Snap General Election?

[AndyClockwise]

mx-6 said:

El stovey said:

There is certainly a gap now in British politics for a centrist left party. Perhaps May will occupy this ground with her talk of fairer society? Perhaps the gap is actually also to the right of the conservatives now?

There's actually already a centre-left party, called the Lib Dem's. They aren't an ideal proposition in their current state but they are an existing party with all the supporting aparatus already in place.

May's talked a good game on fairer society but I don't see any evidence of her being a social progressive. There's no gap on the right, this thread and others demonstrate that the right wingers are satisfied with the Conservatives as they are.

The gap in British politics for a centrist left party led to the creation of the SDP in 1981 and so this should mean that the LibDems should be exploiting this position.

Instead the LibDems seem intent on self destruction; Tim Farron is becoming a liability and one candidate has already been dropped for alleged Anti-Semitic views

[turbobloke]

El stovey said:

There is certainly a gap now in British politics for a centrist left party. Perhaps May will occupy this ground with her talk of fairer society?

Agreed on the first point but the second is stretching reality a bit as it paints May as potentially a tactically centre left politician.

Talk of fairer society is copyrighted Labour Party dogma in any case, but what they actually mean is raising tax rates on successful businesses and individuals regardless of whether the tax take increases or not. That's not fairness, it's spiteful and punishing and ultimately self-defeating.

The question is, where and how an electable centre-left Party going to emerge? Also, if it does, where is the economic competence going to come from?

[mx-6]

Likes Fast Cars said:

Or Conservative supporters are just sensible middle of the road people and are not right wingers?

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not saying that all Conservative voters are "right wing", I usually vote that way. I'm saying that those that have views that are what we could surely all agree are to the political right seem to be satisfied with the Conservative at present.

[turbobloke]

mx-6 said:

Likes Fast Cars said:

Or Conservative supporters are just sensible middle of the road people and are not right wingers?

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not saying that all Conservative voters are "right wing", I usually vote that way. I'm saying that those that have views that are what we could surely all agree are to the political right seem to be satisfied with the Conservative at present.

Within the left-field players on PH there does appear to be an unwillingness or inability to distinguish between Right and Libertarian where the two go together. Not that I'm suggesting any of that applies to you.

[Likes Fast Cars]

mx-6 said:

Likes Fast Cars said:

Or Conservative supporters are just sensible middle of the road people and are not right wingers?

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not saying that all Conservative voters are "right wing", I usually vote that way. I'm saying that those that have views that are what we could surely all agree are to the political right seem to be satisfied with the Conservative at present.

I recall years and years ago when May was Party Chairman she mentioned the Tories being called "the nasty party" and she wanted to change that, seems she's succeeding.

[turbobloke]

Likes Fast Cars said:

mx-6 said:

Likes Fast Cars said:

Or Conservative supporters are just sensible middle of the road people and are not right wingers?

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not saying that all Conservative voters are "right wing", I usually vote that way. I'm saying that those that have views that are what we could surely all agree are to the political right seem to be satisfied with the Conservative at present.

I recall years and years ago when May was Party Chairman she mentioned the Tories being called "the nasty party" and she wanted to change that, seems she's succeeding.

Labour inherited that title from McPoison onwards, and under Corbyn they're even nasty to each other with Corbynistas name-calling other Labour Party members (who are not part of Corbyn's Comrades) as Tories.

[Likes Fast Cars]

turbobloke said:

Labour inherited that title from McPoison onwards, and under Corbyn they're even nasty to each other with Corbynistas name-calling other Labour Party members (who are not part of Corbyn's Comrades) as Tories.

How dare they, no member of the Labour party is worthy of being called a Tory. In their (wet) dreams!

[skahigh]

Likes Fast Cars said:

mx-6 said:

El stovey said:

There is certainly a gap now in British politics for a centrist left party. Perhaps May will occupy this ground with her talk of fairer society? Perhaps the gap is actually also to the right of the conservatives now?

There's actually already a centre-left party, called the Lib Dem's. They aren't an ideal proposition in their current state but they are an existing party with all the supporting aparatus already in place.

May's talked a good game on fairer society but I don't see any evidence of her being a social progressive. There's no gap on the right, this thread and others demonstrate that the right wingers are satisfied with the Conservatives as they are.

Or Conservative supporters are just sensible middle of the road people and are not right wingers?

I think the Conservative party at the moment covers quite a large expanse of the political spectrum, from centrist to quite far right, only superseded at that end by the BNP/EDL type facists.

I consider myself fairly centrist, I grew up in a comfortable but relatively modest home with both parents as school teachers, grandfather from a poor family in the valleys who did well for himself and became county treasurer, etc. I have done reasonably well for myself, university educated and now earn a good living but certainly not rich. I've voted LibDem and Labour in the past but voted Tory in 2015 and will again in June.

The traditional elements of the Conservative party, representing the interests of the very wealthy are a big turn off for me but I view the party as the only one currently capable of governing in the interests of business and the economy that I consider necessary for maintaining the stability of the country. I'm a great supporter of the welfare state and have a great deal of sympathy for those unfairly affected by the changes made to it in the interests of austerity but, I also strongly believe it should be a safety net and not a way of life as it has become for many in this country and changes were and are necessary.

I guess my view is really that the country benefits from a regular swing from centre-left to centre-right and back again without going to far in either direction, one focuses on social welfare at the expense of the economy, the other focuses on big business and the economy at the expense of social welfare.

Corbyn and his socialist support represent a fairly extreme left proposition that can do no good for the long term good of the country.

[sidicks]

skahigh said:

I think the Conservative party at the moment covers quite a large expanse of the political spectrum, from centrist to quite far right, only superseded at that end by the BNP/EDL type facists.

I consider myself fairly centrist, I grew up in a comfortable but relatively modest home with both parents as school teachers, grandfather from a poor family in the valleys who did well for himself and became county treasurer, etc. I have done reasonably well for myself, university educated and now earn a good living but certainly not rich. I've voted LibDem and Labour in the past but voted Tory in 2015 and will again in June.

The traditional elements of the Conservative party, representing the interests of the very wealthy are a big turn off for me but I view the party as the only one currently capable of governing in the interests of business and the economy that I consider necessary for maintaining the stability of the country. I'm a great supporter of the welfare state and have a great deal of sympathy for those unfairly affected by the changes made to it in the interests of austerity but, I also strongly believe it should be a safety net and not a way of life as it has become for many in this country and changes were and are necessary.

I guess my view is really that the country benefits from a regular swing from centre-left to centre-right and back again without going to far in either direction, one focuses on social welfare at the expense of the economy, the other focuses on big business and the economy at the expense of social welfare.

Corbyn and his socialist support represent a fairly extreme left proposition that can do no good for the long term good of the country.

Please can you expand on the 'quite far right' policies of the current government?

[BigMon]

skahigh said:

I think the Conservative party at the moment covers quite a large expanse of the political spectrum, from centrist to quite far right, only superseded at that end by the BNP/EDL type facists.

I consider myself fairly centrist, I grew up in a comfortable but relatively modest home with both parents as school teachers, grandfather from a poor family in the valleys who did well for himself and became county treasurer, etc. I have done reasonably well for myself, university educated and now earn a good living but certainly not rich. I've voted LibDem and Labour in the past but voted Tory in 2015 and will again in June.

The traditional elements of the Conservative party, representing the interests of the very wealthy are a big turn off for me but I view the party as the only one currently capable of governing in the interests of business and the economy that I consider necessary for maintaining the stability of the country. I'm a great supporter of the welfare state and have a great deal of sympathy for those unfairly affected by the changes made to it in the interests of austerity but, I also strongly believe it should be a safety net and not a way of life as it has become for many in this country and changes were and are necessary.

I guess my view is really that the country benefits from a regular swing from centre-left to centre-right and back again without going to far in either direction, one focuses on social welfare at the expense of the economy, the other focuses on big business and the economy at the expense of social welfare.

Corbyn and his socialist support represent a fairly extreme left proposition that can do no good for the long term good of the country.

Great post!

This will be the first election I have voted Conservative, mainly because of the reasons you have outlined above.

[mx-6]

Likes Fast Cars said:

mx-6 said:

Likes Fast Cars said:

Or Conservative supporters are just sensible middle of the road people and are not right wingers?

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not saying that all Conservative voters are "right wing", I usually vote that way. I'm saying that those that have views that are what we could surely all agree are to the political right seem to be satisfied with the Conservative at present.

I recall years and years ago when May was Party Chairman she mentioned the Tories being called "the nasty party" and she wanted to change that, seems she's succeeding.

Yes the polls are evidence that she is doing well in terms of public perception at the moment, she looks and sounds like a credible PM and seems to have generally been making the right noises as far as most people are concerned. She's yet to be really tested though and evasive when giving answers to questions, I want to see her really set her stall out and publish a manifesto, then there will be more to judge her on.

Edited by mx-6 on Thursday 27th April 15:14

[jjlynn27]

princealbert23 said:

Why is it only left wing posters who develop this obsessive behaviour on some threads of taking everyone on and trying to always get the last word? It doesn't seem like a healthy thing to do.

Maybe because it's entertaining to see low brow punters who label anyone they disagree with as 'left wing posters'? It's entertaining to watch people like you who can only operate on a binary level, right vs left, good vs bad because that's the only way that the world around them make any sense.
Unclench, it's a car forum, a pastime.

[skahigh]

sidicks said:

skahigh said:

I think the Conservative party at the moment covers quite a large expanse of the political spectrum, from centrist to quite far right, only superseded at that end by the BNP/EDL type facists.

I consider myself fairly centrist, I grew up in a comfortable but relatively modest home with both parents as school teachers, grandfather from a poor family in the valleys who did well for himself and became county treasurer, etc. I have done reasonably well for myself, university educated and now earn a good living but certainly not rich. I've voted LibDem and Labour in the past but voted Tory in 2015 and will again in June.

The traditional elements of the Conservative party, representing the interests of the very wealthy are a big turn off for me but I view the party as the only one currently capable of governing in the interests of business and the economy that I consider necessary for maintaining the stability of the country. I'm a great supporter of the welfare state and have a great deal of sympathy for those unfairly affected by the changes made to it in the interests of austerity but, I also strongly believe it should be a safety net and not a way of life as it has become for many in this country and changes were and are necessary.

I guess my view is really that the country benefits from a regular swing from centre-left to centre-right and back again without going to far in either direction, one focuses on social welfare at the expense of the economy, the other focuses on big business and the economy at the expense of social welfare.

Corbyn and his socialist support represent a fairly extreme left proposition that can do no good for the long term good of the country.

Please can you expand on the 'quite far right' policies of the current government?

No, that line at the start of my post was in reference to their public appeal rather than political substance.

[Likes Fast Cars]

BigMon said:

skahigh said:

I think the Conservative party at the moment covers quite a large expanse of the political spectrum, from centrist to quite far right, only superseded at that end by the BNP/EDL type facists.

I consider myself fairly centrist, I grew up in a comfortable but relatively modest home with both parents as school teachers, grandfather from a poor family in the valleys who did well for himself and became county treasurer, etc. I have done reasonably well for myself, university educated and now earn a good living but certainly not rich. I've voted LibDem and Labour in the past but voted Tory in 2015 and will again in June.

The traditional elements of the Conservative party, representing the interests of the very wealthy are a big turn off for me but I view the party as the only one currently capable of governing in the interests of business and the economy that I consider necessary for maintaining the stability of the country. I'm a great supporter of the welfare state and have a great deal of sympathy for those unfairly affected by the changes made to it in the interests of austerity but, I also strongly believe it should be a safety net and not a way of life as it has become for many in this country and changes were and are necessary.

I guess my view is really that the country benefits from a regular swing from centre-left to centre-right and back again without going to far in either direction, one focuses on social welfare at the expense of the economy, the other focuses on big business and the economy at the expense of social welfare.

Corbyn and his socialist support represent a fairly extreme left proposition that can do no good for the long term good of the country.

Great post!

This will be the first election I have voted Conservative, mainly because of the reasons you have outlined above.

That's good to hear, let's hope you aren't let down and the Conservative government delivers.

I'm a Conservative voter by nature, I've lived through far too many Labour disasters in my lifetime.....

[mx-6]

jjlynn27 said:

princealbert23 said:

Why is it only left wing posters who develop this obsessive behaviour on some threads of taking everyone on and trying to always get the last word? It doesn't seem like a healthy thing to do.

Maybe because it's entertaining to see low brow punters who label anyone they disagree with as 'left wing posters'? It's entertaining to watch people like you who can only operate on a binary level, right vs left, good vs bad because that's the only way that the world around them make any sense.
Unclench, it's a car forum, a pastime.

I pretty much agree, there's certainly quite a few here that are highly polarised and partisan.

[sidicks]

skahigh said:

No, that line at the start of my post was in reference to their public appeal rather than political substance.

Thanks for the clarification.

[princealbert23]

jjlynn27 said:

low brow punters

Aww how sweet. One of the main culprits resorting to insults. Who would have guessed?

[turbobloke]

skahigh said:

...those unfairly affected by the changes made to it in the interests of austerity...

The austerity isn't really that austere, and who's been hit by it isn't a single answer question as it varies from time to time. Also, as always, an objective definition of fair is notable by its absence. In practice it appears to relate to policy where "other people" take the hit.

Spending as a share of national income has fallen though not much as shown above, and we've got deficit and debt issues to tackle - EU style can kicking doesn't do much except put more dents in the can while delaying the inevitable with the disctinct possibility of creating a worse future for our children and grandchildren.

If there are groups of people who in the real world, as opposed to a socialist dreamworld, provide the hard cash that takes care of those less well-off, it doesn't make sense to punish them. The opposite makes sense but it's a bitter pill for subjective fairness merchants to swallow.

[anonymous-user]

mx-6 said:

Likes Fast Cars said:

Or Conservative supporters are just sensible middle of the road people and are not right wingers?

Don't get me wrong, I'm certainly not saying that all Conservative voters are "right wing", I usually vote that way. I'm saying that those that have views that are what we could surely all agree are to the political right seem to be satisfied with the Conservative at present.

She s engaging in both some lefty and right wing policies though. Getting rid of charitable status for private schools, talk of shared society, talk of bridging the wealth gap between London and the north.

Labours lurch to the left has left her with a big area to get voters from. I expect many middle ground floating and former labour voters, people who voted for Blair perhaps will like the sound of May.

I'm not convinced people on the more right end of the conservatives will support her long term, but in the short term, Brexit will no doubt make May more popular with more right wing voters as she has to make Britain more competitive with corporate tax cuts and perhaps less regulation.

I expect more right wing voters will like her positive stance on meeting with Trump early on perhaps rekindling the warm glow they got from seeing Thatcher and Reagan. I wonder if they squint a little and imagine they have Maggie back at the helm.

Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 27th April 13:10

[B'stard Child]

confused_buyer said:

Justayellowbadge said:

The Lib Dems seem to see the Richmond win as a microcosm of this election as a whole. If polling shows Goldsmith ahead it's going to knock them for six.

They should know better to be frank. By-elections have always been a poor guide to what will happen at a General - people vote differently when they know they are electing a Government.

If they lose Richmond, which I think they will, it shouldn't be seen as a disaster for them.

Sarah Olney - will lose Richmond for the Lib Dems

I mean seriously is she the best the Libs could put up............