Louis Theroux's Altered States
Discussion
Watched it with my wife who works in oncology. Quite tough viewing. The gentleman who chose his time had great dignity, and the end he wanted, but the potential under dosing seems crazy. The lady in the wheelchair seemed to be more depressed about the recent death of her husband and financial issues rather than terminal illness. Her dementia seemed almost an excuse to end her life. Mind you, the method she used - although it wasn’t really shown - seemed to be rather crude.
abzmike said:
Watched it with my wife who works in oncology. Quite tough viewing. The gentleman who chose his time had great dignity, and the end he wanted, but the potential under dosing seems crazy. The lady in the wheelchair seemed to be more depressed about the recent death of her husband and financial issues rather than terminal illness. Her dementia seemed almost an excuse to end her life. Mind you, the method she used - although it wasn’t really shown - seemed to be rather crude.
Agree.7hrs for the bloke to die. Was he asleep throughout or semi conscious and suffering?
As the palliative care lead for our surgery, these kind of difficult situations are something that I deal with on a regular basis. That includes with the individual themselves but of course all the associated family. Typically it is cancer but also other life limiting illness such as heart failure or lung fibrosis.
Felt quite different watching it from the outside than being involved as a professional though. I was actually not aware that some states in the US had legislated assisted suicide.
Gus, to be able to die at home, without pain/distress and surrounded by family (i.e. what he wanted) is what we strive for as the gold standard. Difficult viewing, but the family will take much solace to know his wishes were followed through. Here we would not be giving oral medications but setting up a syringe driver (little needle with tubing attached to a syringe of medication) which would administer medication (typically pain killers & sedatives) which would aid his passing. This would however only be set up in the last few days as death was drawing near.
It's extremely difficult to make judgements regarding quality of life as what is acceptable for one individual is not for another. As such, to comment on her physical state is very tough. She mentioned that her husband was her carer. I don't think it was mentioned how much care she needed on a daily basis (washing/dressing/toileting etc).
It was clear she was completely and utterly heart broken. In her mind, she quite simply had nothing left to live for.
In a different situation, with family or close friends, I suspect this would not have been the case.
There was a lot that didn't sit right with me regarding the Exit Guides including their attitude to dementia (which they reasoned was severe enough in this lady's instance to justify their actions).
Felt quite different watching it from the outside than being involved as a professional though. I was actually not aware that some states in the US had legislated assisted suicide.
Gus, to be able to die at home, without pain/distress and surrounded by family (i.e. what he wanted) is what we strive for as the gold standard. Difficult viewing, but the family will take much solace to know his wishes were followed through. Here we would not be giving oral medications but setting up a syringe driver (little needle with tubing attached to a syringe of medication) which would administer medication (typically pain killers & sedatives) which would aid his passing. This would however only be set up in the last few days as death was drawing near.
abzmike said:
The lady in the wheelchair seemed to be more depressed about the recent death of her husband and financial issues rather than terminal illness. Her dementia seemed almost an excuse to end her life.
I agree.It's extremely difficult to make judgements regarding quality of life as what is acceptable for one individual is not for another. As such, to comment on her physical state is very tough. She mentioned that her husband was her carer. I don't think it was mentioned how much care she needed on a daily basis (washing/dressing/toileting etc).
It was clear she was completely and utterly heart broken. In her mind, she quite simply had nothing left to live for.
In a different situation, with family or close friends, I suspect this would not have been the case.
There was a lot that didn't sit right with me regarding the Exit Guides including their attitude to dementia (which they reasoned was severe enough in this lady's instance to justify their actions).
Sa Calobra said:
abzmike said:
Watched it with my wife who works in oncology. Quite tough viewing. The gentleman who chose his time had great dignity, and the end he wanted, but the potential under dosing seems crazy.
Agreed7hrs for the bloke to die. Was he asleep throughout or semi conscious and suffering?
I think the doctor friend was speculating more than anything regarding dosing.
A bit of googling suggest that they use baribituates. This is something we don't use in end of life care in the UK.
I thought this was one of Louis weakest ones if I'm being brutally honest.
he was more of a narrator than a documentary maker although the pictures spoke for themselves in a lot of ways. It didn't leave him much to say.
I thought the beach scene and the card game were really important moments oddly.
he was more of a narrator than a documentary maker although the pictures spoke for themselves in a lot of ways. It didn't leave him much to say.
I thought the beach scene and the card game were really important moments oddly.
I must admit I like his interviewing style. Very open ended questions and knows when to probe. Last night he took a backseat but also some of his questions were leading/closed.
Noted he looked quite uncomfortable at times though. Almost like it was ageing him or didn't sit right.
Possibly? Around the lady in the wheelchair, self questioning his involvement? That last bit is Abit of a leap
Noted he looked quite uncomfortable at times though. Almost like it was ageing him or didn't sit right.
Possibly? Around the lady in the wheelchair, self questioning his involvement? That last bit is Abit of a leap
I think he was visibly shocked when he found out sh e had taken her life so quickly after speaking with her - it came across to me that he felt complicit in some way - even though she had decided to do it, it was almost as if his interview with her was a final convincing note for her.
he might even have felt duplicitous in some way....like I say that's how it came across - it was almost matter of fact - "oh yeah she died and left a letter pinned to the door".....
he might even have felt duplicitous in some way....like I say that's how it came across - it was almost matter of fact - "oh yeah she died and left a letter pinned to the door".....
Nom de ploom said:
I thought this was one of Louis weakest ones if I'm being brutally honest.
he was more of a narrator than a documentary maker although the pictures spoke for themselves in a lot of ways. It didn't leave him much to say.
I thought the beach scene and the card game were really important moments oddly.
If anything, I thought this was one of his best. He didn't need to say much, it was what the patients/family said that was powerful.he was more of a narrator than a documentary maker although the pictures spoke for themselves in a lot of ways. It didn't leave him much to say.
I thought the beach scene and the card game were really important moments oddly.
A good interviewer needs to know when not to talk in order to facilitate the best from his interviewee.
Nom de ploom said:
I think he was visibly shocked when he found out sh e had taken her life so quickly after speaking with her - it came across to me that he felt complicit in some way - even though she had decided to do it, it was almost as if his interview with her was a final convincing note for her.
he might even have felt duplicitous in some way....like I say that's how it came across - it was almost matter of fact - "oh yeah she died and left a letter pinned to the door".....
He was clearly very uncomfortable about the whole situation.he might even have felt duplicitous in some way....like I say that's how it came across - it was almost matter of fact - "oh yeah she died and left a letter pinned to the door".....
She had capacity to make an informed decision and he respected that. However, he clearly didn't agree with the Exit Guide's rather blasé attitude to it all.
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