Nirmrod Decision coming back to haunt the Government?

Nirmrod Decision coming back to haunt the Government?

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Discussion

Elroy Blue

8,686 posts

191 months

Thursday 9th June 2011
quotequote all
disco1 said:
rofl

I think with that logic you're perfect for a place in the Question Time audience.
So you're suggesting that anyone who questions some of the decisions taken by this Government and it's leader is a raving communist.

I guess that puts the whole of the RAF and Navy in th ered camp then. :rolleyes;

DamienB

1,189 posts

218 months

Saturday 11th June 2011
quotequote all
While we're talking Nimrod... on Thursday this week the RAF retired their second last example of the type, R.1 XV249. Last mission - crew currency so that the single remaining example, currently on active duty in the Med, can keep on going until the end of the month.






martin mrt

3,768 posts

200 months

Saturday 11th June 2011
quotequote all
Im going to miss these flying over the house en route to Aberdeen to do whatever they do at Dyce Airport

I think Cameron should be hung for scrapping the Nimrod

eharding

13,600 posts

283 months

Sunday 12th June 2011
quotequote all
martin mrt said:
I think Cameron should be hung for scrapping the Nimrod
rofl

Why? - once Cameron seals the deal with the SNP, and Scotland becomes independent, it isn't as if spotters north of the border would be seeing them anyway.






Mojocvh

16,837 posts

261 months

Sunday 12th June 2011
quotequote all
eharding said:
martin mrt said:
I think Cameron should be hung for scrapping the Nimrod
rofl

Why? - once Cameron seals the deal with the SNP, and Scotland becomes independent, it isn't as if spotters north of the border would be seeing them anyway.
Indeed. As there never was the promised EU referendum from the tory euro fanboy, the die has been set for the destruction of the United Kingdom.

IroningMan

10,154 posts

245 months

Sunday 12th June 2011
quotequote all
I dipped into Lewis Page's book the other evening. He's a cheerful sort, isn't he?.

Elroy Blue

8,686 posts

191 months

Sunday 12th June 2011
quotequote all
IroningMan said:
I dipped into Lewis Page's book the other evening. He's a cheerful sort, isn't he?.
The man is a grade A cock. He's collected all the chips in the world and balanced them on his shoulder.

anonymous-user

53 months

Sunday 12th June 2011
quotequote all
What happens to the crew when the lights get turned off on the fleet? Presumably as the hulls go the work decreases but what happens when the last one actually goes? Presumably there are enough crew on the other types already?

In an airline, being the last ones on a phased out fleet is great as you do even less work than normal. You sit around at home doing whatever your thing is, still getting paid as all the work is now on the new aircraft. Then you get transferred onto something else depending on who you work for.

I'm guessing it's not so cushty in the RAF.

Edited by el stovey on Sunday 12th June 13:49

roryfizz

143 posts

180 months

Sunday 12th June 2011
quotequote all
Elroy Blue said:
The man is a grade A cock. He's collected all the chips in the world and balanced them on his shoulder.
+1

A man with a axe to grind..

Seeker UK

1,442 posts

157 months

Sunday 12th June 2011
quotequote all
el stovey said:
What happens to the crew when the lights get turned off on the fleet? Presumably as the hulls go the work decreases but what happens when the last one actually goes? Presumably there are enough crew on the other types already?

In an airline, being the last ones on a phased out fleet is great as you do even less work than normal. You sit around at home doing whatever your thing is, still getting paid as all the work is now on the new aircraft. Then you get transferred onto something else depending on who you work for.

I'm guessing it's not so cushty in the RAF.

Edited by el stovey on Sunday 12th June 13:49
They may get a chance to convert to another multi-engine platform, get a desk job somewhere or take early retirement / redundancy (as many crabs will be doing along with the other 2 services)

Ginetta G15 Girl

3,220 posts

183 months

Sunday 12th June 2011
quotequote all
Seeker UK said:
They may get a chance to convert to another multi-engine platform, get a desk job somewhere or take early retirement / redundancy (as many crabs will be doing along with the other 2 services)
Which means we lose capability especially at a time when CMD has committed us to another conflict.

Don't believe the 'spin' about a 'Capability Holiday', there is NO such thing (it is merely a piece of PR spin to hide what is really happening), it is an irrecoverable capability loss!

Just as with the LRMPA fleet, by the time we do replace the system(s) (if ever) then we will have lost the cadre of trained operators able to actually do the job.

Personally I think it is all part of CMD's desire to see a Pan European Defence Force (which will never work - remember what happened in Bosnia before NATO took over) and the dismantling of NATO.


I despair, I really do. Let's slash and burn the Armed Forces, but let's keep committing them to ever increasing tasks (while increasing spending on overseas aid to countries with bigger forces than ourselves, let alone Nuclear programmes) but without funding them. I'm just glad I'm no longer Serving.


Those that are still Serving have my sympathy.

Seight_Returns

1,640 posts

200 months

Monday 13th June 2011
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Probably an obvious question given how events have panned out and talk of a P8 buy etc - but if the decision to cancel MR4A had come before the final MR2s were retired - would retaining the MR2 fleet have been an option ?

I know the last MR2s have all goen to museams etc - but is there any posibility of re-activating them ?

Mr Dave

3,233 posts

194 months

Monday 13th June 2011
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The whole fk-up of MRA4 is so unbelievable that you couldnt make it up.

What shocked me is when a friend who worked for BAe as an accountant told me that they got told about two weeks before the program was axed that they needed to provide an accurate costing for the completion of the airframes and a timescale for deliveries to the MOD and Government but then they just didnt bother.

They were so sure they wouldnt get axed that they thought they could just fob off those that were paying for it and expect to still get paid.

The UK is one of the countries where MRA aircraft and long range SAR are crucially important, yet we are the country that dont have any.

Harrier I can see as it was nice to have, Sentinal is nice to have, the carriers were nice to have, but Nimrods or something to fill that role is essential surely.

perdu

4,884 posts

198 months

Monday 13th June 2011
quotequote all
but then they just didnt bother.


Says it all if it is true

MOD has been a cash cow for so long the companies forget who is calling the shots.

But I am very angry at Camerclown's behaviour in power

He's a useless sod


I WANT TO BE DEFENDED CAMERON

get it?


And I do not want to defend any Asian or African or any American or Bloody European country first

Simples

cry

eharding

13,600 posts

283 months

Monday 13th June 2011
quotequote all
perdu said:
I WANT TO BE DEFENDED CAMERON
The question is, defended from what?

perdu

4,884 posts

198 months

Monday 13th June 2011
quotequote all
eharding said:
The question is, defended from what?
The answer is from any possible or likely direction

IF we spent what we have left on us for a change...

anonymous-user

53 months

Monday 13th June 2011
quotequote all
Seight_Returns said:
Probably an obvious question given how events have panned out and talk of a P8 buy etc - but if the decision to cancel MR4A had come before the final MR2s were retired - would retaining the MR2 fleet have been an option ?

I know the last MR2s have all goen to museams etc - but is there any posibility of re-activating them ?
No, there were only a few that went to museums, Coventry, Bruntingthorpe, Manchester, Elvington and one to the fire training school at Manston. One was supposed to be going to Cosford. The other MR2s were all scrapped at Kinloss about the same time as the MRA4's. The one on the gate at Kinloss is facing an uncertain future.

Some bits were removed from them when they were delivered. They would need extensive overhauls to get them back to airworthy status, I imagine a lot of the contracts with Rolls Royce and BAe Systems have now been terminated. Don't forget, I strongly believe one reason why the MRA4 was canned in the first place by "PR Man" Cameron was to bin the "Toxic" Nimrod name.

It was a high profile target that he thought he was going to be able to get "political points" with, when he stood up "willy waving" in parliament stating how expensive it was.

He is someone who would cut off his nose to spite his face. We do need the capability, and scrapping it, only to do a u-turn and then say we do need it (if these rumours are true) again just shows what a shambles this current Government is, just as bad as the previous one. How many cr@p decisions has Cameron made and had to u-turn on, once public opinion has kicked in.

In an ideal world I would say you should do your research, investigations, consultations, get feedback, analyse it, then make a decision and stick with it.
It seems like what this coalition is doing is research, make a decision ignoring concerns (as they they know best and everything can be blamed on Labour's time in power and the need to make savings regardless), make an announcement, public backlash, consulation, re-work, make revised decision/u-turn based on backlash. Doesn't inspire any confidence at all.

It is a shame regarding Nimrod, as it would have had 20+ years of useful service ahead of it, unlike Cameron, who in 5 years time will be out the door frown




Seight_Returns

1,640 posts

200 months

Tuesday 14th June 2011
quotequote all
Thanks, I thought wrongly that all the last MR2s went to museams, didn't know the majority of the MR2 frames had been scrapped as well as the MR4A.

So purely for hindsight's sake - if the decision to cancel MR4A has come before the MR2 retiremeny - could the MR2 fleet have been run on safely and effectively until a viable successor could be sourced ?

Yertis

18,016 posts

265 months

Tuesday 14th June 2011
quotequote all
roryfizz said:
+1

A man with a axe to grind..
I assume you're all referring Lions, Donkeys etc?

What's wrong with the book. Is it factually incorrect.


Yertis

18,016 posts

265 months

Tuesday 14th June 2011
quotequote all
Seight_Returns said:
could the MR2 fleet have been run on safely and effectively until a viable successor could be sourced ?
Read the XV230 inquest report and draw your own conclusions. frown

(no)

Well, I wouldn't have felt safe in one having read that anyway.