Saturday 25th September 19:05
Zio Di Roma said:
944 Man said:
I've got one of those. Used it at 08:00 yesterday. By 18:00 the watch had lost 5 seconds as was very magnetised.I would add that the JLC Master Control is a watch that is sold on its "1000 hours" of attention to its finish and accuracy.
944 Man said:
Zio Di Roma said:
944 Man said:
I've got one of those. Used it at 08:00 yesterday. By 18:00 the watch had lost 5 seconds as was very magnetised.I would add that the JLC Master Control is a watch that is sold on its "1000 hours" of attention to its finish and accuracy.
In which case it never had any magnetism. To demangetise some steel you need to put in in a coil with an oscillating current flow or alternatively heat it up to the point where the molecules can re-order themselves. You wont have done the latter - did you do the former?
Not doubting your observation of a change in timekeeping. Do you have a tin box ie one made of steel and 100% enclosed? If you do then the experiment would be to put the watch inside the box and observe timekeeping, then add a magnet inside the box and do the same finally reverting back to no magnet to see if the timekeeping reverts back to what it was at stage 1. That way you have a chance of eliminating the obvious other issues.
I only have one old style mechanical watch and that never keeps time well ( 1960's Omega Seamaster). I will have a go at the experiment myself to see what happens.
Not doubting your observation of a change in timekeeping. Do you have a tin box ie one made of steel and 100% enclosed? If you do then the experiment would be to put the watch inside the box and observe timekeeping, then add a magnet inside the box and do the same finally reverting back to no magnet to see if the timekeeping reverts back to what it was at stage 1. That way you have a chance of eliminating the obvious other issues.
I only have one old style mechanical watch and that never keeps time well ( 1960's Omega Seamaster). I will have a go at the experiment myself to see what happens.
This subject is starting to draw me in.
I have been messing about with the compass and demag tool and discovered that the watch shows different degrees of magnetism in different aspects. So, it will show as magnetised dial down and not dial up, for example.
Also, I can demag the watch, leave it somewhere well away from magnets and it will again become magnetised.
My current working theory is that my demag tool is not fully demagnetising the watch and internal components are magnetising one another.
I have this morning ordered an Elma anti-mag tool and will try it with that.
Zio Di Roma said:
This subject is starting to draw me in.
I have been messing about with the compass and demag tool and discovered that the watch shows different degrees of magnetism in different aspects. So, it will show as magnetised dial down and not dial up, for example.
Also, I can demag the watch, leave it somewhere well away from magnets and it will again become magnetised.
My current working theory is that my demag tool is not fully demagnetising the watch and internal components are magnetising one another.
I have this morning ordered an Elma anti-mag tool and will try it with that.
Well, partly you are correct. I have been messing about with the compass and demag tool and discovered that the watch shows different degrees of magnetism in different aspects. So, it will show as magnetised dial down and not dial up, for example.
Also, I can demag the watch, leave it somewhere well away from magnets and it will again become magnetised.
My current working theory is that my demag tool is not fully demagnetising the watch and internal components are magnetising one another.
I have this morning ordered an Elma anti-mag tool and will try it with that.
The zero magnetic field that you appear to be chasing isn't practical or possible. You probably have a mixture of ferromagentic & paramagnetic materials. Achieving a lasting zero guass isn't ever going to happen.
I think your test may be flawed too. If a material is magnetic, it will distort a magentic field, even if it has no net field of it's own.
Electro-magnetic fields are essentially lazy buggers. If you offer them the choice of two mediums, they will always choose the easiest one.
So, if you offer the earth's magnetic field a choice between flowing through air, or a lump of completely demagnetised iron, it will divert from it's normal path and go through the iron as a shortcut.
What this means is, even a completely demagnetised magnetic material will deflect a compass needle. The bigger the lump (and the lower it's relative permeability) the more the needle is deflected.
mikeveal said:
Zio Di Roma said:
This subject is starting to draw me in.
I have been messing about with the compass and demag tool and discovered that the watch shows different degrees of magnetism in different aspects. So, it will show as magnetised dial down and not dial up, for example.
Also, I can demag the watch, leave it somewhere well away from magnets and it will again become magnetised.
My current working theory is that my demag tool is not fully demagnetising the watch and internal components are magnetising one another.
I have this morning ordered an Elma anti-mag tool and will try it with that.
Well, partly you are correct. I have been messing about with the compass and demag tool and discovered that the watch shows different degrees of magnetism in different aspects. So, it will show as magnetised dial down and not dial up, for example.
Also, I can demag the watch, leave it somewhere well away from magnets and it will again become magnetised.
My current working theory is that my demag tool is not fully demagnetising the watch and internal components are magnetising one another.
I have this morning ordered an Elma anti-mag tool and will try it with that.
The zero magnetic field that you appear to be chasing isn't practical or possible. You probably have a mixture of ferromagentic & paramagnetic materials. Achieving a lasting zero guass isn't ever going to happen.
I think your test may be flawed too. If a material is magnetic, it will distort a magentic field, even if it has no net field of it's own.
Electro-magnetic fields are essentially lazy buggers. If you offer them the choice of two mediums, they will always choose the easiest one.
So, if you offer the earth's magnetic field a choice between flowing through air, or a lump of completely demagnetised iron, it will divert from it's normal path and go through the iron as a shortcut.
What this means is, even a completely demagnetised magnetic material will deflect a compass needle. The bigger the lump (and the lower it's relative permeability) the more the needle is deflected.
However, last night I spent quite some time demagging the watch. I found that by demagging it in one aspect, it worsened the magnetism in another. However, I eventually got to a position where I could not move the compass needle in any aspect.
Lo and behold, the watch gained a fraction of a second overnight, instead of losing.
I take your point that the compass test is not perfect, but I know when a watch is magnetised.
I cannot help but think the little JLC is going to spend much of its life magnetised, as it was when I bought it.
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