The economic consequences of Brexit (Vol 2)

The economic consequences of Brexit (Vol 2)

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mondeoman

11,430 posts

265 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
jjlynn27 said:
sidicks said:
rofl

Is that the best you've got?

Remind me what happened when Cameron tried to negotiate a change to way we engage with the EU...?
What's funny?

What happened? Apart from Farage and Co repeatedly telling everyone willing to listen that it's them furiners who are the reason for lack of places in schools, traffic jams, waiting lists in hospitals and that we demand 'suverenity or else!'.
Cameron was sent home with his tail between his legs.

sidicks

25,218 posts

220 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
mondeoman said:
Cameron was sent home with his tail between his legs.
That's certainly my recollection, yet some people would suggest we have significant influence as part of the EU!

jjlynn27

7,935 posts

108 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
sidicks said:
mondeoman said:
Cameron was sent home with his tail between his legs.
That's certainly my recollection, yet some people would suggest we have significant influence as part of the EU!
And yet the actual figures show that voting on pretty much anything went UK way. Out of almost 3000 times it didn't went our way 60 odd times. I do understand that those inconvenient facts have very little meaning when you can parrot the line from breitbart that he 'was sent home with his tail between his legs'.


Leroy902

1,539 posts

102 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
We Brits really are a 'glass is half full' lot, but I fear one way or another, "we is fooked".

If we carry on the path we are, the mere fact we're having to rely on a incompetent buffoon like Teresa May on the survival of the country is bad enough, then we have the vultures from around the world looking to see how they can possibly benefit.
France and trying to move the financial hub of the world to Paris is a prime example.
We can hardly hope 'bankers' having any loyalty to keeping their business operations in the country they're in.
Our only hope is who in their right minds wants to learn a st language known as French?
As things stand, France really do have a chip on their shoulder on the fact English is known as the language around the world, no one gives a st about wanting to speak French anywhere in the world.

I do fear she won't stand a chance.

Edited by Leroy902 on Sunday 23 July 21:16

Murph7355

37,651 posts

255 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
Leroy902 said:
...
France and trying to move the financial hub of the world to Paris is a prime example. ...
Not going to well for them at the moment with one firm noting Dublin and another Frankfurt. Paris doesn't seem to be mentioned an awful lot thus far.

Macron needs to get his skates on unwinding their tax measures against higher earners smile

anonymous-user

53 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
Was ever so Leroy.

Being in or out of the EU doesn't change anything, we live in a world where dog eats dog.

You wont be able to show any period in history where that wasn't the case.

paul789

3,676 posts

103 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
Murph7355 said:
Leroy902 said:
...
France and trying to move the financial hub of the world to Paris is a prime example. ...
Not going to well for them at the moment with one firm noting Dublin and another Frankfurt. Paris doesn't seem to be mentioned an awful lot thus far.

Macron needs to get his skates on unwinding their tax measures against higher earners smile
Paris? (Or even Frankfurt)? Don't make me fking laugh - currently working on a large programme in FS with teams in NY, London, HK and Paris. It's being significantly complicated by the fact that the French insist on 6 weeks down time from now until September. This is not a surprise but it's massively adding cost and complexity.

I'm a former remainer but even I can see that the reality of their work ethic will always be a negative factor for them.

We may well suffer greatly in FS, in London but even with our allegedly low productivity, we are still in possession of formidable strengths.

///ajd

8,964 posts

205 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
Murph7355 said:
It's not biased. There are no positive stories about Brexit.
Finally, the penny is dropping. smile


///ajd

8,964 posts

205 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
Murph7355 said:
Not going to well for them at the moment with one firm noting Dublin and another Frankfurt. Paris doesn't seem to be mentioned an awful lot thus far.
So, there is no clear winner across the EU, the spoils are being split, how terrible.

Still, the loser is universal and clearly defined - London/UK.

sidicks

25,218 posts

220 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
///ajd said:
So, there is no clear winner across the EU, the spoils are being split, how terrible.

Still, the loser is well universal and known - London/UK.
sleep

Jockman

17,912 posts

159 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
///ajd said:
Murph7355 said:
It's not biased. There are no positive stories about Brexit.
Finally, the penny is dropping. smile
Top editing.

anonymous-user

53 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
The economic consequences are:-
1) Wealthy getting richer courtesy of Brexit trashing the value of the £ ( as most companies profits in $ )
2) Professional Brexiteers & establishment figures such as Boris & Farage getting richer
3) Typical Brexit voter getting pooter
4) smile

B'stard Child

28,324 posts

245 months

Sunday 23rd July 2017
quotequote all
Jockman said:
///ajd said:
Murph7355 said:
It's not biased. There are no positive stories about Brexit.
Finally, the penny is dropping. smile
Top editing.
Not like he's ever done that before......................

Murph7355

37,651 posts

255 months

Monday 24th July 2017
quotequote all
///ajd said:
So, there is no clear winner across the EU, the spoils are being split, how terrible.

Still, the loser is universal and clearly defined - London/UK.
What was the net job tally so far? Just so we're clear wink

ATG

20,485 posts

271 months

Monday 24th July 2017
quotequote all
Dr Jekyll said:
ATG said:
"Project Fear" is a label created by the Leave campaign to fool the gullible into thinking there was an orchestrated campaign of fear-mongering from the Remain camp. There wasn't. It's a clever but cynical phrase that allows you to dodge answering any tough questions (everything can be dismissed as fear mongering) while "project" makes it sound all underhand and conspiratorial. It was divisive and discouraged critical thinking. It's exactly the kind of crap you'd expect from the opportunists who were trying to ride the wave of the Brexit campaign. Effective in the short term, and sod the damage it does to political dialogue in the long run.
A few examples from project Fear's nattering nabobs of negativity.

All trade with the EU would cease on Brexit, or possibly as soon as a Leave referendum result was announced.
British tourists would be stranded abroad because their passports would be invalid.
The UK would be chucked out of all scientific projects involving the EU, even those that also involve Switzerland or China.
Foreign trade would become impossible without trade deals.
The NHS would collapse because all non UK born staff would instantly leave.
War would break out in Europe.
The stock market would collapse.
Instant recession ("economic disaster beyond all imaginings").
Emergency budget required within weeks of the referendum to increase taxes.

What they never mentioned was any specific advantage of EU membership.
I haven't wandered into this thread for a while and the drivel posted above illustrates why.

turbobloke

103,742 posts

259 months

Monday 24th July 2017
quotequote all
ATG said:
Dr Jekyll said:
ATG said:
"Project Fear" is a label created by the Leave campaign to fool the gullible into thinking there was an orchestrated campaign of fear-mongering from the Remain camp. There wasn't. It's a clever but cynical phrase that allows you to dodge answering any tough questions (everything can be dismissed as fear mongering) while "project" makes it sound all underhand and conspiratorial. It was divisive and discouraged critical thinking. It's exactly the kind of crap you'd expect from the opportunists who were trying to ride the wave of the Brexit campaign. Effective in the short term, and sod the damage it does to political dialogue in the long run.
A few examples from project Fear's nattering nabobs of negativity.

All trade with the EU would cease on Brexit, or possibly as soon as a Leave referendum result was announced.
British tourists would be stranded abroad because their passports would be invalid.
The UK would be chucked out of all scientific projects involving the EU, even those that also involve Switzerland or China.
Foreign trade would become impossible without trade deals.
The NHS would collapse because all non UK born staff would instantly leave.
War would break out in Europe.
The stock market would collapse.
Instant recession ("economic disaster beyond all imaginings").
Emergency budget required within weeks of the referendum to increase taxes.

What they never mentioned was any specific advantage of EU membership.
I haven't wandered into this thread for a while and the drivel posted above illustrates why.
There sure was a lot of drivel in Project Fear.

The suspicion has to be that it helped the Leave vote.

ATG

20,485 posts

271 months

Monday 24th July 2017
quotequote all
turbobloke said:
There sure was a lot of drivel in Project Fear.

The suspicion has to be that it helped the Leave vote.
Thank you for providing yet another example of what I was describing. Trotting out the phrase "project fear" is a tactic to avoid honest debate.

glazbagun

14,259 posts

196 months

Monday 24th July 2017
quotequote all
ATG said:
turbobloke said:
There sure was a lot of drivel in Project Fear.

The suspicion has to be that it helped the Leave vote.
Thank you for providing yet another example of what I was describing. Trotting out the phrase "project fear" is a tactic to avoid honest debate.
It was the same with the Nats during the Indy Ref. Fortunately the indyref debate was robust despite the dire campaigns.

turbobloke

103,742 posts

259 months

Monday 24th July 2017
quotequote all
ATG said:
turbobloke said:
There sure was a lot of drivel in Project Fear.

The suspicion has to be that it helped the Leave vote.
Thank you for providing yet another example of what I was describing. Trotting out the phrase "project fear" is a tactic to avoid honest debate.
That'll be the 'honest debate' that you already avoided by
1) not wandering into this thread for a while but...
2) ...finally giving in to temptation purely to leave a snidey snear that failed badly

Here's some honesty for you relating purely to the economy and GDP. There's nore honesty around mortgages, house prices, and more besides.

George Osborne: “A vote to leave would tip our economy into year-long recession with at least 500,000 UK jobs lost”

71% of leading economists agreed with Osborne in a survey by Bloomberg published days after the referendum result, but there was no year-long recession starting in 2016 and we have record employment rather than half a million UK jobs lost.

Osborne: vote for Brexit and face £30bn of tax rises and spending cuts in an emergency budget delivered within weeks of a Leave vote.

David Cameron: “The job you do, the home you live in are at risk."

Bank of England: Mark Carney said “It would be likely to have a negative impact in the short term… I certainly think that would increase the risk of recession.”

HM Treasury: “UK economy will fall into recession” and predicted 2016 Q3 growth between -0.1% and -1% with GDP -3.6%

Vested interests ML and Goldmans had a short-term GDP hit of -2,5% on offer, reality refused the offer.

Even the OECD had predicted a short term impact of -1.25% GDP

This was Project Fear concerning the outcome of the vote, not of actually leaving the EU, contrary to false claims from Remainer losers after the fact. Check out this link.

https://twitter.com/EuroGuido/status/7915686422824...

Understandably it's all a bit too honest for Remainers to cope with, even before we get to the end of western political civilisation, mortgages, house prices...

Murph7355

37,651 posts

255 months

Monday 24th July 2017
quotequote all
Does anyone think we'll ever be able to get to a point where we all just acknowledge there was bullst uttered on all sides about something which had never been done before, and concentrate on a bit of positivity for our nation's path forwards?

All we're ever doing is proving that there are no arguments that allow us to accurately predict what Brexit will mean to our economy. It's all simply ultra-biased, opinion reinforcing guff (from all sides).

IME if you tell yourself everything is going to be st and that you are in trouble, quite often that becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. Trying to pretend everything is doomed is as silly as trying to pretend it will all be easy.

What we need is a good dose of "solutions" not "problems". And to ignore the press on both sides who see their only role as stirring up trouble to sell more papers.
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