I'm after a powerboat equivalent of SOTW
Discussion
Would like a speedboat, under £1,000. Needs to carry at least two adults, two kids and be able to ski, but also cruise and use to sunbathe/use as a dive platform and fishing. Great if also able to use the bow to sit in. There's a few 70's/80's Fletchers on the Bay. Anything to look out for? Does GRP or whatever they're made of become brittle with age? Outboard vs Inboard? 2 stroke vs 4? As you can tell, Don't know much about boats, just after something for the family to use a couple of weeks a year..
Edited by Hazman123 on Sunday 27th August 21:42
The simple and most importantly safest answer, is no. Certainly not that would do all that, and still be safe and/reliable. I work in a boat dealer, and we get asked quite often for the same sort of thing. The cheapest usable boat that did come through was a 17ft speed boat that cane in part ex that my mate bought off us for 2k. But it was only that cheap as it was a gamble whether it would ever work again.it had partially sunk on it berth and in the end needed about £600-700 worth of bits plus I did most of the work for free just to get it running by reliably, plus my mate then did alot of 'tidying' to get it more presentable. If we had kept it and done the work and then sold it properly it would had been £5kish. But we were flat out busy at the time and it was easier to just pass it on.
At 1k, unless very lucky, youd be looking at something that's unreliable and therefore not ideal to be taking a family out in.
Sorry to shatter the dream, but boats really are not a cheap hobby.
At 1k, unless very lucky, youd be looking at something that's unreliable and therefore not ideal to be taking a family out in.
Sorry to shatter the dream, but boats really are not a cheap hobby.
Depends on your skills for repairing them. I've had a few sub £1k boats and jetskis, all bought as either non runners or projects. Bits are cheap so it's really your labour that is the issue. All sold quickly and easily for £1500+ once i had my fun, apart from the 2 kawasaki jetskis that grenaded themselves. Don't buy kawasaki jetskis, they are s
t.
So nope, you won't get a ready to use boat at that price, but plenty of viable projects if you don't mind getting your hands dirty.
I doubt you'll get one big enough to sunbathe on at that price though, and if you are that skint do you realise you can easily burn £100-150 of petrol and 2 stroke on a short day? They do single digit mpg, and if you go really nuts especially on a powerful 2 stroke you can go below 1 mpg. Gallons per mile never mind miles per gallon.
t.So nope, you won't get a ready to use boat at that price, but plenty of viable projects if you don't mind getting your hands dirty.
I doubt you'll get one big enough to sunbathe on at that price though, and if you are that skint do you realise you can easily burn £100-150 of petrol and 2 stroke on a short day? They do single digit mpg, and if you go really nuts especially on a powerful 2 stroke you can go below 1 mpg. Gallons per mile never mind miles per gallon.
Edited by OldGermanHeaps on Sunday 27th August 22:39
OK, thanks for replies, but I don't get negativity. What's the issue?
Do GRP hulls become weak with age? (I have certainly not heard of this size boat eg Fletchers(the only ones I'm familiar with) falling apart at sea),
If not, as long as you aren't going to sink, I don't see the issue.(I'm not going to be trying to cross the Channel)
Engines are, in my (car) experience as reliable as the amount of maintenance they are given.
There are plenty of 30 yo cars going strong that have many thousands of hours vs boats that have relatively few. Outboards I understand are bit more highly strung, but inboards difficult to work on, but quite simple, mechanically.
Re. The other comment, £s not the prevailing issue, but not that keen to spend £10k on something that might be used 2 weeks every year....
Do GRP hulls become weak with age? (I have certainly not heard of this size boat eg Fletchers(the only ones I'm familiar with) falling apart at sea),
If not, as long as you aren't going to sink, I don't see the issue.(I'm not going to be trying to cross the Channel)
Engines are, in my (car) experience as reliable as the amount of maintenance they are given.
There are plenty of 30 yo cars going strong that have many thousands of hours vs boats that have relatively few. Outboards I understand are bit more highly strung, but inboards difficult to work on, but quite simple, mechanically.
Re. The other comment, £s not the prevailing issue, but not that keen to spend £10k on something that might be used 2 weeks every year....
Edited by Hazman123 on Sunday 27th August 23:47
Boats live in the most hostile environment you can imagine compared to cars. For a start, in your price bracket, inboard or outboard will be raw water cooled. That means it sucks up water from whatever you put it in and passes it all around the engine. Plus, it goes through the manifolds, risers, all sorts of nooks and crannies and while that sounds bad enough running, when you switch it off, the salt inside your engine really gets to work. They rot from the inside out.
And then you have galvanic corrosion between different metal types chewing chunks of metal of the engine and leg away day by day. Rubber gaiters and bellows leak causing damage in the outdrive hearing and gimbals.. should I go in about mechanicals because that is the tip of the iceberg.
Fibreglass hates salt water. Any imperfections will take water into the matting and potentially cause osmosis if left in long enough, making the fiberglass very weak. Hammering and crashing through waves by people who generally buy at the bottom end of the market and know eff all about driving boats causes all sorts of issues with the structure of the boat, with cracking and delamination of structural elements following. Most craft of the type you are looking at have a fibreglass and wood sandwich floor which rots out too.
Electrics suffer badly too, as a car mechanic you will know how well petrol, spark and water mixes on HT, and then there is the rest of the wiring corroding away and all of those earths with nowhere close to go on a fibreglass tub. Royal pain on an aged boat.
So, imagine an aged car with massive mileage all of which has been done on beaches. There you have a boat that has been used at sea for your bag of sand.
I would spend more than that on safety kit, never mind the boat. If you do spend that kind of money, take a VHF license and join sea start, cos you will need it at some stage.
And then you have galvanic corrosion between different metal types chewing chunks of metal of the engine and leg away day by day. Rubber gaiters and bellows leak causing damage in the outdrive hearing and gimbals.. should I go in about mechanicals because that is the tip of the iceberg.
Fibreglass hates salt water. Any imperfections will take water into the matting and potentially cause osmosis if left in long enough, making the fiberglass very weak. Hammering and crashing through waves by people who generally buy at the bottom end of the market and know eff all about driving boats causes all sorts of issues with the structure of the boat, with cracking and delamination of structural elements following. Most craft of the type you are looking at have a fibreglass and wood sandwich floor which rots out too.
Electrics suffer badly too, as a car mechanic you will know how well petrol, spark and water mixes on HT, and then there is the rest of the wiring corroding away and all of those earths with nowhere close to go on a fibreglass tub. Royal pain on an aged boat.
So, imagine an aged car with massive mileage all of which has been done on beaches. There you have a boat that has been used at sea for your bag of sand.
I would spend more than that on safety kit, never mind the boat. If you do spend that kind of money, take a VHF license and join sea start, cos you will need it at some stage.
I'll echo an above poster, plenty of fun projects around for about £1k, I've had a few, both motored and sailing. All have been outboards, none have had properly running outboards on purchase. The best I've had is a Shetland 16ft fishing boat with a Mercury 60hp outboard, picked up the boat, trailer and motor for a hair over a grand all in, the 60hp motor was likely far to much for the hull but was great fun as it would climb onto the plane plenty good, big enough cabin for kids, I slept in it a couple of times.
I had that for a year, repainted it, fitted a basic interior (it was bare when I bought it), engine took a bit of fettling to get it running smooth, sold it on to a local old guy for about 2k looking considerably less grubby than it was when I bought it.
As another poster mentioned, safety kit might be a worry, personally I've always coped with little more than a bargain basement life jacket but if your taking your kids out maybe a little more is required, but that is entirely your own judgement.
I had that for a year, repainted it, fitted a basic interior (it was bare when I bought it), engine took a bit of fettling to get it running smooth, sold it on to a local old guy for about 2k looking considerably less grubby than it was when I bought it.
As another poster mentioned, safety kit might be a worry, personally I've always coped with little more than a bargain basement life jacket but if your taking your kids out maybe a little more is required, but that is entirely your own judgement.
caelite said:
I'll echo an above poster, plenty of fun projects around for about £1k, I've had a few, both motored and sailing. All have been outboards, none have had properly running outboards on purchase. The best I've had is a Shetland 16ft fishing boat with a Mercury 60hp outboard, picked up the boat, trailer and motor for a hair over a grand all in, the 60hp motor was likely far to much for the hull but was great fun as it would climb onto the plane plenty good, big enough cabin for kids, I slept in it a couple of times.
I had that for a year, repainted it, fitted a basic interior (it was bare when I bought it), engine took a bit of fettling to get it running smooth, sold it on to a local old guy for about 2k looking considerably less grubby than it was when I bought it.
As another poster mentioned, safety kit might be a worry, personally I've always coped with little more than a bargain basement life jacket but if your taking your kids out maybe a little more is required, but that is entirely your own judgement.
Aye a small boat with a big engine can be fun. I swapped a 35hp evinrude out for a 100hp mercury on a small speedboat with a few mods to the transom and steering, it was a hairy thing to drive, a mixture of terror and hilarity.I had that for a year, repainted it, fitted a basic interior (it was bare when I bought it), engine took a bit of fettling to get it running smooth, sold it on to a local old guy for about 2k looking considerably less grubby than it was when I bought it.
As another poster mentioned, safety kit might be a worry, personally I've always coped with little more than a bargain basement life jacket but if your taking your kids out maybe a little more is required, but that is entirely your own judgement.
And as mentioned don’t forget a seastart subscription as you will be getting towed in at some point.
It’s amazing how busy the coastguard get on a sunny day with calls for broken down speedboats. For the RNLI speedboats are their biggest tasking per year. The reason, people only use a boat a couple of times a year so as soon as they get half a mile out to sea something will conk out and then you’re drifting with kids and a panicked wife on board.
It’s amazing how busy the coastguard get on a sunny day with calls for broken down speedboats. For the RNLI speedboats are their biggest tasking per year. The reason, people only use a boat a couple of times a year so as soon as they get half a mile out to sea something will conk out and then you’re drifting with kids and a panicked wife on board.
Obviously 3 x the amount you want to spend, but this looks perfect
https://www.gumtree.com/p/boats-kayaks-jet-skis/da...
for what you describe.
is there any way you can up the budget, come September these boats get cheaper usually - winter storage is a pain.
https://www.gumtree.com/p/boats-kayaks-jet-skis/da...
for what you describe.
is there any way you can up the budget, come September these boats get cheaper usually - winter storage is a pain.
I think 3-4 times the budget will get you much more than 3-4 times the boat. Boats don't depreciate like cars, so even though there is more upfront cost you will get this back ultimately.
4 decent lifejackets, a radio , toolkit, fenders, skis, ski rope, toys, charts / chart plotter, more likely to get these included if you spend a bit more money. I would seriously look at rya level 2 and a vhf license. Not compulsory, but if you have no prior experience and a taking kids out...
If you are on a budget, don't think a day on a boat will be cheap. A rule of thumb is a gallon per 10hp used per hour, for a well tuned 4 stroke. A tired 70s two stroke will be thirstier. You'll be looking at least a tenner launching fee, plus possibly parking. A lot of places will only let you launch with your own vehicle if it is a 4x4, so you may have to pay a supplement if you don't have one.
I don't think anyone is trying to put a downer on it. Boating is a wonderful thing, but certainly worth going into with your eyes open with regards to costs and safety.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GLASTRON-17SX-BOWRIDER-S...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Aquapro-RIB-Alloy-hull-5...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/speedboat-sport-power-bo...
4 decent lifejackets, a radio , toolkit, fenders, skis, ski rope, toys, charts / chart plotter, more likely to get these included if you spend a bit more money. I would seriously look at rya level 2 and a vhf license. Not compulsory, but if you have no prior experience and a taking kids out...
If you are on a budget, don't think a day on a boat will be cheap. A rule of thumb is a gallon per 10hp used per hour, for a well tuned 4 stroke. A tired 70s two stroke will be thirstier. You'll be looking at least a tenner launching fee, plus possibly parking. A lot of places will only let you launch with your own vehicle if it is a 4x4, so you may have to pay a supplement if you don't have one.
I don't think anyone is trying to put a downer on it. Boating is a wonderful thing, but certainly worth going into with your eyes open with regards to costs and safety.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/GLASTRON-17SX-BOWRIDER-S...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Aquapro-RIB-Alloy-hull-5...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/speedboat-sport-power-bo...
Edited by CubanPete on Tuesday 29th August 12:36
Yup doing it properly and safely ain't cheap. Don't take the responsibility lightly or even try to kid yourself otherwise.
I drive a RIB for a organisation taking Yoofs out in the Thames estuary for leadership and navigation exercises and some basic seamanship as well as a bit of creek crawling and wildlife spotting. It gets out quite a bit and does a lot of miles each year which is the most effective way of keep a older boat reliable and running well as infrequent use or chronic neglect will kill one - and quite possibly you too - quicker than anything else.
Full loaded with a 60HP 4 stroke I passage plan on minimum fuel burn of 4 l/h at idle and drifting, 12 l/h planing at best economic and 28 l/h at max Spankage. That's at marina pump prices so the fuel bill for topping the tank after a day out often goes way north of £80. So far this season even with a fair bit of DIY going on we've spent nearly a grand on maintenance and repairs and several hundred more on insurance and mooring fees.
If you don't know anything yet then RYA PB2 is the minimum paper qualification for an introduction to powerboating safely and you'll get a few hours out on the water on the course too but that's absolutely no substitute at all for experience. Nobody should rely on mobile phones for anything at sea so you'll need a marine DSC VHF operating license too.
Experience means you'll understand out in the real world and not on a exam paper in a nice warm classroom things like local conditions and rules of the road and you'll know exactly where you are and be able to navigate to exactly where you want to be without any electronics whatsoever and be acutely aware of weather, wind, water depth and tidal set and how they all combine to work for and against you.
To go to sea in a powerboat safely you'll need lifejackets and proper waterproofs for everybody, all the flares you can carry, engine spares and filters, at least two fire extinguishers, a replacement propeller and shear pin as well as the tools to fit them, paddles for everyone on board, a anchor, at least two spare kill cords, two VHF radios - one with it's own internal battery, two bilge pumps - one electric one manual - and a life ring and tow rope and first aid kit. Ideally you'll have two engines fed by two entirely separate fuel systems as well as a Bosuns box full of useful odds and ends like gaffa tape, WD40, fuses, spare fuel tank caps, lengths of wire, shackles, tie wraps, a puncture repair kit and tube pump if you're on a RIB and any other repair type stuff you might suddenly need.
So no, the nautical equivalent of SOTW is a pretty bad idea IMO.
I drive a RIB for a organisation taking Yoofs out in the Thames estuary for leadership and navigation exercises and some basic seamanship as well as a bit of creek crawling and wildlife spotting. It gets out quite a bit and does a lot of miles each year which is the most effective way of keep a older boat reliable and running well as infrequent use or chronic neglect will kill one - and quite possibly you too - quicker than anything else.
Full loaded with a 60HP 4 stroke I passage plan on minimum fuel burn of 4 l/h at idle and drifting, 12 l/h planing at best economic and 28 l/h at max Spankage. That's at marina pump prices so the fuel bill for topping the tank after a day out often goes way north of £80. So far this season even with a fair bit of DIY going on we've spent nearly a grand on maintenance and repairs and several hundred more on insurance and mooring fees.
If you don't know anything yet then RYA PB2 is the minimum paper qualification for an introduction to powerboating safely and you'll get a few hours out on the water on the course too but that's absolutely no substitute at all for experience. Nobody should rely on mobile phones for anything at sea so you'll need a marine DSC VHF operating license too.
Experience means you'll understand out in the real world and not on a exam paper in a nice warm classroom things like local conditions and rules of the road and you'll know exactly where you are and be able to navigate to exactly where you want to be without any electronics whatsoever and be acutely aware of weather, wind, water depth and tidal set and how they all combine to work for and against you.
To go to sea in a powerboat safely you'll need lifejackets and proper waterproofs for everybody, all the flares you can carry, engine spares and filters, at least two fire extinguishers, a replacement propeller and shear pin as well as the tools to fit them, paddles for everyone on board, a anchor, at least two spare kill cords, two VHF radios - one with it's own internal battery, two bilge pumps - one electric one manual - and a life ring and tow rope and first aid kit. Ideally you'll have two engines fed by two entirely separate fuel systems as well as a Bosuns box full of useful odds and ends like gaffa tape, WD40, fuses, spare fuel tank caps, lengths of wire, shackles, tie wraps, a puncture repair kit and tube pump if you're on a RIB and any other repair type stuff you might suddenly need.
So no, the nautical equivalent of SOTW is a pretty bad idea IMO.
Simpo Two said:
You're not selling it 
I had a 21ft powerboat for a few years - did the exams etc but can honestly say I found it stressful.We were based off North Wales and I found the weather just too unpredictable and it's amazing how isolated you can feel just a few minutes cruising.
The final straw was when we got caught in a completely unforecast squall and got back after a very stressful half hour. Got back to our place to hear about the family on the south coast that got killed when they got hit by their own boat after falling out.
Thanks everyone, esp seefive, just the sort of info I'm after. Yes, my intention to buy over the winter when they may be cheaper, just doing preliminary research. Storage is no issue, and safety wise, I'll be out in it with friends in quite a few other boats, so we would not be on our own.
Information is power. My boat is inland so not faced with nearly so many hazards but it was still quite a step on from a car. Take your time, do your research and get a good one. Even if it costs more, which it will, you shouldn't lose in depreciation. If you get it right you'll have a great time 
Every boat I've seen for that sort of money is something I wouldn't touch with a bargepole, let alone risk taking my family out in.
It's amazing how much more you get for a bit more money and I'd suggest that £2K would be the lowest you'd want to spend and that you would want to be unbelievably careful when searching.
There are some massive bargains out there though, especially at the end of the season. For example, I picked up my 5.45M RIB with a low hours Honda 90 outboard on it for just over £4K including a great trailer, superb mooring and the ability to wallop the previous owner around the head in the Yacht Club bar if anything went wrong.
Sometimes people just want rid of something they aren't using and the ownership liabilities are more than the value of the boat. So you can pick up some stunning bargains. Sailing club and Yacht club notice boards are prime places to find interesting and cheap boats that are more likely to have been looked after than a Gumtree special.
If you haven't got much experience on the water, then get some training, things can go horribly wrong out there very quickly and easily and too many people come a cropper because of simple things. Don't treat a boat like a car, where if it goes bang, you just coast to the side of the road and wait for help. If your engine goes bang out on the water, things can turn nasty very quickly, especially if there is any kind of sea running.
It's amazing how much more you get for a bit more money and I'd suggest that £2K would be the lowest you'd want to spend and that you would want to be unbelievably careful when searching.
There are some massive bargains out there though, especially at the end of the season. For example, I picked up my 5.45M RIB with a low hours Honda 90 outboard on it for just over £4K including a great trailer, superb mooring and the ability to wallop the previous owner around the head in the Yacht Club bar if anything went wrong.
Sometimes people just want rid of something they aren't using and the ownership liabilities are more than the value of the boat. So you can pick up some stunning bargains. Sailing club and Yacht club notice boards are prime places to find interesting and cheap boats that are more likely to have been looked after than a Gumtree special.
If you haven't got much experience on the water, then get some training, things can go horribly wrong out there very quickly and easily and too many people come a cropper because of simple things. Don't treat a boat like a car, where if it goes bang, you just coast to the side of the road and wait for help. If your engine goes bang out on the water, things can turn nasty very quickly, especially if there is any kind of sea running.
If you are looking to use the boat in the same area, there are many boat "clubs" or share schemes which appear to offer access to boats (typically with prerequisite powerboat level 2 and vhf qualifications) around the country.
This is reported to give you access to a newer, well maintained and more reliable boat with no maintenance / storage issues for a fixed monthly fee. I have no association or experience with any of them, but with a limited purchase budget, I would probably do a little research in that area - the truth is your grand purchase price will quickly expand annually if you want to keep the boat usable and safe for your family.
Some subscriptions I found with a quick google search start as low as £75 a month, but I guess that would be quite limited access. Also I guess like similar supercar schemes, there are risks which require a little due diligence of the company to protect your annual subscription up front...
Maybe worth a look as maintenance on a boat of a certain age can be extremely high - even DIY. And you will probably enjoy and definitely benefit from a PB2 course too. Of course if you are trailing your own boat, you can flush the engine and leg when back at home which helps reduce any new corrosion - I had a large barrel I would drop the engine into and fast hose specifically to do this when I had a Merc 50 outboard powered boat longer ago than I would care to remember. No engine problems at all, but it was a new engine from the start and always got that treatment. No everyone is quite as diligent over the years...
While not wanting to be a doom merchant, I remember my dad's statement about boat safety. " The sea rarely looks to take prisoners, it tends to play for keeps". So a reliable craft with adequate safety features, and knowing its (and your) capabilities are key to not having an enjoyable day with family and friends turn to disaster very quickly.
This is reported to give you access to a newer, well maintained and more reliable boat with no maintenance / storage issues for a fixed monthly fee. I have no association or experience with any of them, but with a limited purchase budget, I would probably do a little research in that area - the truth is your grand purchase price will quickly expand annually if you want to keep the boat usable and safe for your family.
Some subscriptions I found with a quick google search start as low as £75 a month, but I guess that would be quite limited access. Also I guess like similar supercar schemes, there are risks which require a little due diligence of the company to protect your annual subscription up front...
Maybe worth a look as maintenance on a boat of a certain age can be extremely high - even DIY. And you will probably enjoy and definitely benefit from a PB2 course too. Of course if you are trailing your own boat, you can flush the engine and leg when back at home which helps reduce any new corrosion - I had a large barrel I would drop the engine into and fast hose specifically to do this when I had a Merc 50 outboard powered boat longer ago than I would care to remember. No engine problems at all, but it was a new engine from the start and always got that treatment. No everyone is quite as diligent over the years...
While not wanting to be a doom merchant, I remember my dad's statement about boat safety. " The sea rarely looks to take prisoners, it tends to play for keeps". So a reliable craft with adequate safety features, and knowing its (and your) capabilities are key to not having an enjoyable day with family and friends turn to disaster very quickly.
Edited by SeeFive on Tuesday 29th August 11:37
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