Bernie Ecclestone sinks to new low....

Bernie Ecclestone sinks to new low....

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JonChalk

Original Poster:

6,469 posts

109 months

Friday 14th April 2017
quotequote all
.....although you have to give him credit for helping us all understand the English language better, by providing real world, practical examples of less-well used words such as;
“egregious disingenuity”,
and
“duplicitous mendacity”

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ecclestone-call...

C Lee Farquar

4,066 posts

215 months

Friday 14th April 2017
quotequote all
Smoke and mirrors.

The underlying message seems to be:

Asked why he didn't cut rates in the past, he said: "I know I could have done, but I was trying to make money for the company, that was my job.

"It appears that it's not [Liberty's] prime objective, to make money. Their objective is to please the fans, which is good."


speedfr0g

44 posts

147 months

Saturday 15th April 2017
quotequote all
Hmmmm.
Whilst everyone refers to speculations that Bernie could buy Interlagos... One forgets that :
(1) in recent months there were noises of the French GP being back on....
(2) but not at Magnycours as has been in recent history... At Paul Ricard....
(3) a track owned by a certain Bernie E !

A discount will do nicely, thank you very much...


thegreenhell

15,108 posts

218 months

Saturday 15th April 2017
quotequote all
speedfr0g said:
Hmmmm.
Whilst everyone refers to speculations that Bernie could buy Interlagos... One forgets that :
(1) in recent months there were noises of the French GP being back on....
(2) but not at Magnycours as has been in recent history... At Paul Ricard....
(3) a track owned by a certain Bernie E !

A discount will do nicely, thank you very much...
(1) more than just noises; the deal is signed and formally announced with five races from 2018;

(3) the track is owned by Bambino, the Ecclestone family trust over which Bernie has no direct control, and;
(4) the race promoters are leasing the track from Bambino, funded by various local government bodies in France.

Bernie's only involvement seems to be that he signed the deal on FOM's side. Even in the murky world of F1 finance I don't think he could get away with being on both sides of the deal.

Crafty_

13,248 posts

199 months

Saturday 15th April 2017
quotequote all
C Lee Farquar said:
Smoke and mirrors.

Asked why he didn't cut rates in the past, he said: "I know I could have done, but I was trying to make money for the company, that was my job.
This is not news, it was well known. He did an interview a little while back where he said he warned promoters that they'd "lose their arse". He had a job to do and did it well in accordance with his employers' wishes. I don't see what the fuss is about.

Derek Smith

45,512 posts

247 months

Saturday 15th April 2017
quotequote all
Crafty_ said:
He had a job to do and did it well in accordance with his employers' wishes. I don't see what the fuss is about.
I think the point is that his only target was to make money. He was not a fan of F!. All the talk about he being the best thing that ever happened to F1 should have read that he was the best thing that happened to F1 management.

Liberty has taken over a concern that was failing. The cause was Ecclestone.


Crafty_

13,248 posts

199 months

Saturday 15th April 2017
quotequote all
Derek Smith said:
I think the point is that his only target was to make money. He was not a fan of F!. All the talk about he being the best thing that ever happened to F1 should have read that he was the best thing that happened to F1 management.

Liberty has taken over a concern that was failing. The cause was Ecclestone.
Did you even read what I wrote ?

CVC owned F1. Their priority was to make money, they got Eccelstone to do it.

yes Eccelstone could have said no and left, he didn't, If he had they'd have got someone else to do it.

People seem to think Bernie had a free hand to do whatever he liked, he didn't.

Rich_W

12,548 posts

211 months

Saturday 15th April 2017
quotequote all
Derek Smith said:
I think the point is that his only target was to make money. He was not a fan of F!. All the talk about he being the best thing that ever happened to F1 should have read that he was the best thing that happened to F1 management.

Liberty has taken over a concern that was failing. The cause was Ecclestone.
Why are you so utterly clueless about F1. And why d you insist on reinforcing this fact at every opportunity whenever Eccelstones name is mentioned

rolleyes


JonChalk

Original Poster:

6,469 posts

109 months

Saturday 15th April 2017
quotequote all
Crafty_ said:
CVC owned F1. Their priority was to make money, they got Eccelstone to do it.

yes Eccelstone could have said no and left, he didn't, If he had they'd have got someone else to do it.

People seem to think Bernie had a free hand to do whatever he liked, he didn't.
Suspect it is the manner in which he did so, rather than the fact that he chose / was obliged to.

It was the oft-stated pretence of doing everything for the "sake of F1 / improving the show", rather than the never-mentioned "for the purposes of making money for CVC".

Crafty_

13,248 posts

199 months

Saturday 15th April 2017
quotequote all
JonChalk said:
Suspect it is the manner in which he did so, rather than the fact that he chose / was obliged to.

It was the oft-stated pretence of doing everything for the "sake of F1 / improving the show", rather than the never-mentioned "for the purposes of making money for CVC".
I'd love to see a quote where Bernie said that. Its always been clear he's after the money and he's never made any apology for that.

Some people seem to think Bernie is the root of all evil and every problem in F1, if only that were true it'd be an easy thing to fix wouldn't it ?


Derek Smith

45,512 posts

247 months

Saturday 15th April 2017
quotequote all
Crafty_ said:
Derek Smith said:
I think the point is that his only target was to make money. He was not a fan of F!. All the talk about he being the best thing that ever happened to F1 should have read that he was the best thing that happened to F1 management.

Liberty has taken over a concern that was failing. The cause was Ecclestone.
Did you even read what I wrote ?

CVC owned F1. Their priority was to make money, they got Eccelstone to do it.

yes Eccelstone could have said no and left, he didn't, If he had they'd have got someone else to do it.

People seem to think Bernie had a free hand to do whatever he liked, he didn't.
I think if you read what I wrote you will see that I was supporting what you wrote. I was just bringing in another point.


Derek Smith

45,512 posts

247 months

Saturday 15th April 2017
quotequote all
Crafty_ said:
I'd love to see a quote where Bernie said that. Its always been clear he's after the money and he's never made any apology for that.

Some people seem to think Bernie is the root of all evil and every problem in F1, if only that were true it'd be an easy thing to fix wouldn't it ?
It's not that Ecclestone said what he did was good for for the sport but that others did. He was in it for the money. He was an anchor.

This desire for money, money, money is a significant cause for the problems with the sport. He was in it for his own reasons, not for the sport.

Liberty have made changes already. They needed to so so.


skwdenyer

16,171 posts

239 months

Sunday 16th April 2017
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I think what is interesting is where Bernie goes next. He got control of F1 by taking a dysfunctional group of teams and negotiating on their behalf. He used that power base to gain the commercial rights, then allowed the teams to slip back into a dysfunctional mess so as not to challenge him.

The next group are the circuits. They have no collective power. Bernie understands the value of collective power. There are only so many FIA certified tracks in the world. I wonder...

Crafty_

13,248 posts

199 months

Sunday 16th April 2017
quotequote all
Derek Smith said:
Crafty_ said:
I'd love to see a quote where Bernie said that. Its always been clear he's after the money and he's never made any apology for that.

Some people seem to think Bernie is the root of all evil and every problem in F1, if only that were true it'd be an easy thing to fix wouldn't it ?
It's not that Ecclestone said what he did was good for for the sport but that others did. He was in it for the money. He was an anchor.

This desire for money, money, money is a significant cause for the problems with the sport. He was in it for his own reasons, not for the sport.

Liberty have made changes already. They needed to so so.
Right and now Bernie has gone that "desire for money, money, money" has gone has it ? Not. A. Chance. LM have already stated they are quite happy with pay TV to continue - ££££ 25 races a year has been mentioned - ££££

Over anything is the fact that the teams are not going to stop leveraging anything they can to get money from FOM.

If you think that all is well now Bernie has gone because of your obsessive hatred for the man you are sadly mistaken.

LM are in F1 to make money, they may take a different approach for some aspects but n the big scheme of things, little will change.


Edited by Crafty_ on Sunday 16th April 11:21

craigjm

17,907 posts

199 months

Sunday 16th April 2017
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Anyone who thinks that Liberty are not in it to make money as their first and over riding objective are fooling themselves. They may go about it in a different way to Ecclestone but the objective is the same.

satans worm

2,356 posts

216 months

Sunday 16th April 2017
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Whilst no question both are in it for money, and I don't blame either for that, I think bernies vision was somewhat short sighted, how to extract maximum cash right now, who cares about the fans.
Liberty I think are taking a more long term view, to make more money ypu need more fans and more fanfare/ press excitement , then long term more circuits and tv companies will pay more to host/ broadcasts it.
And it is this what i hope will make it so much better, bernies narrow minded vision about the now only turned people off, liberties more strategic view I hope will be better for all around.

craigjm

17,907 posts

199 months

Sunday 16th April 2017
quotequote all
satans worm said:
Whilst no question both are in it for money, and I don't blame either for that, I think bernies vision was somewhat short sighted, how to extract maximum cash right now, who cares about the fans.
Liberty I think are taking a more long term view, to make more money ypu need more fans and more fanfare/ press excitement , then long term more circuits and tv companies will pay more to host/ broadcasts it.
And it is this what i hope will make it so much better, bernies narrow minded vision about the now only turned people off, liberties more strategic view I hope will be better for all around.
I don't disagree

What did it for Bernie was his failure to move with the times and embrace social media try to make all the money from TV rights and tickets. The cost of attending a race is ludicrous

ClockworkCupcake

74,390 posts

271 months

Sunday 16th April 2017
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craigjm said:
Anyone who thinks that Liberty are not in it to make money as their first and over riding objective are fooling themselves. They may go about it in a different way to Ecclestone but the objective is the same.
But how they go about it will be key.

If they go about it by making it better, engaging the fans, growing the fan base, etc., then that will be far better than squeezing it dry like Bernie was doing. Also I found Bernie a very negative person who, as the Promoter, seemed to spend more time dissing F1 than promoting it.

MiniMan64

16,860 posts

189 months

Sunday 16th April 2017
quotequote all
skwdenyer said:
I think what is interesting is where Bernie goes next. He got control of F1 by taking a dysfunctional group of teams and negotiating on their behalf. He used that power base to gain the commercial rights, then allowed the teams to slip back into a dysfunctional mess so as not to challenge him.

The next group are the circuits. They have no collective power. Bernie understands the value of collective power. There are only so many FIA certified tracks in the world. I wonder...
Hasn't he just bought his way into the Brazilian circuit?

The C4 interview just shown really paints him as a bitter dinosaur better off gone.

Crafty_

13,248 posts

199 months

Sunday 16th April 2017
quotequote all
MiniMan64 said:
Hasn't he just bought his way into the Brazilian circuit?

The C4 interview just shown really paints him as a bitter dinosaur better off gone.
The circuit has been put up for sale and there is a rumour he might put in a bid.