G96 / G97/50 Sourcing

[43655]

Hi all,
Building an ultima-ish car, Toyota 3UZ (4.3 V8), spaceframe, custom suspension etc anyway;

really struggling to find a gearbox!

Long term plan is for ~600whp, and I'm toying with keeping the awd function too.

The modern-er, strong and well geared 996 turbo 'boxes seem a good choice, and i believe the 997's box is basically the same but Aisin not Getrag but fundamentally the same? Any reason to chose one not the other?
Am I correct to think the 996 had 2nd gear pop-out issues requiring a rebuild, maybe resolved in the 997?

But my biggest struggle currently is finding one, or well finding one for sensible money.
AB offered me either 96 or 97 variant for £8100 2wd converted but sans diff and billet sideplate (I may well make one in work though)

Surely these are more plentiful than the old G50s? Therefore should be more affordable?

Also, any opinions on diffs? For road/track, Wavetrac seems to be recommended. Or man up and go full plate? OS-G?

Many thanks!

[F.C.]

43655 said:

Hi all,
Building an ultima-ish car, Toyota 3UZ (4.3 V8), spaceframe, custom suspension etc anyway;

really struggling to find a gearbox!

Long term plan is for ~600whp, and I'm toying with keeping the awd function too.

The modern-er, strong and well geared 996 turbo 'boxes seem a good choice, and i believe the 997's box is basically the same but Aisin not Getrag but fundamentally the same? Any reason to chose one not the other?
Am I correct to think the 996 had 2nd gear pop-out issues requiring a rebuild, maybe resolved in the 997?

But my biggest struggle currently is finding one, or well finding one for sensible money.
AB offered me either 96 or 97 variant for £8100 2wd converted but sans diff and billet sideplate (I may well make one in work though)

Surely these are more plentiful than the old G50s? Therefore should be more affordable?

Also, any opinions on diffs? For road/track, Wavetrac seems to be recommended. Or man up and go full plate? OS-G?

Many thanks!

Full plate LSD with the ramp angles adjusted to suit mid mount, better feedback on trailing throttle IMO.

I heard the Aisin boxes were a bh to open up, no idea about reliability one over the other though.

Availability is scarce all round on Turbo boxes so they are all going to be ££££'s no matter if G50/50 50/52 or later 996 997 fayre all have the all important 9" ring gear as opposed to the 7.5" that is the weak point on the standard boxes with uber power/torque engines attached.

[confusionhunter]

Wavetrac does both so I really don't see there is another option IMHO. ATB up to the point all traction is lost then the plate locks. and comes with a transferrable Lifetime warrenty (limited).
http://www.wavetrac.net/technical.htm
(Wavetrac diff and gripper plate diff owner, still love the gripper though)

[43655]

Thanks for the replies / reassurance.

Still nowhere with a transaxle though. Found a dodgy G50 on ebay and thats it so far. Thought Teile.com had what i needed but nope.

Why can't more Porsche owners crash??

[Evolution-ism]

Why don't you contact Ultima Sports LTD??

I have talked with Richard and they seem to have many Porsche style transaxles (used low miles and new) at the factory, and IMO their prices were reasonable.

[Evolution-ism]

ALSO have you looked into Vertex Automotive in Miami USA, they ship worldwide and they have lots of different FULLY rebuilt Porsche transaxles

[43655]

I hadn't considered that, I read they're not very accommodating if Ultima builders don't use the correct SBF and G50, but thanks I'll try them.

I can get a rebuilt 'box here, for £8k. I can't imagine that with shipping and the usual VAT shafting it could be any cheaper surely? I keep dismissing LA Dismantlers for that reason

[Evolution-ism]

43655 said:

I hadn't considered that, I read they're not very accommodating if Ultima builders don't use the correct SBF and G50, but thanks I'll try them.

I can get a rebuilt 'box here, for £8k. I can't imagine that with shipping and the usual VAT shafting it could be any cheaper surely? I keep dismissing LA Dismantlers for that reason

Since I am in the USA, I do not know of all the complexities of you buying from USA (I have seen lots of extra costs for you to pay). Ultima Sports had lots of low mileage and inspected 996 transaxles (they did a nice job of painting them black with gold shift arms..........)

[deadscoob]

"Availability is scarce all round on Turbo boxes so they are all going to be ££££'s no matter if G50/50 50/52 or later 996 997 fayre all have the all important 9" ring gear as opposed to the 7.5" that is the weak point on the standard boxes with uber power/torque engines attached."

I do wish owners wouldn't come out with stuff like that....

The boxes with 7.5" ring gear are of course weaker than the 9" versions but they are absolutely not a weak point.

I use mine harder than the majority, using a 7.5" ring gear box, and have no more problems than those with the 9" equivalent.

There are far more of the "weaker" boxes in use than the stronger ones and there are very few problems.

So please, stop with these "weak point" comments - you're more likely to break a standard driveshaft or cv joint.....

[43655]

Did anyone mention the strength issue?

I'd use a regular G96 while the engine is stock, but the ratios are a rubbish match for a lower-revving v8. I believe G50s of the non-turbo type are similar.

I've considered G50, the 915 'box, stock G96, Graziano, Hewland but the G96.50 always comes out best, in gearing, strength and supposedly availability! Just got to hopefully avoid the dreaded 2nd gear pop-out issues.

Plus with the G96.50 being 4wd, I'm tempted to utilise that with a transfer case, long UJ-d propshaft and front diff...
Although the graziano (audi R8, lambo etc) has the best setup for this, although requires a 2k drop gear to make the gearing usable.

[F.C.]

43655 said:

Did anyone mention the strength issue?

I'd use a regular G96 while the engine is stock, but the ratios are a rubbish match for a lower-revving v8. I believe G50s of the non-turbo type are similar.

I've considered G50, the 915 'box, stock G96, Graziano, Hewland but the G96.50 always comes out best, in gearing, strength and supposedly availability! Just got to hopefully avoid the dreaded 2nd gear pop-out issues.

Plus with the G96.50 being 4wd, I'm tempted to utilise that with a transfer case, long UJ-d propshaft and front diff...
Although the graziano (audi R8, lambo etc) has the best setup for this, although requires a 2k drop gear to make the gearing usable.

Both the G50/52 and G96/50 are Getrag boxes, both are from turbo cars and have the taller gearing

other than that its apples and oranges

the G50/52 is a 5 speed from a 964 2wd turbo the G96/50 is a 6 speed from a 2001 996 AWD turbo

Both boxes are going to cost you £££

IMO the five speed is better there is no need for a six speed box, a V8 has so much torque! I constantly skip gears in my car, a four speed would probably be ideal.

availability will be an issue with both boxes, the G50/52 as its older will be harder to find but the G96/50 is also from a turbo car and there are far fewer turbo cars on the road than normally aspirated, vis-à-vis less on the scrap heap.

[Storer]

I don't think the other boxes are weaker. They are just not ideal.

An Ultima is a light weight car, and with the high torque engines, accelerates quickly. The more gears, the more shifting. But that torque makes it much less necessary. 5 speed boxes are fine, four might be too few for relaxed cruising. The G50/52 gives my LS7 engine car a (theoretical) top speed of 210mph but it also give a reasonably relaxed cruise.

It is now a very valuable piece of my car. Worth north of £7k, but ideal for the car. Just right, and not for sale!!!


Paul

[F.C.]

Storer said:

I don't think the other boxes are weaker.

Then why go to the trouble of fitting a 9"crownwheel and pinion?

[highflyer]

43655 would you be interested in a Porsche G50 gearbox recon by Neinmeister in Warrington
Gearbox numbers are
end case 964.301.301.1R
middle section
G5021 2 003255
950.301.102
there is a clutch assembly and adapter plate included

[43655]

Highflyer PM'd you.

G96/50 is still my preference. Sadly missed out on one for good money recently

[DMilne]

May want to consider a brand new old stock transaxle from Porsche #99630002055. This is a 911 turbo AWD 6sp with a LSD for 2001-2005. I brought one last November for under $7,500. Need to convert for inverted operation and buy all the clutch parts. A quick google search found three suppliers with prices from $8,050 to $8,900 in the USA. No core charge either. Probably won't last much longer.

[43655]

Hi, Guessing that's a G96/30?
Same as the weaker and poorly geared G96/00 but still with the AWD complexity.

Thanks but really not suitable, especially as I can get one used for around £1k here.
Okay I know they're problematic and used might not be great but still

[humble]

43655 said:

Hi, Guessing that's a G96/30?
Same as the weaker and poorly geared G96/00 but still with the AWD complexity.

Thanks but really not suitable, especially as I can get one used for around £1k here.
Okay I know they're problematic and used might not be great but still

Nope, this is the 996TT 6-spd w/ LSD, and newer crate trans share the GT2 bell housing so you can use the gt2 slave cylinder. 996.300.020.55 is the porsche part number, you are thinking of a descriptor or serial which is G96505002070GETRAG or similar. There's a seal cap you get for the nose after removing the output stub, and you'll need to supply various other bits, but it's hard to beat for the money if you can find one.

Will

[DMilne]

996-300-020-55 is the part number for a G96.50 transaxle used in a 2004+ 911 turbo 6sp AWD.

This is the listing in the porsche parts catalog English version, see page 68.
https://www.porsche911.lt/files/996%20Turbo:GT2/E_...


These are the spec's from California Motorsports, https://californiamotorsports.net/pages/porsche-99...

Hopefully I haven't broken any forum rules by posting any of this info.