Virgin lose West Coast franchise to First Group

Virgin lose West Coast franchise to First Group

Author
Discussion

Podie

46,630 posts

274 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
I've gone looking for my mate Barry. He's big.
hehe

Rollcage

11,327 posts

191 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
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Podie said:
Digga said:
Eric Mc said:
Puggit said:
Most of us don't go in that geeks' nest tongue out
How rude and insulting.
And well directed.

And yes, I've been known to lurk in 'that' bit of PH.
Not everyone sees "geek" as being a pejorative term.

Given some of the rude and insulting stuff you've posted in the past Eric, either learn to take it if you dish it out, or wind your neck in.
I think you have slightly "whooshed" yourself there!

essayer

9,009 posts

193 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
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Jasandjules said:
It will be same s**t, different name on the wall.
I think so. A fleet of blue Pendolinos will take some getting used to!

I did hear a rumour they are looking to get rid of the shop, but who knows until they have the reins.

I assume most staff below very senior management will be TUPEd across? No idea how things work in railwayland.

Jinx

11,345 posts

259 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
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OK service - terrible prices - Euston to Liverpool return and Euston to Coventry cost me an arm and a leg. Cheaper if you book many weeks in advance but that's not always possible. It should not be cheaper for two people to rent a car plus fuel than to travel by train.

davepoth

29,395 posts

198 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
quotequote all
essayer said:
I think so. A fleet of blue Pendolinos will take some getting used to!

I did hear a rumour they are looking to get rid of the shop, but who knows until they have the reins.

I assume most staff below very senior management will be TUPEd across? No idea how things work in railwayland.
First trains are purple with pink doors. frown


essayer

9,009 posts

193 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
quotequote all
Oh OK. I had it in my head they were dark blue!

Of course for at least a year they will be red/yellow/white, with a vague peeled-off outline of "Virgin" on the sides and a hastily stuck on vinyl "First West Coast" lettering





Podie

46,630 posts

274 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
quotequote all
essayer said:
Of course for at least a year they will be red/yellow/white, with a vague peeled-off outline of "Virgin" on the sides and a hastily stuck on vinyl "First West Coast" lettering
hehe

Fittster

20,120 posts

212 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
quotequote all
From a customers point of view what would actually change?

I didn't think the franchise has that much flexibility regarding fairs, I don't see why they would offer a less frequent service.

If they only change is to remove a small shop from each train, it doesn't seem a big deal..

Blue62

8,746 posts

151 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
quotequote all
Fittster said:
From a customers point of view what would actually change?

I didn't think the franchise has that much flexibility regarding fairs, I don't see why they would offer a less frequent service.

If they only change is to remove a small shop from each train, it doesn't seem a big deal..
From personal experience of the East coast line and also into Bristol, I do not rate First Group at all, their service is poor and they really strike me as a business that is fixated on short term profit at the expense of service. If they are going to rebate the Govt to the level they are promising, I can see hikes in fares, car park charges and reduced service levels.

No fan in particular of Virgin, but I always opted to go Brum - Euston even though Derby - St Pancras was easier, simply to avoid First Group and their terrible service. I don't see this as good news, was there any consultation with commuters?

JB!

5,254 posts

179 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
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Biggest change will be pricing.

vonuber

17,868 posts

164 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
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I used to do Brum-Euston every other w/e, service was generally rather good. Heard some horror stories about First, not looking forward to it - means probably hiring a car to get back to Manchester for Christmas from London, rather than the train (will certainly be cheaper if slower).

nickdrinkwater

833 posts

189 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
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Blue62 said:
Fittster said:
From a customers point of view what would actually change?

I didn't think the franchise has that much flexibility regarding fairs, I don't see why they would offer a less frequent service.

If they only change is to remove a small shop from each train, it doesn't seem a big deal..
From personal experience of the East coast line and also into Bristol, I do not rate First Group at all, their service is poor and they really strike me as a business that is fixated on short term profit at the expense of service. If they are going to rebate the Govt to the level they are promising, I can see hikes in fares, car park charges and reduced service levels.

No fan in particular of Virgin, but I always opted to go Brum - Euston even though Derby - St Pancras was easier, simply to avoid First Group and their terrible service. I don't see this as good news, was there any consultation with commuters?
I don't think the Midland mainline has ever been operated by First Group. Since I can remember anyway.

Blue62

8,746 posts

151 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
quotequote all
nickdrinkwater said:
I don't think the Midland mainline has ever been operated by First Group. Since I can remember anyway.
Not Midland Line, I'm talking the Bristol Line, pretty sure that last time I used it FG were running it (badly). Is anyone else shocked to see that despite paying out £340m to shareholders last year, Stagecoach received a £68m bailout from the tax payer for the shortfall in forecast/revenue for its third SW trains franchise?


DJRC

23,563 posts

235 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
quotequote all
Jinx said:
OK service - terrible prices - Euston to Liverpool return and Euston to Coventry cost me an arm and a leg. Cheaper if you book many weeks in advance but that's not always possible. It should not be cheaper for two people to rent a car plus fuel than to travel by train.
Standard return Euston to Cov is £40.

Podie

46,630 posts

274 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
quotequote all
DJRC said:
Jinx said:
OK service - terrible prices - Euston to Liverpool return and Euston to Coventry cost me an arm and a leg. Cheaper if you book many weeks in advance but that's not always possible. It should not be cheaper for two people to rent a car plus fuel than to travel by train.
Standard return Euston to Cov is £40.
Isn't Coventry a London Midland station?

c7xlg

862 posts

231 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
quotequote all
I think everyone is being a little hard on First Group as such.

From my understanding the rail franchises just transfer from one company to another lock-stock and smoking engine. So when the franchise moves over it will be the same trains, on the same track with the same staff operating. The short term franchise system leaves little room for any return on investments made by the operators. (win the franchise, 6 months to figure out what needs fixing, 12-24 months to 'fix it', leaving only 4-5 years to make back all your investment in the savings offered AND a profit before potentially losing the francise).

Remember First Group run pretty much all the trains in Scotland, lots of the UK buses, most of the yellow school buses in american, Greyhound and quite a lot of police cars, fire engines etc etc. They might possibly know as much, if not more about how to run a good transport service than a branding company who are just as interested in soft drinks, broadband and planes as they are in trains....

toppstuff

13,698 posts

246 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
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c7xlg said:
I think everyone is being a little hard on First Group as such.
Not being hard enough on them as far as I am concerned.

Now, of course, they own a lot of businesses. It may be that they run a perfectly decent Scottish bus service.

The railway company they have run connecting London to the West of England is something that has been a part of my life for more many years. As far as that business is concerned, they deserve all the criticism they get and more. Which is why it is so surprising that they get awarded with another rail service to cynically run , abuse their monopoly, only to probably give it up early in a few years time having milked as much as they can out of it.

fido

16,752 posts

254 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
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^They are the Group4 of the train world!

anonymous-user

53 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
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Jasandjules said:
It will be same s**t, different name on the wall.
I'm assuming an awful lot of the extra ticket/tax money will be wasted on painting and rebranding trains, station kiosks, uniforms etc, reminds me of how the Jobcentres were rebranded from green to blue then green, another wonderful waste of taxpayers money frown

plasticpig

12,932 posts

224 months

Wednesday 15th August 2012
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Can Virgin Trains keep their trains if they want to and not transfer them? How would First Group operate without trains?