The Gender Non-binary debate.

[Vealie]

"Vealie, I'm not sure why you are so passionate about proving, with references and links, that trans people shouldn't be allowed, and are horrid activists out to repress 'normal' people and want to take over the world or whatever."

CC - show me where I have said anything even remotely like that. I AM critical of woke, beardy-bro activists though. Their tactics of closing down debate are really tiresome.

8.4L. I demanded no evidence from you. I asked for your take on the topic being discussed. You seem well versed in the legal aspects of gender id so I was asking your opinion. Debating, if you like? Thanks for the screenshots. I'll read them tonight.

[AshVX220]

amusingduck said:

_dobbo_ said:

Whether self ID is a thing or not, a sexual predator can gain access to a place and commit a sexual assault on anybody, at any time. This is not suddenly made easier because they can dress up as a woman to do it.

??

Of course it is. In exactly the same way that it's easier to steal tools from a building site wearing a high vis and hard hat, rather than shorts and a T shirt.

Nefarious people will do nefarious things. They always have and always will. If they feel they need to disguise themselves to do those things, they always have and always will. For many, many years now it would have been possible for someone to cross-dress and become a convincing woman to gain access to places and people.
Any new legislation won't change that. We've never demanded ID from someone to gain access to certain places and we never should.
If people are concerned, just be more vigilant (not vigilante).
With the internet and news media we now seem to think there's a peado round every corner, which is just bks.

[Clockwork Cupcake]

Vealie said:

CC - show me where I have said anything even remotely like that. I AM critical of woke, beardy-bro activists though. Their tactics of closing down debate are really tiresome.

Oh, come on. You came charging into the thread throwing around combative terms, making accusations of sealioning (thank you for introducing me to this term, and also demonstrating what it means), demanding people engage you in debate on things already discussed ad nauseum, and generally being obnoxious.

What you are now doing is something we have seen from several posters before you - softening your stance, setting yourself up as "the good guy who is only asking questions", making out that it is the trans people who are the unreasonable ones. Next you'll be claiming you are the victim, and people are ganging up on you. You'll poke people until you provoke a negative response, and then claim that you are being abused and picked on. As I said, we've seen this MO several times on this thread. You may even be the same person, for all I know.

Vealie said:

Their tactics of closing down debate are really tiresome.

Your tactics of trying to invalidate the debate are even more tiresome. As is having to go over the same ground again and again. It's like a revolving door.

Of course, you'll respond to this post by denying everything and claiming you're the victim. But I know gaslighting when I see it - I've been on the receiving end of it enough times to recognise it.

Edited by Clockwork Cupcake on Friday 15th March 11:33

[8.4L 154]

Clockwork Cupcake said:

Vealie said:

CC - show me where I have said anything even remotely like that. I AM critical of woke, beardy-bro activists though. Their tactics of closing down debate are really tiresome.

Oh, come on. You came charging into the thread throwing around combative terms, making accusations of sealioning (thank you for introducing me to this term, and also demonstrating what it means), demanding people engage you in debate on things already discussed ad nauseum, and generally being obnoxious.

What you are now doing is something we have seen from several posters before you - softening your stance, setting yourself up as "the good guy who is only asking questions", making out that it is the trans people who are the unreasonable ones. Next you'll be claiming you are the victim, and people are ganging up on you. You'll poke people until you provoke a negative response, and then claim that you are being abused and picked on. As I said, we've seen this MO several times on this thread. You may even be the same person, for all I know.

Vealie said:

Their tactics of closing down debate are really tiresome.

Your tactics of trying to invalidate the debate are even more tiresome. As is having to go over the same ground again and again. It's like a revolving door.

Of course, you'll respond to this post by denying everything and claiming you're the victim. But I know gaslighting when I see it - I've been on the receiving end of it enough times to recognise it.

Edited by Clockwork Cupcake on Friday 15th March 11:33

[descentia]

'

Edited by descentia on Sunday 31st March 22:31

[descentia]

'

Edited by descentia on Sunday 31st March 22:31

[_dobbo_]

Vealie said:

Think of any place where society assumes children are safe in the company of women but not in the company of men. E.G girl guides

I cannot think of any place where society assumes children are not safe with men but are with women. That's why I asked you to name one.

You've named girl guides - whatever their rules are about men, it's nothing to do with safety of the children.

[George Smiley]

descentia said:

George Smiley said:

What if the service provider was a male escort with a strict female only rule?

Are you asking for a friend ?

Just asking 8.4L/CC if they were to use such a service provider and said service provider refused (assuming notified up front about the changes) - would that male escort be breaching the act?

[Clockwork Cupcake]

George Smiley said:

Just asking 8.4L/CC if they were to use such a service provider and said service provider refused (assuming notified up front about the changes) - would that male escort be breaching the act?

Dunno.

But what if the moon was made of cheese?

[George Smiley]

Clockwork Cupcake said:

George Smiley said:

Just asking 8.4L/CC if they were to use such a service provider and said service provider refused (assuming notified up front about the changes) - would that male escort be breaching the act?

Dunno.

But what if the moon was made of cheese?

I guess NASA would know the answer.

[descentia]

'

Edited by descentia on Sunday 31st March 22:32

[Clockwork Cupcake]

Don't forget the male heterosexual porn starts who do "gay for pay" (ie. appear in gay porn because it pays well).

If you're in the sex industry, then you can probably separate your own sexual preference from work.

Of course, I very much doubt that George is actually interested in the answer - I think he just wants to keep on banging his drum whilst denying he's doing so.

Edited by Clockwork Cupcake on Friday 15th March 13:22

[The Li-ion King]

George Smiley said:

Isnt it a case that people that are transgender are in the wrong body? Or is transgender a new word for transvestite?

I think there's still regular transvestites, though there's a new subset who just refer to themselves as 'men in skirts'



[url]

|https://thumbsnap.com/0ibSRN6j[/url]

who make no efforts to do the makeup, heels etc, but may find a denim skirt more practical (and cheaper) than a kilt

Plus fashion is changing a lot, this is apparently in for 2019 from what's been shown at London Fashion Week

If there's another heatwave, cue headlines of boys wearing skirts to school, or headlines like this

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/6514743/builders-wea...

Edited by The Li-ion King on Friday 15th March 16:56

[Clockwork Cupcake]

The Li-ion King said:

I think there's still regular transvestites, though there's a new subset who just refer to themselves as 'men in skirts'

[...]

who make no efforts to do the makeup, heels etc, but may find a denim skirt more practical (and cheaper) than a kilt

Plus fashion is changing a lot, this is apparently in for 2019 from what's been shown at London Fashion Week

Wow. It's almost as if those men are just wearing clothes.

Always amuses me how a woman can wear a t-shirt and jeans, and if she does then she's just wearing a t-shirt and jeans. But if a guy puts on a skirt then he's a cross-dresser.

[Halb]

Clockwork Cupcake said:

Wow. It's almost as if those men are just wearing clothes.
Always amuses me how a woman can wear a t-shirt and jeans, and if she does then she's just wearing a t-shirt and jeans. But if a guy puts on a skirt then he's a cross-dresser.

Have you read, MOnstrous Regiment?
A quote from it, 'And a woman by herself is missing a man, while a man by himself is his own master.
Trousers. That's the secret. Trousers and a pair of socks. I never dreamed it was like this. Put on trousers and the world changes. We walk different. We act different. I see these girls and I think: Idiot's Get yourself some trousers!'

[j_4m]

Halb said:

Have you read, MOnstrous Regiment?
A quote from it, 'And a woman by herself is missing a man, while a man by himself is his own master.
Trousers. That's the secret. Trousers and a pair of socks. I never dreamed it was like this. Put on trousers and the world changes. We walk different. We act different. I see these girls and I think: Idiot's Get yourself some trousers!'

Great book, good old fashioned silliness with a sharp satire stick.

[Vealie]

Clockwork Cupcake said:

Vealie said:

CC - show me where I have said anything even remotely like that. I AM critical of woke, beardy-bro activists though. Their tactics of closing down debate are really tiresome.

Oh, come on. You came charging into the thread throwing around combative terms, making accusations of sealioning (thank you for introducing me to this term, and also demonstrating what it means), demanding people engage you in debate on things already discussed ad nauseum, and generally being obnoxious.

What you are now doing is something we have seen from several posters before you - softening your stance, setting yourself up as "the good guy who is only asking questions", making out that it is the trans people who are the unreasonable ones. Next you'll be claiming you are the victim, and people are ganging up on you. You'll poke people until you provoke a negative response, and then claim that you are being abused and picked on. As I said, we've seen this MO several times on this thread. You may even be the same person, for all I know.

Vealie said:

Their tactics of closing down debate are really tiresome.

Your tactics of trying to invalidate the debate are even more tiresome. As is having to go over the same ground again and again. It's like a revolving door.

Of course, you'll respond to this post by denying everything and claiming you're the victim. But I know gaslighting when I see it - I've been on the receiving end of it enough times to recognise it.

Edited by Clockwork Cupcake on Friday 15th March 11:33

Where have you been debating this issue if you think an ongoing discussion with the occasional hotspot makes one of the participants a victim? I'll hold back the tears and respond if you are ok to go on?

When I joined the discussion you were all arguing endlessly about pronouns and misgendering and some of the discourse was quite testy. I joined in in the same spirit. Almost straight away I was asked to stop using the term TRA as some found it offensive. I did. I also moderated my tone. Moving forward i am going to assume it is ok to hold a contrary view and to argue in defence of that view.

Now, to avoid going over old ground I'm going back into lurk mode until a new topic comes up. Hopefully, I'll get onto that topic on the ground floor.

Ciao!

[Gecko1978]

Clockwork Cupcake said:

George Smiley said:

What if the service provider was a male escort with a strict female only rule?

"What if", "what if", "what if". It's all about whatifism with you isn't it.

You're so concerned with edge cases and unlikely scenarios, and using them to show ipso facto that this means that the exception disproves the rule.

what if indeed ffs George I read this debate as I was curious about people's thought process in respect of being trans. I don't understand it really and a sure as hell don't get the 97 or more different categories people seem to have come up with and frankly I am not bothered. Male Female, something else seems to work for me. As for a trans women getting access to women to commit crimes or a trans women wanting to dupe straight men who don't like the idea of trans women. Jesus has it happend to you does it happen at all in any volume to suggest its a actual risk.

people are s regardless of how they identify or claim to identify and you are as likely to be a victim as anyone else.

Also you don't HAVE TO, use the term they want you to use but equally you might try an be civil

Women at work is called Helen, I say women but when I see her I just see a dude with pink hair in a pink dress with child like hair bands. Helen wants to dress like that be called a she then so be it. Who am I to challenge it. It does not affect me, but at same time I don't believe Helen is a women but have no reason to voice that in public etc. She is not a threat to me or anyone so live an let live.

You don't seem to be able to do that which is a real worry.

[George Smiley]

Gecko, come back from a date after you've fked a trans without know g then tell me my scenario isn't a risk

[Gecko1978]

George Smiley said:

Gecko, come back from a date after you've fked a trans without know g then tell me my scenario isn't a risk

how would I fk a trans as you put it without knowing and then know. Your basically saying I meet a great looking women go back to hers etc do the deed all night and then she says Ha Gotcha I used to have a cock.....it's not going to happen is it.

The world is not like that where someone after having sex puts themself in harms way etc. So I either have sex and never find out or she tells me she was a he and I feeling uncomfortable (don't mind admitting that) say what a cock etc.

You are trying to say you have sex enjoy it then feel you have been duped into a homosexual act you would other wise not do.....it's just farcical unless your holiday plans are causing for lady boys in thailand