Final two BA 747s Leaving Heathrow for the Last Time

[smack]

aeropilot said:

The RB211's are all been pulled asap......wonder where they are going, as there are not many RB211 freighter 747's being operated......might still be some 757's knocking about with them fitted so could have some value as spares, and BA will be trying to get as much back from these as poss I would imagine in the current climate.

Cargolux

757 RB211's are not interchangeable with the model used on the 747/767's, which themselves only differ in the engine mounts. BA kept the engines off their 767 when they retired, and swapped parts so they could fit their 747's. Although 767's are in demand for cargo conversions, no one wanted oddball RR powered ones. External parts might be interchangeable, such as gearboxes, but any work that needs for a strip down/overhaul, would need to be done by a MRO, which there are not that many are RB211 certified. BA outsourced their overhauls to GE in Wales (years ago BA did it all in house), which did their last overhaul some time ago, and BA had planned that was enough to get them to 2024, pulling all the engines as aircraft retired to keep the rest flying.
GE have been wanting to wash their hands of the RB211 work, as they have enough on their plate with GE90 and GEnx problems to deal with.

[Dr Jekyll]

Must admit I did briefly wonder if they'd removed the engines to discourage joyriders.

[abzmike]

So will these planes be broken up at these locations? Presumably if they are to go anywhere else they would need engines reattached, which seems like quite a lot of agro? Or are the engines leased from RR or suchlike and taken away to immediatley save cost?

[smack]

abzmike said:

So will these planes be broken up at these locations? Presumably if they are to go anywhere else they would need engines reattached, which seems like quite a lot of agro? Or are the engines leased from RR or suchlike and taken away to immediatley save cost?

BA own the engines/airframes for the 747's, and are losing money every day, so selling them is some much needed income. On other fleets such as the A320's, it is a mixture of leased and owned. These days new aircraft are mostly leased, as an example of their A380 fleet, IIRC 2 are owned of the 12 they have.

Re-attaching engines isn't a big deal, but if they have to fly anywhere, they probably will need a hanger visit before they can fly. All the 747's at Heathrow had sat around too long and needed to be re certified before they made their last flights, even if a short one to the chop shop.

[aeropilot]

smack said:

aeropilot said:

The RB211's are all been pulled asap......wonder where they are going, as there are not many RB211 freighter 747's being operated......might still be some 757's knocking about with them fitted so could have some value as spares, and BA will be trying to get as much back from these as poss I would imagine in the current climate.

Cargolux

757 RB211's are not interchangeable with the model used on the 747/767's, which themselves only differ in the engine mounts. BA kept the engines off their 767 when they retired, and swapped parts so they could fit their 747's. Although 767's are in demand for cargo conversions, no one wanted oddball RR powered ones. External parts might be interchangeable, such as gearboxes, but any work that needs for a strip down/overhaul, would need to be done by a MRO, which there are not that many are RB211 certified. BA outsourced their overhauls to GE in Wales (years ago BA did it all in house), which did their last overhaul some time ago, and BA had planned that was enough to get them to 2024, pulling all the engines as aircraft retired to keep the rest flying.
GE have been wanting to wash their hands of the RB211 work, as they have enough on their plate with GE90 and GEnx problems to deal with.

Sorry yes, its the 767 not the 757......my ageing mind had 757 in my mind from the post the other day about Delta still having a huge 757 fleet........and my fingers just typed that instead.
Anyway, so Cargolux have a RB engined cargo fleet then.......that makes sense then, as they are obviously going somewhere and have value otherwise they wouldn't have been pulled so quickly.
I well remember when BA did their engine stuff in-house, like so many other things they all did in-house back in the old days.

[aeropilot]

There's a rumour that one of the BA 747 (G-CIVZ) currently at Cardiff since late March, will be departing Cardiff tomorrow to make what will likely be its final flight the short distance down to Newquay Airport for presumably scrapping at the small dismantling facility there.

[Johnnybee]

aeropilot said:

There's a rumour that one of the BA 747 (G-CIVZ) currently at Cardiff since late March, will be departing Cardiff tomorrow to make what will likely be its final flight the short distance down to Newquay Airport for presumably scrapping at the small dismantling facility there.

It arrived today according to FlghtRadar.

[aeropilot]

Johnnybee said:

aeropilot said:

There's a rumour that one of the BA 747 (G-CIVZ) currently at Cardiff since late March, will be departing Cardiff tomorrow to make what will likely be its final flight the short distance down to Newquay Airport for presumably scrapping at the small dismantling facility there.

It arrived today according to FlghtRadar.

Rumour is it won't be the only one either.

[Fuzzy69r]

It’s certainly a sad sight seeing these fly for the last time, was lucky enough to fly to and from Houston in a BA747 for work and it will always be etched in my memory, just hoping that once things get back to a bit of sane normality that I can get my wee boy onto a 747 flight while they still remain

[Magnum 475]

Fuzzy69r said:

It’s certainly a sad sight seeing these fly for the last time, was lucky enough to fly to and from Houston in a BA747 for work and it will always be etched in my memory, just hoping that once things get back to a bit of sane normality that I can get my wee boy onto a 747 flight while they still remain

Lufthansa are still flying some routes with the 747-800. They might keep these for a while as they're still relatively new.

[aeropilot]

Magnum 475 said:

Fuzzy69r said:

It’s certainly a sad sight seeing these fly for the last time, was lucky enough to fly to and from Houston in a BA747 for work and it will always be etched in my memory, just hoping that once things get back to a bit of sane normality that I can get my wee boy onto a 747 flight while they still remain

Lufthansa are still flying some routes with the 747-800. They might keep these for a while as they're still relatively new.

Korean Air were prior to Covid still operating their 747-8's in and out of Heathrow on a regular basis as well, they were pretty much with Lufthansa the only two airlines that bought the pax 747-8 that fly to Europe. Air China bought some as well, but don't know if they operate there's to Europe or not.

[anonymous-user]

Looks like another last flight

https://mediacentre.britishairways.com/news/221020...

[aeropilot]

El stovey said:

Looks like another last flight

https://mediacentre.britishairways.com/news/221020...

Given the still uncertain future surrounding Dunsfold, I wouldn't be using the term preserved in regards that 747..!

Clearly it's replacing the old 200 series 747 with the modified engine nacelles that can be seen in the background of every bit of Top Gear track filming since the early 2000's.

[Halmyre]

From what I've heard about pilots, I imagine flying 4-engine jets gives you the rights to swagger it over 2-engine pilots. Is this going to be a thing of the past, and will pilots get counselling for it?

[MrBig]

Thanks for the fascinating thread everyone. I dearly love the 747 as it was a symbol of going on holiday stateside for a proper adventure for me as a kid in the late 80's and early 90's. Always wanted to upstairs on one and tried desperately to upgrade on my last flight on one (Vegas in late 2018) but business and first were both full

I'm seriously considering jumping in the car at the weekend and taking a drive down to Kemble to show my sons the fleet of jumbos sat there (assuming I'm still allowed to do that?!?)

I'm very fortunate in that air travel for me and my kids is now normalised. The magic isn't there any more, but for me, the 747 will always be a reminder that it once was.

[anonymous-user]

Halmyre said:

From what I've heard about pilots, I imagine flying 4-engine jets gives you the rights to swagger it over 2-engine pilots. Is this going to be a thing of the past, and will pilots get counselling for it?

To a certain extent.

The 747s though are usually a bit old and knackered and long haul can be done on all the big twins nowadays.

I’d say more people want to be on the newer aircraft than a larger older one, depending on route structure etc.

Traditionally being on an old fleet that’s winding down is great as your work slowly dwindles and then you move onto a new fleet, you often end up in a sweet spot of getting paid to not do much.

The trouble is though, and that as covid has shown, if something goes badly wrong and large scale cutbacks are needed, some airlines just get rid of the pilots on that fleet when it gets phased out if they’ve got too many pilots. Rather than using seniority (as was the custom) or some new seniority biased redundancy matrix.

My view has always been to make myself as redundancy proof as possible whilst maintaining the best possible work life balance.

Some people are definitely really into this though and fiercely defend their own fleet, in airlines you often get mini cultures forming in different fleets and you sometimes hear cabin crew (who tend to operate on more types) saying the B123 pilots are a bit odd or the B456 pilots are weirdos etc.

My brother flies a smaller aircraft than me and he’s definitely jealous. You can just tell.

[anonymous-user]

MrBig said:

Thanks for the fascinating thread everyone. I dearly love the 747 as it was a symbol of going on holiday stateside for a proper adventure for me as a kid in the late 80's and early 90's. Always wanted to upstairs on one and tried desperately to upgrade on my last flight on one (Vegas in late 2018) but business and first were both full

I'm seriously considering jumping in the car at the weekend and taking a drive down to Kemble to show my sons the fleet of jumbos sat there (assuming I'm still allowed to do that?!?)

I'm very fortunate in that air travel for me and my kids is now normalised. The magic isn't there any more, but for me, the 747 will always be a reminder that it once was.

My kids still get excited about flying, especially if it’s with my airline.

I constantly tell them about what goes wrong or some details about the pilots that are taking us on holiday if I know them. It helps keep them scared the magic alive.

My colleague did a rather firm landing with my family and I on board the other day. After the flight we visited the flight deck and he went into great detail about why his landing “Was so st”

Although my kids know all the ‘bad words’ it wasn’t the sort of thing you’d normally hear over a PA.

Again magical insights that they’ll tell their kids about when planes are automated or just banned.

[595Heaven]

MrBig said:

I'm seriously considering jumping in the car at the weekend and taking a drive down to Kemble to show my sons the fleet of jumbos sat there (assuming I'm still allowed to do that?!?)

I think non essential travel is ‘discouraged’ rather than totally banned from Thursday, but I guess they will clarify the rules in the next day or so.

I’d had the same idea, and am planning a trip on Wednesday as I’m off all week and the weather looks good.

Shame the 747 era is over - what a machine. We got lucky several years ago and were upgraded to Club on a flight to the USA, sitting just behind the nose.

[MrBig]

El stovey said:

My kids still get excited about flying, especially if it’s with my airline.

I constantly tell them about what goes wrong or some details about the pilots that are taking us on holiday if I know them. It helps keep them scared the magic alive.

My colleague did a rather firm landing with my family and I on board the other day. After the flight we visited the flight deck and he went into great detail about why his landing “Was so st”

Although my kids know all the ‘bad words’ it wasn’t the sort of thing you’d normally hear over a PA.

Again magical insights that they’ll tell their kids about when planes are automated or just banned.

Maybe I didn't word that very well. My kids still get excited about flying, but its something we do at least once a year (2020 excepted!) so I don't think its the big deal it was for me when I was a kid. Going stateside on a 4 engine plane was properly exciting for me, and if I'm honest, it still is

[595Heaven]

As planned, took a little trip down to Kemble today.

An absolutely beautiful day, so the roof was down once the frost had melted off the roof! The Fosse Way was closed at Northleach, but my little diversion route was lovely



As you approach the airfield, there are some tantalising glimpses of tailplanes through the hedgerows, and then the planes themselves, right next to the road.





It’s a busy bit of road, but there is a small area that you can park, and then walk down the verge next to the line of planes parked up. Most have had engines removed, and just have some pipe work left with plastic badges catching reminding oils / fluids. All rather sad. Talking of sad, looks like one ex crew member has been and left their scarf on the fence.



Also went into the airfield near the cafe and tracked down a couple of engines