Irish vote of gay marriage
Discussion
MC Bodge said:
And who can blame them?
The Republic of Ireland has changed massively in recent decades. The RC church losing its influence massively being one of the reasons, which appears to be a good thing.
The new situation will eventually mean that UK citizen women in Northern Ireland will have less choice and say than those in the Republic (down to both RC and a religion of a slightly different flavour) I do wonder if/when this will change too.
Many people might consider that any religion losing its influence must be a good thing. Such brainwashing shouldn't be affecting pregnancy.The Republic of Ireland has changed massively in recent decades. The RC church losing its influence massively being one of the reasons, which appears to be a good thing.
The new situation will eventually mean that UK citizen women in Northern Ireland will have less choice and say than those in the Republic (down to both RC and a religion of a slightly different flavour) I do wonder if/when this will change too.
Eric Mc said:
And therefore refused to sanction the abortion - which was the key reason she died. The law made life very, very difficult for the professionals.
But that was not the only tragedy caused by these mad laws. Read through the various stories. Frankly, Irish women had enough.
New laws were brought in to deal with such cases, with little resistance. The vote was about the right to life of the unborn. I think the unborn have a right to life. Irish women clearly had enough...they were vocal and convincing in their arguments. Small babies weren’t so vocal or convincing. They lost.But that was not the only tragedy caused by these mad laws. Read through the various stories. Frankly, Irish women had enough.
GroundEffect said:
MC Bodge said:
Kawasicki said:
AJL308 said:
Kawasicki said:
Robertj21a said:
Kawasicki said:
Sad day for the innocent unborn.
Very much a minority view it would seem.My first thought to MC's point above was "So the best course of action available is TO KILL THEM?"
It's a complex issue, but the flippancy that surrounds it - that fundamentally it's a woman's right to choose - I am starting to feel nauseous about. No one seems happy with 30wk terminations. And we have examples of babies surviving <25ks, so really where in morality does it sit that at 12wks or wherever you pick, it's OK?
Note: I am of course speaking about "any reason" terminations that this vote was for. Severely disabled foetuses or pregnancies from rape I agree should probably have an 'out' option.
Socially I am left-leaning but this one I cannot abide.
I'm all for abortion rights, but that doesn't mean it's a cut and shut issue for me.
Spanna said:
I feel the same now, I used to be a kind of 'so what' about abortion within the legal limits, even as a parent. Now I'm less comfortable with it, especially when you get comments about disabled, under privileged, poor etc. as a justification. I understand the need for abortions to be available, but it's weirdly celebrated as an important women's issue.[
I'm all for abortion rights, but that doesn't mean it's a cut and shut issue for me.
It doesn't mean compulsory abortions for all.I'm all for abortion rights, but that doesn't mean it's a cut and shut issue for me.
I'm not sure why you being a parent means that you don't think that other people can choose what happens to Them.
Edited by MC Bodge on Sunday 27th May 13:59
Spanna said:
I feel the same now, I used to be a kind of 'so what' about abortion within the legal limits, even as a parent. Now I'm less comfortable with it, especially when you get comments about disabled, under privileged, poor etc. as a justification. I understand the need for abortions to be available, but it's weirdly celebrated as an important women's issue.
I'm all for abortion rights, but that doesn't mean it's a cut and shut issue for me.
I'm not a fan of terminations (if they were more liberal I would likely not be here) but it's really about balancing the rights of the mother against the rights of the unborn child. If one had 100% then that would be unfair, and possibly detrimental, on the other.I'm all for abortion rights, but that doesn't mean it's a cut and shut issue for me.
I think the limit for Ireland is going to be 12 weeks which I think is a fair balance. The UK is 24.
PurpleMoonlight said:
I think the limit for Ireland is going to be 12 weeks which I think is a fair balance. The UK is 24.
I believe it will be 12 weeks on request, then 24 for medical conditions that threaten the life of the mother, which is broadly similar to the UK.Once again though, it's worth pointing out that all this vote has done is to remove the criminal aspect of having or assisting in a termination.
Cold said:
I believe it will be 12 weeks on request, then 24 for medical conditions that threaten the life of the mother, which is broadly similar to the UK.
Once again though, it's worth pointing out that all this vote has done is to remove the criminal aspect of having or assisting in a termination.
Indeed. It is not compulsory, introducing eugenics or permitting genocide.Once again though, it's worth pointing out that all this vote has done is to remove the criminal aspect of having or assisting in a termination.
MC Bodge said:
It doesn't mean compulsory abortions for all.
I'm not sure why you being a parent means that you don't think that other people can choose what happens to Them.
Sorry, that reminded me of this I'm not sure why you being a parent means that you don't think that other people can choose what happens to Them.
Edited by MC Bodge on Sunday 27th May 13:59
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIgSTjzrmRg
MC Bodge said:
Spanna said:
I feel the same now, I used to be a kind of 'so what' about abortion within the legal limits, even as a parent. Now I'm less comfortable with it, especially when you get comments about disabled, under privileged, poor etc. as a justification. I understand the need for abortions to be available, but it's weirdly celebrated as an important women's issue.[
I'm all for abortion rights, but that doesn't mean it's a cut and shut issue for me.
It doesn't mean compulsory abortions for all.I'm all for abortion rights, but that doesn't mean it's a cut and shut issue for me.
I'm not sure why you being a parent means that you don't think that other people can choose what happens to Them.
Edited by MC Bodge on Sunday 27th May 13:59
We draw the line at 24 weeks in the UK, I’m fine with it, abortions should 100% be available. I just question the celebration of it, the women’s issue side of it and the moral view. I know 2 women who had abortions when they were young, I don’t think any less of them and I certainly don’t debate it with them because of the emotional difficulty for someone that has gone through it. That doesn’t seem to be too openly discussed either.
Spanna said:
Choosing what happens to them means ending a life. It’s a massive grey area. Abortion gets laughed away by the young and single, which plenty of my friends are and they do. I don’t think I should have any standing or bearing over a person and their choices, just showing my perspective. It doesn’t tackle the point that abortion is a whole grey area of ‘women’s choice’ vs ‘but that’s a baby.’ And what about the father?
We draw the line at 24 weeks in the UK, I’m fine with it, abortions should 100% be available. I just question the celebration of it, the women’s issue side of it and the moral view. I know 2 women who had abortions when they were young, I don’t think any less of them and I certainly don’t debate it with them because of the emotional difficulty for someone that has gone through it. That doesn’t seem to be too openly discussed either.
Who is celebrating "abortion"? The Irish certainly aren't. What they ARE celebrating is the end of an era in Irish life where the wishes of women were held hostage to the power of the church and the end of an era where the state that had been subservient to that church.We draw the line at 24 weeks in the UK, I’m fine with it, abortions should 100% be available. I just question the celebration of it, the women’s issue side of it and the moral view. I know 2 women who had abortions when they were young, I don’t think any less of them and I certainly don’t debate it with them because of the emotional difficulty for someone that has gone through it. That doesn’t seem to be too openly discussed either.
You all should be grateful that the UK has not had such an authoritarian regime in place on this matter fir over 50 years.
Eric Mc said:
Spanna said:
Choosing what happens to them means ending a life. It’s a massive grey area. Abortion gets laughed away by the young and single, which plenty of my friends are and they do. I don’t think I should have any standing or bearing over a person and their choices, just showing my perspective. It doesn’t tackle the point that abortion is a whole grey area of ‘women’s choice’ vs ‘but that’s a baby.’ And what about the father?
We draw the line at 24 weeks in the UK, I’m fine with it, abortions should 100% be available. I just question the celebration of it, the women’s issue side of it and the moral view. I know 2 women who had abortions when they were young, I don’t think any less of them and I certainly don’t debate it with them because of the emotional difficulty for someone that has gone through it. That doesn’t seem to be too openly discussed either.
Who is celebrating "abortion"? The Irish certainly aren't. What they ARE celebrating is the end of an era in Irish life where the wishes of women were held hostage to the power of the church and the end of an era where the state that had been subservient to that church.We draw the line at 24 weeks in the UK, I’m fine with it, abortions should 100% be available. I just question the celebration of it, the women’s issue side of it and the moral view. I know 2 women who had abortions when they were young, I don’t think any less of them and I certainly don’t debate it with them because of the emotional difficulty for someone that has gone through it. That doesn’t seem to be too openly discussed either.
You all should be grateful that the UK has not had such an authoritarian regime in place on this matter fir over 50 years.
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