Man in Scotland arrested over dog's 'Nazi salute'.

[anonymous-user]

Britain invented freedom of speech in the C17 and it has survived more or less intact since then, although subject to pressures and challenges (as in this case). The Americans developed free speech further, and the First Amendment is tougher than Art 10.

Art 10 is not, however, always too wishy washy. It reflects English common law, as does much of the ECHR, which is not surprising as the drafting was heavily influenced by a British lawyer and Conservative politician called David Maxwell Fyfe ( stick that in yer pipe, Daily Mail and T May etc).

Art 10 is a qualified right and free speech can be displaced in various circumstances, but the UK and Strasbourg case law on Art 10 uses language such as "necessary in a democratic society" and "proprortionate means to secure a legitimate aim". Encroachments on free speech need proper justification. Let's see if there is an appeal in this case.

[NJH]

The Equality and Human Rights commission guidance is what led me to cite article 10 of the ECHR earlier, reading their guidance its hard to believe this case will not end up being thrown out or overturned at some point, surely.

https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/publication...

[kowalski655]

It certainly should be overturned, for the Count's sake, but AIUI(& Breadvan will correct me if Im wrong(with rolled eyes & a muttered "stupid boy") the Sheriff's decision doesnt create a precedent that others in Scotland,or E&W, need to follow, but Im sure it will embolden the PF to run more cases like this

[anonymous-user]

You are not wrong ("Don't tell him, Pike!"). The Sheriff's decision creates no precedent. As you suggest, however, it might embolden an idiot prosecutor.

[Goaty Bill 2]

Indeed, very much the concern I have for the immediate future.

The sooner this absurdity is officially nipped in the bud the better.

[moanthebairns]

£800 fine.

[Donbot]

£800 after inciting genocide and religious hatred. Got off lightly.

What a waste of time and money.

Edit - Just to make this clear I have been following this from the start and I don't believe he should have been arrested, let alone it being dragged through court for years.

Edited by Donbot on Monday 23 April 13:24

[ezi]

Donbot said:

£800 after inciting genocide and religious hatred. Got off lightly.

What a waste of time and money.

You are joking, right?

[Donbot]

ezi said:

You are joking, right?

Dankula apparently wasn't

[Order66]

ezi said:

You are joking, right?

Even if they were, context is irrelevant

[Janluke]

moanthebairns said:

£800 fine.

Ridiculous that it ever got to court and interesting to see lots of high profile people expressing concerns

Feels like the court settled for something that was just enough that they didnt lose face but not harsh enough make this a big issue.

I wonder if he will appeal

[Russian Troll Bot]

At least we can all sleep safely in our beds knowing that our taxes were well spent in bringing this vile criminal to justice

[threespires]

I hope he does appeal and the charge gets squashed.

[FN2TypeR]

Shamelessly nicked from Twitter

[voyds9]

Not the fine that's the problem, it's the conviction.

[ape x]

Got to be worth £800 for the fact it made him 'famous' overnight, even the American youtubers picked it up, he can go on to have a good career out of this now....
He played and won the internet...good on him.

[audidoody]

Donbot said:

£800 after inciting genocide and religious hatred. Got off lightly.

What a waste of time and money.

Making fun of the Nazis and Hitler has been going on for the last 70 years. Charlie Chaplin did it in the 'Great Dictator', the BBC did it with "Dad's Army" and "'ello, 'ello' while Mel Brookes (Jewish) did a masterful piss-take of Hitler in "The Producers".

You'd have to be hugely simple not to understand that Mark Meechan's saluting pug was in the same context.

I would have thought it was pretty obvious to anyone with a functioning synapse that he wasn't literally attempting to incite the nation's pugs to go out and gas Jews.

I believe him when he explained he was using the abomination of Nazi Germany to make his girlfriend realise the dog wasn't the cutest thing on earth. And to illustrate (INMHO) how German citizens could be hypnotised into participating in the most gruesome event in world history.

Personally, I didn't think it was THAT funny and I thought "Springtime For Hitler" was much better comedy.

But anyone who thinks that Meechan was seriously intending for Jews to be gassed by a dog needs to step away from social media for a couple of weeks

And if you want to accuse me of anti-Semitism my Rabbi will be happy to give you a second opinion.

Edited by audidoody on Monday 23 April 13:24

[irocfan]

Will they now try and prosecute Mel Brooks for The Hitler Rap?

[chris watton]

Reminds me of the early '90's film Demolition Man..

[Order66]

audidoody said:

You'd have to be hugely simple not to understand that Mark Meechan's saluting pug was in the same context.

I would have thought it was pretty obvious to anyone with a functioning synapse that he wasn't literally attempting to incite the nation's pugs to go out and gas Jews.

I believe him when he explained he was using the abomination of Nazi Germany to make his girlfriend realise the dog wasn't the cutest thing on earth. And to illustrate (INMHO) how German citizens could be hypnotised into participating in the most gruesome event in world history.

The real tragedy of this case is that the PF office and sheriff seem to have accepted the context and that Dankula was not a Nazi sympathiser, but they have ruled on the basis that the context is irrelevant and that the interpretation by the supposed victim is all that is important. This is a very dangerous road to walk down.