AT vs Winter tyres as an all-rounder?

[Walter Sobchak]

C70R said:

So is the synopsis that I'm better off going all the way to an AT tyre as an insurance policy should I need it?

And, if I were to buy something like an X5 for example, would an AT really be suitable for long motorway runs?

I think the Touareg is the favourite at the moment, because it combines the best compromise of off-road (low range, locking diffs) and on road (low nvh, nice interior) characteristics. The problem is that finding a good one is going to take some time. I'd love a 4.2, but they just seem too rare to be viable, so I'm probably stuck with the 3.2 vr6 lump.

Don’t discount the mk1 Cayenne either, you might be able to get an early 4.5S V8 in budget?, very similar car to the Touareg and finding a V8 is a bit easier!.

Tyre wise, I’ve got General Grabber AT2s on my Landcruiser, I find them ok on the road, they’re a bit noisier than a road tyre but not loads, never had any issues with them off road, they perform well enough and are a good compromise imo.

Edited by Walter Sobchak on Friday 13th May 22:26

[C70R]

Walter Sobchak said:

C70R said:

So is the synopsis that I'm better off going all the way to an AT tyre as an insurance policy should I need it?

And, if I were to buy something like an X5 for example, would an AT really be suitable for long motorway runs?

I think the Touareg is the favourite at the moment, because it combines the best compromise of off-road (low range, locking diffs) and on road (low nvh, nice interior) characteristics. The problem is that finding a good one is going to take some time. I'd love a 4.2, but they just seem too rare to be viable, so I'm probably stuck with the 3.2 vr6 lump.

Don’t discount the mk1 Cayenne either, you might be able to get an early 4.5S V8 in budget?, very similar car to the Touareg and finding a V8 is a bit easier!.

I'm absolutely discounting the V8 Cayenne. Far too many horror stories.

[C70R]

FiF said:

C70R said:

Bill said:

However the only "oh st" moments I've had (since I grew up and stopped driving like a knob anyway! ) have been braking in the wet on ATs.

You see, this is the kind of compromise that doesn't seem worth it to me for the sake of >2% of driving.

Equally on a narrow lane, meet oncoming traffic, put two wheels up on the grass verge and with winters / all season the ABS on that side triggers very easily. Which tells you something.

That feels, to me, like a better compromise than having little/no grip when doing an emergency stop on a wet motorway.

[SlimJim16v]

I've been using MTs and ATs for years, never had any issues braking, wet, dry or snow. It has been on smaller, lower power 4x4s though, and always quality tyres, not cheap remoulds.
The tread on an AT should be better in standing water too, so less chance of aquaplaning.

I have heard that the Michelin Crossclimate, an all season, performs reasonably off road.

If you want to drive across a wet field, without the risk of getting stuck, it has to be ATs.

[FiF]

C70R said:

FiF said:

C70R said:

Bill said:

However the only "oh st" moments I've had (since I grew up and stopped driving like a knob anyway! ) have been braking in the wet on ATs.

You see, this is the kind of compromise that doesn't seem worth it to me for the sake of >2% of driving.

Equally on a narrow lane, meet oncoming traffic, put two wheels up on the grass verge and with winters / all season the ABS on that side triggers very easily. Which tells you something.

That feels, to me, like a better compromise than having little/no grip when doing an emergency stop on a wet motorway.

That's fair enough. It comes down to there is no one answer that fits all. Only you know the sort of use that you will be actually demanding, then as someone said earlier, gain knowledge of the strengths and weaknesses in all the likely situations and drive with that in mind.

[Walter Sobchak]

C70R said:

I'm absolutely discounting the V8 Cayenne. Far too many horror stories.

They’re alright if you get the Turbo, it’s only the NA V8 that can implode.
Although speaking from experience, they are absolutely horrific on fuel, even by big petrol 4x4 standards.

[Bill]

I love that the V8 turbo is the sensible option!

[benny.c]

I always go for BFG KO2s on my Jeeps and don’t have any complaints in any conditions really.

[Tom4398cc]

Another vote for All Terrain tyres with the 3MPSF symbol.

I have run an L322 Range Rover with 255/55 r19 tyres for 5 years. First four years and 35,000 miles on a set of Pirelli Scorpion ATRs. No complaints at all other than they didn’t have the 3MPSF logo (so not great for my dream of taking my Range Rover to the Alps in winter at least once).

A year ago the tyres still had plenty of tread but some hawthorn hedge cuttings wrote off one tyre (thanks Farmer Giles). So I got a new set of Pirelli Scorpion ATRs. Pirelli had changed the design a fair bit, making them more aggressive tread and adding 3MPSF capability. Here is a photo of old (on the right) and new (on the left):



The new, more aggressive tyres have been fine and particularly sails through the towing a 3 ton trailer over wet grass duties. On the road they feel ok, no issues with braking in the wet or handling. The only difference I have noticed on road compared to the predecessor tyres, is that on country lanes with big puddles / standing water, the new tyres mean the steering wheel gets tugged in your hands through puddles more than the old tyres. Which I guess means the standing water gets more purchase on the more grippy tread.

[MustangGT]

I'm with Bill. Go for mild all-terrain such as a Cooper Discoverer. Road noise is in-line with most road tyres, grip is also good, much better when off-road, only downside is a marginal increase in fuel consumption. They are all season tyres.

[C70R]

Walter Sobchak said:

C70R said:

I'm absolutely discounting the V8 Cayenne. Far too many horror stories.

They’re alright if you get the Turbo, it’s only the NA V8 that can implode.
Although speaking from experience, they are absolutely horrific on fuel, even by big petrol 4x4 standards.

That's great, and all. But it's about as relevant to my meagre budget as recommending a Unimog.

[NomduJour]

If you aren’t regularly going down tracks and through fields, just get something like CrossClimate SUVs - from experience, chunkier patterns like Grabber ATs and the like are subjectively worse on the road than, say, OEM stuff like Scorpion Verdes (which are admittedly not great for fields).

https://www.tyrereviews.com/Article/2018-Auto-Bild...

[jhonn]

If most of your driving is on tarmac/hard tracks I'd stick with a road-biased tread - less drag/noise and probably better, more predictable handling. If you do get in a situation where you think you may struggle, drop 5-10psi from each tyre - this will greatly improve traction.
When you get out of the sticky situation you can re-inflate the tyres to the correct pressure. Running them for a short distance on tarmac at the lower pressure will not cause any issues (obviously you will have to keep the speed down, etc).

My son and I both run Jeep Grand Cherokees with 'road' tyres and occasionally tow heavy trailers through wet grassy fields - only once did we have to resort to lowering the tyre pressures, when towing a trailer with a Discovery on it up a steep, rutted grassy track.

A little bit of momentum and coming off the power as the wheels start to spin, will help you get through as well.

[camel_landy]

jhonn said:

A little bit of momentum and coming off the power as the wheels start to spin, will help you get through as well.

...and that's the difference a bit of training & experience makes.

M

[samj2014]

I’m running Yokohama Geolandar g01s a/t tyres on my WJ. I run them all year round because they’re technically all-seasons and have the snowflake symbol. They seem to work well in snow, crucially they’re good both on and off road, though they’re no mud tire. I did a lot of research to figure out that these are about the best compromise if you don’t want to be changing tyres, since we have a proper winter here in Canada and they do check tyres on the highways.

[C70R]

Well, I blew the budget and ended up with a rare petrol V8 Discovery 3. I fitted a set of Avon AX7 ATs which have behaved very well on the road so far. I haven't had the chance to take it on the muddy bits yet, but will report back when I do.

[mikeyb1987]

Tom4398cc said:

Another vote for All Terrain tyres with the 3MPSF symbol.

I have run an L322 Range Rover with 255/55 r19 tyres for 5 years. First four years and 35,000 miles on a set of Pirelli Scorpion ATRs. No complaints at all other than they didn’t have the 3MPSF logo (so not great for my dream of taking my Range Rover to the Alps in winter at least once).

A year ago the tyres still had plenty of tread but some hawthorn hedge cuttings wrote off one tyre (thanks Farmer Giles). So I got a new set of Pirelli Scorpion ATRs. Pirelli had changed the design a fair bit, making them more aggressive tread and adding 3MPSF capability. Here is a photo of old (on the right) and new (on the left):



The new, more aggressive tyres have been fine and particularly sails through the towing a 3 ton trailer over wet grass duties. On the road they feel ok, no issues with braking in the wet or handling. The only difference I have noticed on road compared to the predecessor tyres, is that on country lanes with big puddles / standing water, the new tyres mean the steering wheel gets tugged in your hands through puddles more than the old tyres. Which I guess means the standing water gets more purchase on the more grippy tread.

I'll give a second vote for Pirelli AT+ tyres. Glad to hear they work well on the L322 as that's what I'm upgrading to next.

Ps- great minds must think alike Tom, I also own a GP2