another abuse gang
Discussion
Nazir Afzal, the former chief crown prosecutor in the north-west, who brought prosecutions over the Rochdale grooming gangs, welcomed the report. “It confirms that white men remain the most common offenders, which is something rarely mentioned by rightwing commentators,” he said.
“However, it is not shy in reflecting that south Asian and British Pakistani men are disproportionately found in high-profile cases.
So the Guardian, unsurprisingly, chooses to pick a narrative that fits it's rhetoric. What the report and the concluding quote says is that it's not as simple as some are saying, but there are some disproportionate figures. Saying that 'most abuse is by white men' in a country that's 85% white is hardly a noteworthy statistic.
“However, it is not shy in reflecting that south Asian and British Pakistani men are disproportionately found in high-profile cases.
So the Guardian, unsurprisingly, chooses to pick a narrative that fits it's rhetoric. What the report and the concluding quote says is that it's not as simple as some are saying, but there are some disproportionate figures. Saying that 'most abuse is by white men' in a country that's 85% white is hardly a noteworthy statistic.
IIRC white evil doers tended to be individuals. Still evil feckers.
It is the gangs of 20+ individuals all the same ethic background, all from the same devoutly religious ( apparently ) background that is a newish phenomenon here.
Somehow - It doesn't involve
Hindu's
Seikh's
Wee Free Kirk of Scotland
Plymouth Brethern
JW
Amish
etc
99% of the time - all the perpetrators are from the Religion of Peace.
Do all the followers of the Religion of Peace want to gang rape your daughters? Of course not.
But the Religion of Peace followers do make up a rather unhealthy number of prisoners and especially gang rape.
As uncomfortable as it is to hear - there is something in the background, the belief, the teachings - whatever - that makes it stick in the mind - that it is OK to gang rape non Muslim children.
Or - why are none of the other religions above in the news week in , week out.?
It is the gangs of 20+ individuals all the same ethic background, all from the same devoutly religious ( apparently ) background that is a newish phenomenon here.
Somehow - It doesn't involve
Hindu's
Seikh's
Wee Free Kirk of Scotland
Plymouth Brethern
JW
Amish
etc
99% of the time - all the perpetrators are from the Religion of Peace.
Do all the followers of the Religion of Peace want to gang rape your daughters? Of course not.
But the Religion of Peace followers do make up a rather unhealthy number of prisoners and especially gang rape.
As uncomfortable as it is to hear - there is something in the background, the belief, the teachings - whatever - that makes it stick in the mind - that it is OK to gang rape non Muslim children.
Or - why are none of the other religions above in the news week in , week out.?
It appears to have gone from “not in the public’s interest” to not actually saying anything. There is nothing in there that should cause the public concern, infact there really isn’t much in there.
The three pages on ethnicity reference several pieces of work from 2010 upto 2016 with one from 2020. I’m. Not sure what relevance the early reports are when this appears to have blown up in the last 4/5 years.
Yes this thread started in 2012 but I doubt many studies were done back then into it, people were ignoring it which was the issue.
It references an older piece of research several times - bercowitz ( or similar can’t remember now) why would they use such an old study and not just look arrests and prosecutions over the past few years ? Again data may not be complete but we record names when people are arrested / prosecuted.
It doesn’t seem to differentiate between type 1 and 2, they are all lumped in together, with the standard - data is not complete / accurate and may not be enough to form solid conclusions.
The conclusion appears to be white people commit the majority of sexual abuse in a country that is 88% white, but the data is not complete so we should be wary of drawing too much from it.
Excellent
The three pages on ethnicity reference several pieces of work from 2010 upto 2016 with one from 2020. I’m. Not sure what relevance the early reports are when this appears to have blown up in the last 4/5 years.
Yes this thread started in 2012 but I doubt many studies were done back then into it, people were ignoring it which was the issue.
It references an older piece of research several times - bercowitz ( or similar can’t remember now) why would they use such an old study and not just look arrests and prosecutions over the past few years ? Again data may not be complete but we record names when people are arrested / prosecuted.
It doesn’t seem to differentiate between type 1 and 2, they are all lumped in together, with the standard - data is not complete / accurate and may not be enough to form solid conclusions.
The conclusion appears to be white people commit the majority of sexual abuse in a country that is 88% white, but the data is not complete so we should be wary of drawing too much from it.
Excellent
Good to see that the thread has gone from “all the Asian grooming gangs are doing the sex offending” to “well you’d expect more whites to be sex offenders because there are more of us”.
None of you give a stuff about the victims, never have and never will, it’s just the colour of the victims skin vs the colour of the offenders skin that’s important to you.
None of you give a stuff about the victims, never have and never will, it’s just the colour of the victims skin vs the colour of the offenders skin that’s important to you.
sugerbear said:
Good to see that the thread has gone from “all the Asian grooming gangs are doing the sex offending” to “well you’d expect more whites to be sex offenders because there are more of us”.
None of you give a stuff about the victims, never have and never will, it’s just the colour of the victims skin vs the colour of the offenders skin that’s important to you.
Speak for yourself.None of you give a stuff about the victims, never have and never will, it’s just the colour of the victims skin vs the colour of the offenders skin that’s important to you.
sugerbear said:
Good to see that the thread has gone from “all the Asian grooming gangs are doing the sex offending” to “well you’d expect more whites to be sex offenders because there are more of us”.
None of you give a stuff about the victims, never have and never will, it’s just the colour of the victims skin vs the colour of the offenders skin that’s important to you.
Spot on.None of you give a stuff about the victims, never have and never will, it’s just the colour of the victims skin vs the colour of the offenders skin that’s important to you.
The issue is all about the victims and how they were let down.
The victims who were ignored by the state because it was deemed that "community cohesion", "diversity", "multiculturalism" and not being called a racist was more important than stopping our children being systematically raped and abused.
And yet that same dogma continues with excuses still being made and false equivalences used to obfuscate. It seems that "community cohesion", "diversity", "multiculturalism" and not being called a racist is still more important, to some, than examining the actual truth.
Are the appeasers and apologists really that stupid? At least they can take comfort that nobody ever called them a racist and that, seemingly, is all that ever matters.
The victims who were ignored by the state because it was deemed that "community cohesion", "diversity", "multiculturalism" and not being called a racist was more important than stopping our children being systematically raped and abused.
And yet that same dogma continues with excuses still being made and false equivalences used to obfuscate. It seems that "community cohesion", "diversity", "multiculturalism" and not being called a racist is still more important, to some, than examining the actual truth.
Are the appeasers and apologists really that stupid? At least they can take comfort that nobody ever called them a racist and that, seemingly, is all that ever matters.
Having lived with 3 partners who were the victim of rape - it never leaves them.
In each case - it took them some years for them to tell me about it.
They survived rape - but years / decades later - it still impacts their life horribly.
As to being passed around like meat - I cannot imagine what that does to your mind.
In each case - it took them some years for them to tell me about it.
They survived rape - but years / decades later - it still impacts their life horribly.
As to being passed around like meat - I cannot imagine what that does to your mind.
The reports they drew from under the ethnicity section were;
CEOP 2011
30% white
28% asian
Data may not be reliable
CEOP 2013
between 50% and 75% of offenders were asian.
Data may not be reliable
Berelowitz 2012
White was the largest category
This was looking back over the past 10 years, so hardly up to date.
It did not distinguish between groups and gangs
Childrens Commissioner 2014
42% White
17% black
14% asian
Data may not be reliable
Police Foundation Bristol 2016
Ethnic minorities are over represented.
Data may not be reliable
It appears that the Home Office did no work of its own in compiling this research, it merely copied from / read some old outdated reports where the data "may not be reliable".
"There is a limited amount of research looking at the ethnicity of offenders, which makes drawing conclusions difficult".
DO SOME ******* RESEARCH THEN !
What would it have cost to have a couple of civil servants/ graduates go through a list of people convicted and or jailed for child sexual abuse over the past 4 years noting;
Their name
Whether individual or not
Whether type 1 or type 2 abuse.
I appreciate name does not necessarily mean ethnicity / religion but then pay another to check this information against records held.
If somebody handed this in at school as a piece of research they would fail, it appears to have been a complete waste of money / time and shows nothing.
Whoever produced this should be sacked and whoever decided it was fit to be published should resign.
CEOP 2011
30% white
28% asian
Data may not be reliable
CEOP 2013
between 50% and 75% of offenders were asian.
Data may not be reliable
Berelowitz 2012
White was the largest category
This was looking back over the past 10 years, so hardly up to date.
It did not distinguish between groups and gangs
Childrens Commissioner 2014
42% White
17% black
14% asian
Data may not be reliable
Police Foundation Bristol 2016
Ethnic minorities are over represented.
Data may not be reliable
It appears that the Home Office did no work of its own in compiling this research, it merely copied from / read some old outdated reports where the data "may not be reliable".
"There is a limited amount of research looking at the ethnicity of offenders, which makes drawing conclusions difficult".
DO SOME ******* RESEARCH THEN !
What would it have cost to have a couple of civil servants/ graduates go through a list of people convicted and or jailed for child sexual abuse over the past 4 years noting;
Their name
Whether individual or not
Whether type 1 or type 2 abuse.
I appreciate name does not necessarily mean ethnicity / religion but then pay another to check this information against records held.
If somebody handed this in at school as a piece of research they would fail, it appears to have been a complete waste of money / time and shows nothing.
Whoever produced this should be sacked and whoever decided it was fit to be published should resign.
colin_p said:
The issue is all about the victims and how they were let down.
The victims who were ignored by the state because it was deemed that "community cohesion", "diversity", "multiculturalism" and not being called a racist was more important than stopping our children being systematically raped and abused.
And yet that same dogma continues with excuses still being made and false equivalences used to obfuscate. It seems that "community cohesion", "diversity", "multiculturalism" and not being called a racist is still more important, to some, than examining the actual truth.
Are the appeasers and apologists really that stupid? At least they can take comfort that nobody ever called them a racist and that, seemingly, is all that ever matters.
For the sake of diversity me old mate. Just don’t mention the war. God knows what middle class Indians think of this. For a population of only 1.something million it’s quite a list. Gang rape, cash for crash, forced marriage, consanguineous marriage, driving test fraud, driving licence fraud, widespread contempt of car insurance , taxi licence fraud, tax evasion, high level drug dealing, environmental health offences, council house subletting, no go areas for white/ officialdom, parking wardens/ utility workers need police protection. The victims who were ignored by the state because it was deemed that "community cohesion", "diversity", "multiculturalism" and not being called a racist was more important than stopping our children being systematically raped and abused.
And yet that same dogma continues with excuses still being made and false equivalences used to obfuscate. It seems that "community cohesion", "diversity", "multiculturalism" and not being called a racist is still more important, to some, than examining the actual truth.
Are the appeasers and apologists really that stupid? At least they can take comfort that nobody ever called them a racist and that, seemingly, is all that ever matters.
markcoznottz said:
God knows what middle class Indians think of this
Sikhs new all about these predatory practices 40 odd years ago and tried to take appropriate action. However, without the full, explicit support of the authorities, it is still an issue for them.https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6428197/S...
https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-new...
Spectator calling it out for the nonsense it is.
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-home-offic...
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-home-offic...
Now that we know more about it, I think we can safely conclude it's a bloody farce.
It's almost as if they knew what conclusion they wanted to find and conducted the investigation accordingly.
The article from the Guardian is almost satirical in it's cherry picking and presentation of information. How do they sleep at night having been so knowingly deceitful?
It's almost as if they knew what conclusion they wanted to find and conducted the investigation accordingly.
The article from the Guardian is almost satirical in it's cherry picking and presentation of information. How do they sleep at night having been so knowingly deceitful?
No apologies at all for a Daily Mail link;
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9070905/D...
The comments are well worth a read as well.
It further demonstrates why the massive scale of the abuse was allowed to happen and why it could and or continue happening.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9070905/D...
The comments are well worth a read as well.
It further demonstrates why the massive scale of the abuse was allowed to happen and why it could and or continue happening.
Interesting article, despite being in the Wail. I have to repeat my commendation of Javid's approach to this when he was Home Secretary.
O/T: I also repeat my lament that he's no longer in that role, because i thought he was the best we've had for many, many years, not least because his brother is a senior ranking police officer and there fore very clearly gave him an unvarnished glimpse of the reality - underfunding, lack of numbers etc. etc. for the force.
What the report and reaction show is the abject lack of understanding of statistics and the paucity of the data collated. One issue that ought to stand out, like a turd in a doorway, is the fact that only 8% of British population is "Asian", so even notwithstanding the acutely pronounced skew toward Asians from a much more specific background, you see the CSA stats being extremely alarming.
All CSA gangs deserve scrutiny, but where there is a very clear link to specific communities, it must be pursued. This was what the original reports and concerns of the likes of Jane Senior and Tom Watson fought so hard to highlight and yet, it seems, even now are being ignored.
O/T: I also repeat my lament that he's no longer in that role, because i thought he was the best we've had for many, many years, not least because his brother is a senior ranking police officer and there fore very clearly gave him an unvarnished glimpse of the reality - underfunding, lack of numbers etc. etc. for the force.
What the report and reaction show is the abject lack of understanding of statistics and the paucity of the data collated. One issue that ought to stand out, like a turd in a doorway, is the fact that only 8% of British population is "Asian", so even notwithstanding the acutely pronounced skew toward Asians from a much more specific background, you see the CSA stats being extremely alarming.
All CSA gangs deserve scrutiny, but where there is a very clear link to specific communities, it must be pursued. This was what the original reports and concerns of the likes of Jane Senior and Tom Watson fought so hard to highlight and yet, it seems, even now are being ignored.
freakybacon said:
That's tough reading.28 in Calderdale.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/14935746/men-charged...
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/14935746/men-charged...
Edited by mrporsche on Wednesday 12th May 20:48
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