Louis Theroux's Altered States

Author
Discussion

Halb

Original Poster:

53,012 posts

183 months

Sunday 18th November 2018
quotequote all
damn some of these are hard.

tonight's is about people choosing to die through legally prescribed overdose.

the family around their patriarch...rather beautiful.

petop

2,139 posts

166 months

Sunday 18th November 2018
quotequote all
Yep just watched it myself.

I was concerned when the Dr said that the dose may not be enough.

Totally understand why people decide that way.

Easternlight

3,427 posts

144 months

Sunday 18th November 2018
quotequote all
Wanted to watch it.
Tried to.

Couldn't.

abzmike

8,343 posts

106 months

Sunday 18th November 2018
quotequote all
Watched it with my wife who works in oncology. Quite tough viewing. The gentleman who chose his time had great dignity, and the end he wanted, but the potential under dosing seems crazy. The lady in the wheelchair seemed to be more depressed about the recent death of her husband and financial issues rather than terminal illness. Her dementia seemed almost an excuse to end her life. Mind you, the method she used - although it wasn’t really shown - seemed to be rather crude.

Sa Calobra

37,115 posts

211 months

Sunday 18th November 2018
quotequote all
abzmike said:
Watched it with my wife who works in oncology. Quite tough viewing. The gentleman who chose his time had great dignity, and the end he wanted, but the potential under dosing seems crazy. The lady in the wheelchair seemed to be more depressed about the recent death of her husband and financial issues rather than terminal illness. Her dementia seemed almost an excuse to end her life. Mind you, the method she used - although it wasn’t really shown - seemed to be rather crude.
Agree.

7hrs for the bloke to die. Was he asleep throughout or semi conscious and suffering?


abzmike

8,343 posts

106 months

Sunday 18th November 2018
quotequote all
Sa Calobra said:
Agree.

7hrs for the bloke to die. Was he asleep throughout or semi conscious and suffering?
He was asleep, gently snoring and certainly didn’t seem to be distressed. His doctor friend was worried he might wake up though.

g3org3y

20,627 posts

191 months

Sunday 18th November 2018
quotequote all
As the palliative care lead for our surgery, these kind of difficult situations are something that I deal with on a regular basis. That includes with the individual themselves but of course all the associated family. Typically it is cancer but also other life limiting illness such as heart failure or lung fibrosis.

Felt quite different watching it from the outside than being involved as a professional though. I was actually not aware that some states in the US had legislated assisted suicide.

Gus, to be able to die at home, without pain/distress and surrounded by family (i.e. what he wanted) is what we strive for as the gold standard. Difficult viewing, but the family will take much solace to know his wishes were followed through. Here we would not be giving oral medications but setting up a syringe driver (little needle with tubing attached to a syringe of medication) which would administer medication (typically pain killers & sedatives) which would aid his passing. This would however only be set up in the last few days as death was drawing near.

abzmike said:
The lady in the wheelchair seemed to be more depressed about the recent death of her husband and financial issues rather than terminal illness. Her dementia seemed almost an excuse to end her life.
I agree.

It's extremely difficult to make judgements regarding quality of life as what is acceptable for one individual is not for another. As such, to comment on her physical state is very tough. She mentioned that her husband was her carer. I don't think it was mentioned how much care she needed on a daily basis (washing/dressing/toileting etc).

It was clear she was completely and utterly heart broken. In her mind, she quite simply had nothing left to live for.

In a different situation, with family or close friends, I suspect this would not have been the case.

There was a lot that didn't sit right with me regarding the Exit Guides including their attitude to dementia (which they reasoned was severe enough in this lady's instance to justify their actions).

g3org3y

20,627 posts

191 months

Sunday 18th November 2018
quotequote all
Sa Calobra said:
abzmike said:
Watched it with my wife who works in oncology. Quite tough viewing. The gentleman who chose his time had great dignity, and the end he wanted, but the potential under dosing seems crazy.
Agreed

7hrs for the bloke to die. Was he asleep throughout or semi conscious and suffering?
He would have been to all intents and purposes in a state of sleep. Not in pain and not suffering.

I think the doctor friend was speculating more than anything regarding dosing.

A bit of googling suggest that they use baribituates. This is something we don't use in end of life care in the UK.



Nom de ploom

4,890 posts

174 months

Monday 19th November 2018
quotequote all
I thought this was one of Louis weakest ones if I'm being brutally honest.

he was more of a narrator than a documentary maker although the pictures spoke for themselves in a lot of ways. It didn't leave him much to say.

I thought the beach scene and the card game were really important moments oddly.


Sa Calobra

37,115 posts

211 months

Monday 19th November 2018
quotequote all
I must admit I like his interviewing style. Very open ended questions and knows when to probe. Last night he took a backseat but also some of his questions were leading/closed.

Noted he looked quite uncomfortable at times though. Almost like it was ageing him or didn't sit right.

Possibly? Around the lady in the wheelchair, self questioning his involvement? That last bit is Abit of a leap

Nom de ploom

4,890 posts

174 months

Monday 19th November 2018
quotequote all
I think he was visibly shocked when he found out sh e had taken her life so quickly after speaking with her - it came across to me that he felt complicit in some way - even though she had decided to do it, it was almost as if his interview with her was a final convincing note for her.

he might even have felt duplicitous in some way....like I say that's how it came across - it was almost matter of fact - "oh yeah she died and left a letter pinned to the door".....

g3org3y

20,627 posts

191 months

Monday 19th November 2018
quotequote all
Nom de ploom said:
I thought this was one of Louis weakest ones if I'm being brutally honest.

he was more of a narrator than a documentary maker although the pictures spoke for themselves in a lot of ways. It didn't leave him much to say.

I thought the beach scene and the card game were really important moments oddly.
If anything, I thought this was one of his best. He didn't need to say much, it was what the patients/family said that was powerful.

A good interviewer needs to know when not to talk in order to facilitate the best from his interviewee.

Nom de ploom said:
I think he was visibly shocked when he found out sh e had taken her life so quickly after speaking with her - it came across to me that he felt complicit in some way - even though she had decided to do it, it was almost as if his interview with her was a final convincing note for her.

he might even have felt duplicitous in some way....like I say that's how it came across - it was almost matter of fact - "oh yeah she died and left a letter pinned to the door".....
He was clearly very uncomfortable about the whole situation.

She had capacity to make an informed decision and he respected that. However, he clearly didn't agree with the Exit Guide's rather blasé attitude to it all.