Discussion
Merkel is doing what politicians with a massive problem do, oh look, a squirrel........
Anything to take away the ridiculous structure of the Euro and what the Germans will have to swallow to sort it out will be deployed during the run up to the German elections.
It would be hilarious if it wasn't so serious.
Merkel isn't stupid, she knows the UK will put restrictions on immigration, its none of her business what we do. We will also set our own laws with regards to workers rights. All she is trying to do with these comments is shore up her position in terms of trying to make the EU look more important than it is, countries can and do have fair and sensible migration and workers rights without the nonsense of the EU to pay for, but you cant be allowed to think that if you are in the EU club.
Meanwhile, Italy is losing its skilled youth by the bucket load, youth unemployment is enormous throughout the EU, the southern nations are in permanent austerity, the eastern block demographic is aging at alarming rates due to migration to the west and Germany racks up yet more IOU's from the south that will blow the EU apart and bring the German economy crashing when the Euro splits and the real value of the German Euro is priced into its currency.
If I were Merkel I'd want to lose the next election and do a Blair, because its going to make the Brown PM era look like nirvana when this goes tits up.
Anything to take away the ridiculous structure of the Euro and what the Germans will have to swallow to sort it out will be deployed during the run up to the German elections.
It would be hilarious if it wasn't so serious.
Merkel isn't stupid, she knows the UK will put restrictions on immigration, its none of her business what we do. We will also set our own laws with regards to workers rights. All she is trying to do with these comments is shore up her position in terms of trying to make the EU look more important than it is, countries can and do have fair and sensible migration and workers rights without the nonsense of the EU to pay for, but you cant be allowed to think that if you are in the EU club.
Meanwhile, Italy is losing its skilled youth by the bucket load, youth unemployment is enormous throughout the EU, the southern nations are in permanent austerity, the eastern block demographic is aging at alarming rates due to migration to the west and Germany racks up yet more IOU's from the south that will blow the EU apart and bring the German economy crashing when the Euro splits and the real value of the German Euro is priced into its currency.
If I were Merkel I'd want to lose the next election and do a Blair, because its going to make the Brown PM era look like nirvana when this goes tits up.
jjlynn27 said:
So nothing right now? Which particular 'control' was blighting your life?
I thought this was a thread about Angela Merkel ?Still, as you're clearly a very disgruntled 'Remainer', perhaps you can explain why I should need to have a benefit 'right now' ? Like many others, my vote to leave was based on the longer term, not anything 'right now'.
Why would you expect anything right now ? Seems a very odd question.
jjlynn27 said:
So nothing right now? Which particular 'control' was blighting your life?
It's not about any particular control; Dan Hannan describes the issue, better than I can here. It's forty odd minutes, but even if you disagree with him, he speaks so well that you might perhaps hear him out.Robertj21a said:
jjlynn27 said:
So nothing right now? Which particular 'control' was blighting your life?
I thought this was a thread about Angela Merkel ?Still, as you're clearly a very disgruntled 'Remainer', perhaps you can explain why I should need to have a benefit 'right now' ? Like many others, my vote to leave was based on the longer term, not anything 'right now'.
Why would you expect anything right now ? Seems a very odd question.
As for Merkel, she was written off so many times on the number of threads within NP&E. By the same people predicting / hoping for victory by dutch numpty and Le Pen. She seems to be quite comfortable from here.
jjlynn27 said:
Robertj21a said:
jjlynn27 said:
So nothing right now? Which particular 'control' was blighting your life?
I thought this was a thread about Angela Merkel ?Still, as you're clearly a very disgruntled 'Remainer', perhaps you can explain why I should need to have a benefit 'right now' ? Like many others, my vote to leave was based on the longer term, not anything 'right now'.
Why would you expect anything right now ? Seems a very odd question.
Sway said:
Disastrous said:
Sway said:
Disastrous said:
amgmcqueen said:
http://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/news/angela-merkel-...
Has she been on the weed again? Does she even understand why Brexit happened?
Once again, staggering arrogance shown from the self-appointed Furher of Europe!
What else is she meant to say??Has she been on the weed again? Does she even understand why Brexit happened?
Once again, staggering arrogance shown from the self-appointed Furher of Europe!
Ignoring the ridiculous nature of that comment when she's trying to appeal to German voters, not EU apparatchiks, how on earth does she even think that's achievable?
Bottom line is, the EU countries will need to be seen to be coming down hard on the UK. They would be derelict in their responsibility towards the EU if they didn't make it as hard as possible for anyone trying to leave it.
The European people are very offended, if that's the right term, by Britain voting out, so I'd expect that to play quite well.
Though as someone asked a few pages back, no, my German in-laws aren't high level EU economists so obviously you need to take that into account
I'm friends, and work with, lots of Europeans. The plural of anecdote isn't evidence, but I'm yet to see anything that even closely shows normal European Citizens are offended by Brexit. A couple are at most 'disappointed', most are indifferent, a couple envious.
This isn't a message to gain support from the German people, it's squarely aimed at the apparatchiks - who aren't her electorate.
This for me is one of the biggest issues with the EU - the national politicians have started putting 'the EU' above the interests of their own people...
I broadly don't disagree with you, that this is aimed at the EU, but I would bet (on not much more than gut feeling) that most Germans are broadly EU minded, and that toeing the EU line will play well at home.
That said, I think it's a disgrace that any politicians are using people and their livelihoods as bargaining pawns in this.
Disastrous said:
That's fair enough - my evidence is anecdotal at best and I ought to have said 'Bavarians' rather than 'Europeans' and I admit they aren't always representative of the whole.
I broadly don't disagree with you, that this is aimed at the EU, but I would bet (on not much more than gut feeling) that most Germans are broadly EU minded, and that toeing the EU line will play well at home.
That said, I think it's a disgrace that any politicians are using people and their livelihoods as bargaining pawns in this.
I broadly don't disagree with you, that this is aimed at the EU, but I would bet (on not much more than gut feeling) that most Germans are broadly EU minded, and that toeing the EU line will play well at home.
That said, I think it's a disgrace that any politicians are using people and their livelihoods as bargaining pawns in this.
It seems we mostly agree. The bit I'd challenge is that whilst Germans are perhaps the most EU minded of the various nationalities, I'm not sure I've ever really been aware of any scenario where they've had to suffer any noticeable hardships 'for the greater good' - indeed there's been a couple of occasions where they 'should' have and they resisted it very strongly.
So I'm not sure some specific comment aimed at clearly harming German businesses will go down well at all. Probably not sufficient to have a material impact on her election, and I suppose it's at least feasible those companies are located in areas she's effectively given up on anyway.
I cannot help but find her stance very, very odd though!
Disastrous said:
amgmcqueen said:
http://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/news/angela-merkel-...
Has she been on the weed again? Does she even understand why Brexit happened?
Once again, staggering arrogance shown from the self-appointed Furher of Europe!
What else is she meant to say??Has she been on the weed again? Does she even understand why Brexit happened?
Once again, staggering arrogance shown from the self-appointed Furher of Europe!
Does bullying, threats and blackmailing one of their closest trade partners and allies go down well with German voters...? Britain wouldn't dream of saying such things to any of it's neighbours, like I said unbelievable arrogance from the self-appointed Furher.
amgmcqueen said:
Disastrous said:
amgmcqueen said:
http://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/news/angela-merkel-...
Has she been on the weed again? Does she even understand why Brexit happened?
Once again, staggering arrogance shown from the self-appointed Furher of Europe!
What else is she meant to say??Has she been on the weed again? Does she even understand why Brexit happened?
Once again, staggering arrogance shown from the self-appointed Furher of Europe!
Does bullying, threats and blackmailing one of their closest trade partners and allies go down well with German voters...? Britain wouldn't dream of saying such things to any of it's neighbours, like I said unbelievable arrogance from the self-appointed Furher.
As I said before, I think that sort of human horsetrading is inexcusable from either side but if you introduce emotive language like 'Führer' then you don't move discussions on. You obviously aren't intending to conflate modern Germany with the Nazi party so why use the term?
grumbledoak said:
The dollar is also stored by states in reserve against oil, because oil is priced in dollars. Price oil in something else, states will sell dollars to buy the new hedge currency. The effect of selling half(?) the dollar value on Earth would be difficult to miss.
Saddam threatened to price in Euros.
Didn't Colonel Gaddafi also tout the idea of African nations using a currency other than USA for their oil dealings? Saddam threatened to price in Euros.
Disastrous said:
amgmcqueen said:
Disastrous said:
amgmcqueen said:
http://www.msn.com/en-gb/money/news/angela-merkel-...
Has she been on the weed again? Does she even understand why Brexit happened?
Once again, staggering arrogance shown from the self-appointed Furher of Europe!
What else is she meant to say??Has she been on the weed again? Does she even understand why Brexit happened?
Once again, staggering arrogance shown from the self-appointed Furher of Europe!
Does bullying, threats and blackmailing one of their closest trade partners and allies go down well with German voters...? Britain wouldn't dream of saying such things to any of it's neighbours, like I said unbelievable arrogance from the self-appointed Furher.
As I said before, I think that sort of human horsetrading is inexcusable from either side but if you introduce emotive language like 'Führer' then you don't move discussions on. You obviously aren't intending to conflate modern Germany with the Nazi party so why use the term?
The EU by definition is a construct that uses human horsetrading, it could be argued its racist as it favours white Europeans over anyone else. It restricts trade from the developing world which has a larger material impact on those people than any nonsense that will come out of the EU regarding freedom of movement within the block.
jsf said:
Any agreement on anything has an impact on people. It's just as abhorrent to try and damage the financial standing of a country as it is to damage the persons rights to residence, the former tends to have more impact in practice, both can have a negative material impact to the person. So its a bit silly to try and isolate the rights to reside from the overall impact of any decisions made, they all matter if you want to discuss material impacts on peoples lives.
The EU by definition is a construct that uses human horsetrading, it could be argued its racist as it favours white Europeans over anyone else. It restricts trade from the developing world which has a larger material impact on those people than any nonsense that will come out of the EU regarding freedom of movement within the block.
It 'favours white Europeans over anyone else'? Really, it favours them over 'non-white' Europeans?The EU by definition is a construct that uses human horsetrading, it could be argued its racist as it favours white Europeans over anyone else. It restricts trade from the developing world which has a larger material impact on those people than any nonsense that will come out of the EU regarding freedom of movement within the block.
jjlynn27 said:
jsf said:
Any agreement on anything has an impact on people. It's just as abhorrent to try and damage the financial standing of a country as it is to damage the persons rights to residence, the former tends to have more impact in practice, both can have a negative material impact to the person. So its a bit silly to try and isolate the rights to reside from the overall impact of any decisions made, they all matter if you want to discuss material impacts on peoples lives.
The EU by definition is a construct that uses human horsetrading, it could be argued its racist as it favours white Europeans over anyone else. It restricts trade from the developing world which has a larger material impact on those people than any nonsense that will come out of the EU regarding freedom of movement within the block.
It 'favours white Europeans over anyone else'? Really, it favours them over 'non-white' Europeans?The EU by definition is a construct that uses human horsetrading, it could be argued its racist as it favours white Europeans over anyone else. It restricts trade from the developing world which has a larger material impact on those people than any nonsense that will come out of the EU regarding freedom of movement within the block.
jsf said:
jjlynn27 said:
jsf said:
Any agreement on anything has an impact on people. It's just as abhorrent to try and damage the financial standing of a country as it is to damage the persons rights to residence, the former tends to have more impact in practice, both can have a negative material impact to the person. So its a bit silly to try and isolate the rights to reside from the overall impact of any decisions made, they all matter if you want to discuss material impacts on peoples lives.
The EU by definition is a construct that uses human horsetrading, it could be argued its racist as it favours white Europeans over anyone else. It restricts trade from the developing world which has a larger material impact on those people than any nonsense that will come out of the EU regarding freedom of movement within the block.
It 'favours white Europeans over anyone else'? Really, it favours them over 'non-white' Europeans?The EU by definition is a construct that uses human horsetrading, it could be argued its racist as it favours white Europeans over anyone else. It restricts trade from the developing world which has a larger material impact on those people than any nonsense that will come out of the EU regarding freedom of movement within the block.
jjlynn27 said:
jsf said:
jjlynn27 said:
jsf said:
Any agreement on anything has an impact on people. It's just as abhorrent to try and damage the financial standing of a country as it is to damage the persons rights to residence, the former tends to have more impact in practice, both can have a negative material impact to the person. So its a bit silly to try and isolate the rights to reside from the overall impact of any decisions made, they all matter if you want to discuss material impacts on peoples lives.
The EU by definition is a construct that uses human horsetrading, it could be argued its racist as it favours white Europeans over anyone else. It restricts trade from the developing world which has a larger material impact on those people than any nonsense that will come out of the EU regarding freedom of movement within the block.
It 'favours white Europeans over anyone else'? Really, it favours them over 'non-white' Europeans?The EU by definition is a construct that uses human horsetrading, it could be argued its racist as it favours white Europeans over anyone else. It restricts trade from the developing world which has a larger material impact on those people than any nonsense that will come out of the EU regarding freedom of movement within the block.
jsf said:
Jesus you are hard work. Is this deliberate or are you really this impossible to have a conversation with in real life?
I detect he just enjoys arguing with people. Not just a pedant, but one who plays 'devils advocate' at times - no wonder most people don't bother replying to him.jsf said:
jjlynn27 said:
jsf said:
jjlynn27 said:
jsf said:
Any agreement on anything has an impact on people. It's just as abhorrent to try and damage the financial standing of a country as it is to damage the persons rights to residence, the former tends to have more impact in practice, both can have a negative material impact to the person. So its a bit silly to try and isolate the rights to reside from the overall impact of any decisions made, they all matter if you want to discuss material impacts on peoples lives.
The EU by definition is a construct that uses human horsetrading, it could be argued its racist as it favours white Europeans over anyone else. It restricts trade from the developing world which has a larger material impact on those people than any nonsense that will come out of the EU regarding freedom of movement within the block.
It 'favours white Europeans over anyone else'? Really, it favours them over 'non-white' Europeans?The EU by definition is a construct that uses human horsetrading, it could be argued its racist as it favours white Europeans over anyone else. It restricts trade from the developing world which has a larger material impact on those people than any nonsense that will come out of the EU regarding freedom of movement within the block.
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