Why does music sound better on the Radio? Or is it just me?
Discussion
Just because a file is encoded as mp3 doesn't necessarily mean it will be poor quality. Most people would struggle to tell the difference between a CD and an mp3 at high bit rates. The difference does become very noticeable when low bit rates are used though.
The thing about compression, is that it can make music sound better in some circumstances - in cars where the background noise limits the dynamic range you can hear, compression can make quieter parts of the track more audible. It has a similar effect for music played on small radios with limited speakers, where detail would otherwise be inaudible.
Radio stations also have a limited dynamic range available due to transmission constraints. They have to keep their broadcast within a particular deviation from their frequency, and with FM that means limiting the highest peaks of music.
The problem with this is that although it can sound better for a short period or in certain circumstances, if you listen for any period of time or on better equipment, compressed music gets quite tiring as it is all at one volume.
This is quite similar to what happens with poorly mastered CDs that have had the 'loudness war' treatment. This is quite a good explanation.
The thing about compression, is that it can make music sound better in some circumstances - in cars where the background noise limits the dynamic range you can hear, compression can make quieter parts of the track more audible. It has a similar effect for music played on small radios with limited speakers, where detail would otherwise be inaudible.
Radio stations also have a limited dynamic range available due to transmission constraints. They have to keep their broadcast within a particular deviation from their frequency, and with FM that means limiting the highest peaks of music.
The problem with this is that although it can sound better for a short period or in certain circumstances, if you listen for any period of time or on better equipment, compressed music gets quite tiring as it is all at one volume.
This is quite similar to what happens with poorly mastered CDs that have had the 'loudness war' treatment. This is quite a good explanation.
tank slapper said:
The thing about compression, is that it can make music sound better in some circumstances - in cars where the background noise limits the dynamic range you can hear, compression can make quieter parts of the track more audible. It has a similar effect for music played on small radios with limited speakers, where detail would otherwise be inaudible.
I'm sure you know, but file compression is not the same as audio compression. Lossless file compression will never make audio sound better, whereas audio level compression might. With lossless file compression you can never get the information back, whereas with signal compression you stand a chance (so long as you know how it was compressed).http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_compression
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_range_compres...
Zad said:
I'm sure you know, but file compression is not the same as audio compression. Lossless file compression will never make audio sound better, whereas audio level compression might. With lossless file compression you can never get the information back, whereas with signal compression you stand a chance (so long as you know how it was compressed).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_compression
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_range_compres...
I am aware of the difference. For most purposes, a high bit rate mp3 or AAC or whatever file will be indistinguishable from the CD it was ripped from, and if you use FLAC or lossless AAC then there is even less difference. If the CD was rubbish in the first place, you don't stand much chance though. It is one of the reasons I rarely buy CDs these days. It is seemingly impossible to get ones that have been properly mastered so they don't have an average signal level pegged as high as it will go. Even re-released older albums have this done to them, when there is absolutely no need.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_compression
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_range_compres...
There is a setting in itunes and on ipods called Sound Check - it tries to make all tracks sound the same volume, and it can have be a bit odd if the music styles are very different.
Thought I'd resurrect this thread as I stumbled across it while I was Googling to try to find out why music sounds so much better on the radio.
During the lockdown I've been working from home, streaming Radio 2 via a pair of Sennheiser HD650 headphones. I've found that the music just pops so much more via the radio. I've tried immediately listening to the same tracks via streaming services to compare, but they just sound flat and lifeless by comparison. I've read elsewhere that it's due to compression and limiting to make it louder, but I'm not convinced. Stuff that's been mastered to sound loud gives me awful fatigue, but this doesn't, it just really pops and sounds really alive. I've also tried to get the same effect with my own music in Logic Pro, but despite my best efforts with stereo spreads, compressors and limiters on the mix bus, I can't get anywhere near. Do radio stations have some kind of magic box that everything goes through to give it that sound or is there a way that anyone can achieve it?
During the lockdown I've been working from home, streaming Radio 2 via a pair of Sennheiser HD650 headphones. I've found that the music just pops so much more via the radio. I've tried immediately listening to the same tracks via streaming services to compare, but they just sound flat and lifeless by comparison. I've read elsewhere that it's due to compression and limiting to make it louder, but I'm not convinced. Stuff that's been mastered to sound loud gives me awful fatigue, but this doesn't, it just really pops and sounds really alive. I've also tried to get the same effect with my own music in Logic Pro, but despite my best efforts with stereo spreads, compressors and limiters on the mix bus, I can't get anywhere near. Do radio stations have some kind of magic box that everything goes through to give it that sound or is there a way that anyone can achieve it?
Maybe it's psychological ?
So you pop your favorite, often little know, track on your music player of choice and listen to it. But if it comes up on the radio, you think "wow ! they are actually play my favourite song !" Hence you enjoy it much more - so you think it sounds better.
Like eating and drinking - whisky out of big heavy tumbler tastes much better than out of a mug (unless you are in The Sweeney of course !).
So you pop your favorite, often little know, track on your music player of choice and listen to it. But if it comes up on the radio, you think "wow ! they are actually play my favourite song !" Hence you enjoy it much more - so you think it sounds better.
Like eating and drinking - whisky out of big heavy tumbler tastes much better than out of a mug (unless you are in The Sweeney of course !).
outnumbered said:
They certainly do have a magic box or boxes to apply compression and other processing. Used to be called Optimod, now probably something else.
I did a whole load of digging and discovered the Optimod. Orban certainly still make the Optimod devices. I'm slightly surprised that they don't make devices for mastering music recordings if it's considered that music sounds better over the radio when it's processed this way. Why wouldn't you want it to sound the same however you're listening to it?There's a piece of software called Stereo Tool which attempts to achieve the same thing. One of the presets attempts to recreate the Optimod effect - it's demonstrated here - though, again, this is aimed at broadcasters. There's no apparent way to plug it into Logic Pro.
Obviously the effect when listening to R2 is a whole lot better, but at least this illustrates what I'm on about. I wonder if there's a chain of plug-ins that one can use on the mix bus in Logic Pro to get to a similar place?
I'm also of the opinion that when a song comes on that you love it just brightens up your day. Whereas you putting it on yourself just isn't quite the same somehow. Also when I listen to radio it's always on cr@p equipment rather than my hifi setups, as it's invariably in a car or tractor.
As far as quality goes, I like listening to Foo Fighters on the radio for the reason that it is compressed and limited to smooth out the mahoosive differences in volume that the Foos seem to find necessary in their finished product. That and the joy of them being played of course.
As far as quality goes, I like listening to Foo Fighters on the radio for the reason that it is compressed and limited to smooth out the mahoosive differences in volume that the Foos seem to find necessary in their finished product. That and the joy of them being played of course.
Music on Fm will always sound different compared the original cd or "Record"
Back in the day of analogue commercial radio (1970s+) especially in cars when you had to turn the dial to tune in, the loudest station won the listener and the loudness wars started.
In the days of the IBA (Independent Broadcast Authority) FM output was studio out, no limiting or compression, those rules became relaxed and compressor/limiters were introduced. As time progresses and more competition (1980s) more complex "processors" became available, early Optimods (short for optimum modulation) and Innovonics units. They had 5 or more multi-band compressors and limiters as well has very hard final output limiters to prevent over deviation (being too loud).
Over deviation or over modulation ment taking up too much bandwith +/-75khz of the main carrier frequency over deviation could bring big fines to broadcasters. So in order to be the loudest better compressors were needed.
There's also one final trick, some broadcasters added 1-2% speed increase onto music, that increase as well as processing made a huge difference.
I have never worked for the BBC so unsure of their view on added pitch or use of processing. In the commercial world we did allots to give the output the "Edge"
Back in the day of analogue commercial radio (1970s+) especially in cars when you had to turn the dial to tune in, the loudest station won the listener and the loudness wars started.
In the days of the IBA (Independent Broadcast Authority) FM output was studio out, no limiting or compression, those rules became relaxed and compressor/limiters were introduced. As time progresses and more competition (1980s) more complex "processors" became available, early Optimods (short for optimum modulation) and Innovonics units. They had 5 or more multi-band compressors and limiters as well has very hard final output limiters to prevent over deviation (being too loud).
Over deviation or over modulation ment taking up too much bandwith +/-75khz of the main carrier frequency over deviation could bring big fines to broadcasters. So in order to be the loudest better compressors were needed.
There's also one final trick, some broadcasters added 1-2% speed increase onto music, that increase as well as processing made a huge difference.
I have never worked for the BBC so unsure of their view on added pitch or use of processing. In the commercial world we did allots to give the output the "Edge"
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