White House Farm murders - ITV series

White House Farm murders - ITV series

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Discussion

FourWheelDrift

88,381 posts

283 months

Thursday 30th January 2020
quotequote all
Welshbeef said:
Who financially gained from Bamber being locked up? Don’t the cousins live in the farm and have done since? Sweet result for them
The video I have posted a link to earlier explains a lot about the family members and their behaviour after the event. And how they would inherit the farm after the adopted Jeremy Bamber was put away.

dukeboy749r

2,539 posts

209 months

Thursday 30th January 2020
quotequote all
@Welshbeef

You do post some complete drivel

Whilst it is a cousin who lives there, you make it sound like a lovely cosy arrangement that suits them very well. If you had five members of your extended family killed I don't think you would appreciate the phraseology that you have applied

JB and his 'sister' are not blood relatives.

Both him and his sister were, in fact, adopted.

The most obvious issue - if the sister did commit the crime, she a) managed to turn the gun on herself and then b) shot her self again. That is pretty difficult to do.

Schizophrenia in of itself, does not you a killer make...



Edited by dukeboy749r on Thursday 30th January 17:37

Welshbeef

49,633 posts

197 months

Thursday 30th January 2020
quotequote all
dukeboy749r said:
@Welshbeef

You do post some complete drivel

Whilst it is a cousin who lives there, you make it sound like a lovely cosy arrangement that suits them very well. If you had five members of your extended family killed I don't think you would appreciate the phraseology that you have applied

JB and his 'sister' are not blood relatives.

Both him and his sister were, in fact, adopted.

The most obvious issue - if the sister did commit the crime, she a) managed to turn the gun on herself and then b) shot her self again. That is pretty difficult to do.

Schizophrenia in of itself, does not you a killer make...



Edited by dukeboy749r on Thursday 30th January 17:37
We all do - including yourself.

This is a thread about the drama and speculation. No one knows what did or didn’t happen apart from the fact he was convicted beyond reasonable doubt by a court.

youngsyr

14,742 posts

191 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
nonsequitur said:
Welshbeef said:
Is it factually true all the windows locked and on the latches and the doors locked from the inside with the keys still in the doors (on the inside).

If so how could someone escape ie another killer escape?
One of the relatives discovered that the kitchen window could be locked from the outside. The latch could be engaged after exit.
But only if you knew that particular window catch was broken and could be locked that way.

youngsyr

14,742 posts

191 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
I wonder if there's not a way to discover the truth long after the fact - presumably it takes a very "unique" individual to execute an entire family of relatives, including two young boys, in cold blood, over a reasonably prolonged period (the killer reloaded at least twice).

I would hope there would be psychological markers that would indicate whether Bamber was capable of such a heinous act.

Similarly, with his sister. Just because she was schizophrenic, it doesn't mean she was necessarily prone to such acts.

I understand that Bamber is willing to undertake a lie detector test, so it would seem he truly believes himself innocent. Again, not an indication of innocence or otherwise in itself, but certainly an indication of openness to testing.

Tyre Smoke

23,018 posts

260 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
youngsyr said:
I wonder if there's not a way to discover the truth long after the fact - presumably it takes a very "unique" individual to execute an entire family of relatives, including two young boys, in cold blood, over a reasonably prolonged period (the killer reloaded at least twice).

I would hope there would be psychological markers that would indicate whether Bamber was capable of such a heinous act.

Similarly, with his sister. Just because she was schizophrenic, it doesn't mean she was necessarily prone to such acts.

I understand that Bamber is willing to undertake a lie detector test, so it would seem he truly believes himself innocent. Again, not an indication of innocence or otherwise in itself, but certainly an indication of openness to testing.
He has taken, and passed, a lie detector test.

But if you were a complete sociopathic murderer, you would probably be able to pass the test.

youngsyr

14,742 posts

191 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
Another line of thought that I find compelling is that the boys were executed in cold blood, which would presumably indicate that they hadn't heard anything and woken up prior to their deaths (small mercy).

That in turn would indicate that the silencer was used, at least for some of the shots. The fact that it wasn't on the rifle, or even on the same floor of the house as the sister's body, would suggest to me that it was moved after the final shooting.

If that is the case, Bamber did it.


youngsyr

14,742 posts

191 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
Tyre Smoke said:
youngsyr said:
I wonder if there's not a way to discover the truth long after the fact - presumably it takes a very "unique" individual to execute an entire family of relatives, including two young boys, in cold blood, over a reasonably prolonged period (the killer reloaded at least twice).

I would hope there would be psychological markers that would indicate whether Bamber was capable of such a heinous act.

Similarly, with his sister. Just because she was schizophrenic, it doesn't mean she was necessarily prone to such acts.

I understand that Bamber is willing to undertake a lie detector test, so it would seem he truly believes himself innocent. Again, not an indication of innocence or otherwise in itself, but certainly an indication of openness to testing.
He has taken, and passed, a lie detector test.

But if you were a complete sociopathic murderer, you would probably be able to pass the test.
Are you sure?

OJ Simpson apparently failed his lie detector test miserably, so being a psychopathic killer certainly doesn't mean you can pass a lie detector test.

What's more, I didn't say a lie detector test was reliable, I said it indicated a willingness to be tested.

Tyre Smoke

23,018 posts

260 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
Plus it was proven that the sister could not have possibly stuck the gun under her chin and reached the trigger with the silencer fitted. Therefore she must have murdered everyone, taken the silencer off and replaced it in the cupboard, then walked back upstairs and shot herself. Twice.

Muzzer79

9,806 posts

186 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
youngsyr said:
Tyre Smoke said:
youngsyr said:
I wonder if there's not a way to discover the truth long after the fact - presumably it takes a very "unique" individual to execute an entire family of relatives, including two young boys, in cold blood, over a reasonably prolonged period (the killer reloaded at least twice).

I would hope there would be psychological markers that would indicate whether Bamber was capable of such a heinous act.

Similarly, with his sister. Just because she was schizophrenic, it doesn't mean she was necessarily prone to such acts.

I understand that Bamber is willing to undertake a lie detector test, so it would seem he truly believes himself innocent. Again, not an indication of innocence or otherwise in itself, but certainly an indication of openness to testing.
He has taken, and passed, a lie detector test.

But if you were a complete sociopathic murderer, you would probably be able to pass the test.
Are you sure?

OJ Simpson apparently failed his lie detector test miserably, so being a psychopathic killer certainly doesn't mean you can pass a lie detector test.

What's more, I didn't say a lie detector test was reliable, I said it indicated a willingness to be tested.
OJ wasn't/isn't a psychopath.
Bamber, it would seem, very much is.

I like the series but I'm now getting the impression they're dragging it out.
We get it, the Police were convinced it was murder/suicide, there was one heroic DS who thought it was suspicious, the family were suspicious, Bamber was acting weird.
We've had a few episodes of that so getting down to the nitty gritty would be good. Ending the last episode as Bamber's girlfriend was about to shop him was plain annoying.


aponting389

741 posts

177 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
Muzzer79 said:
youngsyr said:
Tyre Smoke said:
youngsyr said:
I wonder if there's not a way to discover the truth long after the fact - presumably it takes a very "unique" individual to execute an entire family of relatives, including two young boys, in cold blood, over a reasonably prolonged period (the killer reloaded at least twice).

I would hope there would be psychological markers that would indicate whether Bamber was capable of such a heinous act.

Similarly, with his sister. Just because she was schizophrenic, it doesn't mean she was necessarily prone to such acts.

I understand that Bamber is willing to undertake a lie detector test, so it would seem he truly believes himself innocent. Again, not an indication of innocence or otherwise in itself, but certainly an indication of openness to testing.
He has taken, and passed, a lie detector test.

But if you were a complete sociopathic murderer, you would probably be able to pass the test.
Are you sure?

OJ Simpson apparently failed his lie detector test miserably, so being a psychopathic killer certainly doesn't mean you can pass a lie detector test.

What's more, I didn't say a lie detector test was reliable, I said it indicated a willingness to be tested.
OJ wasn't/isn't a psychopath.
Bamber, it would seem, very much is.

I like the series but I'm now getting the impression they're dragging it out.
We get it, the Police were convinced it was murder/suicide, there was one heroic DS who thought it was suspicious, the family were suspicious, Bamber was acting weird.
We've had a few episodes of that so getting down to the nitty gritty would be good. Ending the last episode as Bamber's girlfriend was about to shop him was plain annoying.
except he isn’t a psychopath
https://jeremybamber.org/psychological-reports/

tim0409

4,355 posts

158 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
Muzzer79 said:
I like the series but I'm now getting the impression they're dragging it out.
We get it, the Police were convinced it was murder/suicide, there was one heroic DS who thought it was suspicious, the family were suspicious, Bamber was acting weird.
I’m with you on this; I normally like these series that are based on true crime but this could easily have been done in three episodes.

FourWheelDrift

88,381 posts

283 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
Tyre Smoke said:
Plus it was proven that the sister could not have possibly stuck the gun under her chin and reached the trigger with the silencer fitted. Therefore she must have murdered everyone, taken the silencer off and replaced it in the cupboard, then walked back upstairs and shot herself. Twice.
Not it hasn't, the video I posted shows that is perfectly possible to do.

youngsyr

14,742 posts

191 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
Tyre Smoke said:
Plus it was proven that the sister could not have possibly stuck the gun under her chin and reached the trigger with the silencer fitted. Therefore she must have murdered everyone, taken the silencer off and replaced it in the cupboard, then walked back upstairs and shot herself. Twice.
Or she could have never used the silencer, or she used it and took it off before she killed herself because she found she couldn't use the gun to kill herself with it on.

Derek Smith

Original Poster:

45,514 posts

247 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Perhaps to make room for the phone that she, apparently, moved?

nonsequitur

20,083 posts

115 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
Muzzer79 said:
OJ wasn't/isn't a psychopath.
Bamber, it would seem, very much is.

I like the series but I'm now getting the impression they're dragging it out.
We get it, the Police were convinced it was murder/suicide, there was one heroic DS who thought it was suspicious, the family were suspicious, Bamber was acting weird.
We've had a few episodes of that so getting down to the nitty gritty would be good. Ending the last episode as Bamber's girlfriend was about to shop him was plain annoying.
But isn't that the way TV drama works? Keeps you hanging on until next week. (although most of us know the outcome).

Welshbeef

49,633 posts

197 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
Let’s look at reality.

I’d wager those poor boys were killed first possibly with only the Gran somewhere upstairs
Gran gets it next
Grandad rushes upstairs takes 4 shots falls (killer assumes dead)
Killer goes downstairs
Grandad come to and tries to get downstairs adrenaline pumping catches the killer and have a fight/wrestle the gun away fails and takes 4 more killing him.

So either the mum did it murder suicide if so she then had time to make any moves in the house and kill herself per the 2018 documentary which proves you can pull the trigger if that size and in that gun (another poster has linked a similar video)
Or it’s someone else did the killer use the phone to KO the sister after the boys were killed then killer came back to kill her.

youngsyr

14,742 posts

191 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
Welshbeef said:
Let’s look at reality.

I’d wager those poor boys were killed first possibly with only the Gran somewhere upstairs
Gran gets it next
Grandad rushes upstairs takes 4 shots falls (killer assumes dead)
Killer goes downstairs
Grandad come to and tries to get downstairs adrenaline pumping catches the killer and have a fight/wrestle the gun away fails and takes 4 more killing him.

So either the mum did it murder suicide if so she then had time to make any moves in the house and kill herself per the 2018 documentary which proves you can pull the trigger if that size and in that gun (another poster has linked a similar video)
Or it’s someone else did the killer use the phone to KO the sister after the boys were killed then killer came back to kill her.
At what point does the killer reload a single magazine with 10 bullets, twice over?

youngsyr

14,742 posts

191 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
anonymous said:
[redacted]

FourWheelDrift

88,381 posts

283 months

Friday 31st January 2020
quotequote all
youngsyr said:
Also, there's no proof that the silencer was on the gun at all during the shootings, is there?
The only evidence is they found on the silencer was the enzyme AK1 and they used that to suggest it came from Sheila, but AK1 is also found in rabbits, pigs, chickens and cows not unusual for a farm those facts were never mentioned at the trial.