The best 40 to 50ft Yacht

[CarbonXKR]

Thinking of something different for retirement and a fine way to spend a portion of the lump sum. Any yachting members here recommend a good ocean going yacht? Budget around £70k. Been looking at Benetau Cyclades 43 but what else is good?

[SimonTheSailor]

Is it actually for crossing oceans or for coastal cruising ?

Properly spec'd up blue water yachts can go into the hundreds of thousands !!

[CarbonXKR]

Ocean and coastal. I don't want a new one and there are loads of Benetau at 60 to 80k but want to know what else is out there for that money.

[NickCQ]

To be honest I would not recommend going ocean sailing on a £70k probably ex charter Beneteau that has spent its life being run aground on coral reefs.

The volume brands (Jeanneau, Hanse, Benne etc) all operate in a competitive market and the cost pressure is evident in the build quality (or lack thereof).

The best way to do this if your budget is only £70k is to find something solid that someone else has spent a lot of money prepping for an ARC. The model of boat itself is less relevant here than the condition.

[NickCQ]

I like this
https://www.yachtworld.co.uk/boats/1990/amel-santo...

[NickCQ]

I don’t like this
https://www.yachtworld.co.uk/boats/2007/bavaria-46...

[CarbonXKR]

NickCQ said:

To be honest I would not recommend going ocean sailing on a £70k probably ex charter Beneteau that has spent its life being run aground on coral reefs.

The volume brands (Jeanneau, Hanse, Benne etc) all operate in a competitive market and the cost pressure is evident in the build quality (or lack thereof).

The best way to do this if your budget is only £70k is to find something solid that someone else has spent a lot of money prepping for an ARC. The model of boat itself is less relevant here than the condition.

Thanks for the heads up, I'm grateful for any suggestions.

[SimonTheSailor]

The Amels are good boats, designed to be sailed around the world. I believe they were made in one piece so mega strong. Think the newer models aren't quite the same since old man Amel passed away and now accountants are building the boats.

I spent 11 months on a Super Maramu and would do so again.

I didn't want to put you off but as has been said above all that Bavaria/Beneatu stuff is made with cost in mind, lightweight flimsy stuff where cupboards don't open depending on which way the boat is heeled. Ok for the med coastal hopping.

[CarbonXKR]

SimonTheSailor said:

The Amels are good boats, designed to be sailed around the world. I believe they were made in one piece so mega strong. Think the newer models aren't quite the same since old man Amel passed away and now accountants are building the boats.

I spent 11 months on a Super Maramu and would do so again.

I didn't want to put you off but as has been said above all that Bavaria/Beneatu stuff is made with cost in mind, lightweight flimsy stuff where cupboards don't open depending on which way the boat is heeled. Ok for the med coastal hopping.

I think I might need a bigger lump sum! Wow big difference in price so the quality must be better in the Amel. All around the £200k mark on Yachtworld

[tankplanker]

I agree with Nick, avoid anything mass market if you plan on actually sailing on the boat, particularly the newer models as their build quality has noticeably dropped over the years. I'd rather buy an old Bavaria Match that hasn't been chartered and has been well looked after than any of the newer boats.

Do you actually plan on making the big passages yourself? Or are you open to having the boat shipped between locations? The latter is usually more cost effective than the former. I'd equate proper ocean passages to regular hard track work in a car in that they both need proper TLC before and afterwards.

I'd add Rustler to the Amel if you do want an ocean cruiser, although you'd have to go smaller than 40' to get a good one in your budget.

Having the boat shipped means you could get a cheaper mass market boat as you'd only ever be pootling around on it.

[XJSJohn]

lots of Q's for that, some already asked.

for ocean crossings or coastal cruising?

where, staying in northern europe? The med? the carribean? south pacific? SE Asia? round the world?

would you be staying in warmer latitudes or be interested in cruising the upper ends of the globe?

just you and your spouse or would you be looking for other crew?

does your budget / lifestyle dream involve spending significant time in marina's or anchored off in remote locations?

what is your sailing experience?

what is your maintenance experience (fibreglass, wood, steel, engines, rigging, electrics etc)

what additional budget do you have for fit-out?


remember - BOAT - bring out another thousand.

[XJSJohn]

SimonTheSailor said:

The Amels are good boats, designed to be sailed around the world. I believe they were made in one piece so mega strong. Think the newer models aren't quite the same since old man Amel passed away and now accountants are building the boats.

I spent 11 months on a Super Maramu and would do so again.

I didn't want to put you off but as has been said above all that Bavaria/Beneatu stuff is made with cost in mind, lightweight flimsy stuff where cupboards don't open depending on which way the boat is heeled. Ok for the med coastal hopping.

Amels are fantastic RTW'ers but there are multiple examples of most production cruisers and even cruiser racers off sailing around the world very successfully and very happily, it just depends on the extremes you are going to go to, and the level of risk you are comfortable with.

There are several FB groups for cruisers with lots of info, and unsurprisingly lots of opinions, and as we all know, everyone has opinions, they all also have aholes ...

[pequod]

If blue water cruising is what you are planning, then one of these would fit the bill, IMO, and was on my list.

https://www.boatshed.com/hans_christian_43-boat-24...

[XJSJohn]

pequod said:

If blue water cruising is what you are planning, then one of these would fit the bill, IMO, and was on my list.

https://www.boatshed.com/hans_christian_43-boat-24...

great for the offshore bit, hell when you get somewhere exotic like the carib / asia as they are designed to keep the water out (and therefore the breeze too), also they like lot sof weather, again once you get to your exotic location you will be doing a lot of engine work or a lot of drifting in 5 to 8kts wind, which then puts burden on your fuel / water / food supplies

its all about getting teh balance.

[XJSJohn]

tankplanker said:

Do you actually plan on making the big passages yourself? Or are you open to having the boat shipped between locations? The latter is usually more cost effective than the former. I'd equate proper ocean passages to regular hard track work in a car in that they both need proper TLC before and afterwards.

this is a good idea and opens up a lot more options.

Shipping your yacht on a dockwise or similar isnt that much different in price to the wear on the boat, sails, rigging, food and fuel consumption and the yard time for making good once you have finished your ocean crossing.

Again for SE Asia, alot of people are doing this out here now.

[pequod]

XJSJohn said:

pequod said:

If blue water cruising is what you are planning, then one of these would fit the bill, IMO, and was on my list.

https://www.boatshed.com/hans_christian_43-boat-24...

great for the offshore bit, hell when you get somewhere exotic like the carib / asia as they are designed to keep the water out (and therefore the breeze too), also they like lot sof weather, again once you get to your exotic location you will be doing a lot of engine work or a lot of drifting in 5 to 8kts wind, which then puts burden on your fuel / water / food supplies

its all about getting teh balance.

Oh, I agree with what you say, and it will depend on priorities/intended cruising area the OP is considering and, as with all boats, there is always a compromise to be made but I would want a boat capable of crossing oceans is some safety and comfort.

As for sailing in 5-8 kts of wind, which 40-50 ft blue water boat is able to make good progress in those light airs?

[XJSJohn]

pequod said:

XJSJohn said:

pequod said:

If blue water cruising is what you are planning, then one of these would fit the bill, IMO, and was on my list.

https://www.boatshed.com/hans_christian_43-boat-24...

great for the offshore bit, hell when you get somewhere exotic like the carib / asia as they are designed to keep the water out (and therefore the breeze too), also they like lot sof weather, again once you get to your exotic location you will be doing a lot of engine work or a lot of drifting in 5 to 8kts wind, which then puts burden on your fuel / water / food supplies

its all about getting teh balance.

Oh, I agree with what you say, and it will depend on priorities/intended cruising area the OP is considering and, as with all boats, there is always a compromise to be made but I would want a boat capable of crossing oceans is some safety and comfort.

As for sailing in 5-8 kts of wind, which 40-50 ft blue water boat is able to make good progress in those light airs?

its all relative, bit having done a hell of a lot of sailing in SE Asia, there is a hell of a difference between that Hans Christiansen and say a beneteau to go to the other end of the spectrum. its also a lot harder work trying to make any way through the water and a lot more dangerous if you are struggling to make steerage etc. seen many of these big bluewater yachts up on reefs because they couldn't make the heading that they needed to with a wind v current situation that the more modern lighter cruisers were able to hold. (and if you have been going through that for a week or two your fuel situation may be a bit limited.

[CarbonXKR]

XJSJohn said:

lots of Q's for that, some already asked.

for ocean crossings or coastal cruising?

where, staying in northern europe? The med? the carribean? south pacific? SE Asia? round the world?

would you be staying in warmer latitudes or be interested in cruising the upper ends of the globe?

just you and your spouse or would you be looking for other crew?

does your budget / lifestyle dream involve spending significant time in marina's or anchored off in remote locations?

what is your sailing experience?

what is your maintenance experience (fibreglass, wood, steel, engines, rigging, electrics etc)

what additional budget do you have for fit-out?


remember - BOAT - bring out another thousand.

for ocean crossings or coastal cruising?

Bit of both depending on the health come retirement. It's pretty good just now but you never know...

where, staying in northern europe? The med? the carribean? south pacific? SE Asia? round the world?

Canaries, Cabo Verde, Carribean...

would you be staying in warmer latitudes or be interested in cruising the upper ends of the globe?

Would likely stick to warmer climes

just you and your spouse or would you be looking for other crew?

Me and the missus....

does your budget / lifestyle dream involve spending significant time in marina's or anchored off in remote locations?

Anchored rather than marinas...

what is your sailing experience?

20 years skipper of various size fishing boats up to 26m, sailing not so much....

what is your maintenance experience (fibreglass, wood, steel, engines, rigging, electrics etc)

Engines, electrics general maintenance all okay. Have Class 2 Fishing engineering and lots of own maintenance....

what additional budget do you have for fit-out?

£10 - 20k

[Cheeky Jim]

NickCQ said:

I don’t like this
https://www.yachtworld.co.uk/boats/2007/bavaria-46...

I've spent quite a bit of time on an identical Bavaria 46.... if that's the state of the teak on the deck, I'd be questioning the maintenance levels.... first impressions etc.

(and the one I spent time on (it was a private 2 owner boat, not a charter) was sold for at least £10k less than this is advertised and was in exceptional condition).

But from my limited experience, as others have already pointed out... proper blue water vs coastal hopping is a big difference... for practicalities alone, how much fuel, water, food storage do you have, do you want to be close to marina's etc... never mind the actual sailing aspects.

[tankplanker]

XJSJohn said:

its all relative, bit having done a hell of a lot of sailing in SE Asia, there is a hell of a difference between that Hans Christiansen and say a beneteau to go to the other end of the spectrum. its also a lot harder work trying to make any way through the water and a lot more dangerous if you are struggling to make steerage etc. seen many of these big bluewater yachts up on reefs because they couldn't make the heading that they needed to with a wind v current situation that the more modern lighter cruisers were able to hold. (and if you have been going through that for a week or two your fuel situation may be a bit limited.

Modern cruisers are big old fatties as the beam and equipment levels have crept up over the years. A '90s 45 should be about 3 tons lighter (or about 1/4th) than a brand new equivalent of same length. Obviously you get far more space on the new boat so its not quite a fair comparison. The new boats would be even heavier if they weren't made out of that particle (?) foam board stuff that they stick a cheap veneer to rather than the "proper" wood you get in an older boat or a quality modern boat like a Discovery or Amel or Rustler that has actual from a named tree wood.

I wouldn't buy any of the new mass market boats for myself for anything other than to charter it out and I've been on a few of them, all under 24 months old, in the last couple of years. Some of them have had dreadful sailing ability as well as they are setup for easy of sailing, getting somewhere in 8 knots is painfully slow.