18 year old electrician paying the tuition fees of 'toffs'
Discussion
SamR380 said:
Breadvan72 said:
Many (not all) of those people who are having the nice time will end up paying the taxes that provide schools and healthcare for less high earners.
I know this is the theory but I look at my freinds and peers (I'm 27) and so many of them are barely earning enough to chip at their loans (with a 6.1% interest rate). I dread to think how the more recent cohorts will get on with £50k on their backs.Obviously those who had a bit of foresight in their teens (or were at least advised well) and chose their degrees carefully are doing fine, they will pay their loan off and plenty of tax beside no problem. The other significant portion who studied 'film' or 'criminology' or some such degree (in their hundereds of thousands)left university and started at the bottom of the job ladder. They are now in a situation where they're behind those who just started working when they left school.
I also know the theory that these popular but not that useful degrees help to subsidise the likes of the engineering and science departments, which are much more expensive to run. That doesn't seem like fair justification to me.
I spend a lot of time thinking about this and have a lot of I RECKONs but realisitcally I'm at work right now... if I get started I might not stop.
Edited by SamR380 on Tuesday 3rd October 10:48
Missing points - irony and hypocrisy strike again 
Take another look, I'll make it esy for you this time.
second time but the first time Left a lot to be desired.
The love are - that was truly superb, and well-timed.
Take another look, I'll make it esy for you this time.
Breadvan72 said:
The love that Corbyn and also some trad labour voters have for Brexit are rather different, and in the case of the latter the love is much less optimistic.
After berating another PHer for poor grammar/spelling you offer that tragic sentence. As I pointed out previously it's Right second time but the first time Left a lot to be desired.The love are - that was truly superb, and well-timed.
SamR380 said:
I know this is the theory but I look at my freinds and peers (I'm 27) and so many of them are barely earning enough to chip at their loans (with a 6.1% interest rate). I dread to think how the more recent cohorts will get on with £50k on their backs.
I'm one of those selfish beneficiaries of free higher education (I thought I'd mention it again to please Fido) who had a deliciously tasty full grant, no course fees & weekly rent of a terraced hovel for £28 if my memory serves. I remember a sit in protest at one or other faculty at my Alma mater, scumbag college on my very first day, over that evil Thatcher cancelling housing benefits for us Trotty layabouts. Oh how times have changed.Fortunately for the exchequer, I have subsequently coughed up many times my state hand outs in income & subsequently, corp tax (it's a one man band Ltd co. so pipe down, fact checkers) which is nice of me, I know. But I look at my ten year old & think what will she do. Aged 18 & asked to make a decision at that tender age on whether or not she should take on more debt in three years than I've ever shouldered in *harumph* years, outside of a mortgage.
And what bearing that decision that will have on her life outcomes. When I was that age, it was - Better yourself Sir? Step right this way. And I did, without thinking twice about it. Pity the kids coming through when they see the world we made for them.
Breadvan72 said:
BoRED S2upid said:
Isn't the crux of the problem here the rediculous level the government decided a degree costs per year? If it were realistic people wouldn't have such an issue. £9000 x 15 on a degree let's say (because really if you can't get 15 people there isn't the demand) that's £135,000 per year per class! How much is a lecturer on again? Some degrees would have a lot more than 15.
Erm ...., you do realise that running a university involves a bit more than just paying a few lecturers, er, don't you? Most universities would not be able to function only on the fee income received from students. They rely also on various business activities, on benefactions from alumni and others, and on direct subsidy. Buildings, labs, libraries, IT systems, security, admin, and so on - all those things cost lots.
Edited by Breadvan72 on Tuesday 3rd October 11:09
turbobloke said:
Missing points - irony and hypocrisy strike again
Take another look, I'll make it esy for you this time.
second time but the first time Left a lot to be desired.
The love are - that was truly superb, and well-timed.
Thanks for making it so "esy".Take another look, I'll make it esy for you this time.
Breadvan72 said:
The love that Corbyn and also some trad labour voters have for Brexit are rather different, and in the case of the latter the love is much less optimistic.
After berating another PHer for poor grammar/spelling you offer that tragic sentence. As I pointed out previously it's Right second time but the first time Left a lot to be desired.The love are - that was truly superb, and well-timed.
turbobloke said:
Missing points - irony and hypocrisy strike again
Take another look, I'll make it esy for you this time.
After berating another PHer for poor grammar/spelling you offer that tragic sentence. As I pointed out previously it's Right second time but the first time Left a lot to be desired.
The love are - that was truly superb, and well-timed.
He didn't, he made a little joke at my expense, so the puritanically humourless observation seems right on the nail. Oh and in the process of making an inaccurate point about spelling, you spelled Easy wrong, genius. Take another look, I'll make it esy for you this time.
After berating another PHer for poor grammar/spelling you offer that tragic sentence. As I pointed out previously it's Right
second time but the first time Left a lot to be desired.The love are - that was truly superb, and well-timed.
desolate said:
Smiler. said:
Out of interest, which ones & how?
Given the pissing and whinging that happens whenever anyone goes on strike let's say."Any worker that goes on strike to try and protect or improve their terms and conditions of employment"
Still, they can't always steal stuff though
Pothole said:
I work with a couple of 20 somethings who studied criminology type thingies and they're earning about the national average wage so paying off their loans and paying plenty of tax and NI. They're also renting privately and running vehicles. Proves nothing, though
Do you think they'd have been better off/worse off/about the same if they hadn't spent three years at university?Personally, I'm not against university per se and I think FE is important. I just think there could be better ways (that might not exist at the moment) for young people to learn.
Breadvan72 said:
May shows her true colours, just as she did with her citizens of nowhere blah. Like Thatcher, whom she palely imitates, May struggles to grasp the concept of society. Most conservatives that I know appear to be only capable of thinking of the welfare of their families and circle of friends and maybe their immediate community, and seem unable to give a toss about anyone beyond that. Over on a nearby thread where income disparity is being discussed, someone said words to the effect "I don't care about what anyone else gets. I care only about my own income", and there's the problem of conservative thought writ large.
Conservatives call themselves realists, and call those who give a toss about people they will never meet woolly liberals and bleeding hearts, and so on, but conservatives seem to disregard the self interested aspects of wider altruism. If people do not have rubbish lives, they may be less inclined to set fire to my posh house or steal all my nice stuff. Thus you might sensibly choose to give a toss about the rubbishness of life for others even if you actually can't stand those others.
I tend to regard conservatives as defeatist pessimists. They have resigned themselves to everything being rubbish and decided that they might as well do as well as they can while the World can go hang. If you have progressive ideas, you tend to be more of an optimist and think that with effort things could be made better. This is one of the whacky and fun things about the Tory version of Brexit. The wild optimism of the conservative leavers is at odds with the usual pessimism that informs conservative thinking. The love that Corbyn and also some trad labour voters have for Brexit are rather different, and in the case of the latter the love is much less optimistic. Corbyn may be an optimist, but he's also a tad deranged.
Do you need a broader brush?Conservatives call themselves realists, and call those who give a toss about people they will never meet woolly liberals and bleeding hearts, and so on, but conservatives seem to disregard the self interested aspects of wider altruism. If people do not have rubbish lives, they may be less inclined to set fire to my posh house or steal all my nice stuff. Thus you might sensibly choose to give a toss about the rubbishness of life for others even if you actually can't stand those others.
I tend to regard conservatives as defeatist pessimists. They have resigned themselves to everything being rubbish and decided that they might as well do as well as they can while the World can go hang. If you have progressive ideas, you tend to be more of an optimist and think that with effort things could be made better. This is one of the whacky and fun things about the Tory version of Brexit. The wild optimism of the conservative leavers is at odds with the usual pessimism that informs conservative thinking. The love that Corbyn and also some trad labour voters have for Brexit are rather different, and in the case of the latter the love is much less optimistic. Corbyn may be an optimist, but he's also a tad deranged.
Edited by Breadvan72 on Tuesday 3rd October 10:23
Edited by Breadvan72 on Tuesday 3rd October 10:44
desolate said:
They seem to spend a great deal of time keeping wages low for a certain type of worker. Why would they do this?
I don't know if you run your own business, or have been involved in running any business .. the thought of this scares me a little ..but all owners/employers will try to MINIMISE their employees wages (in accordance with legal requirements of course) - well public services are no different. Except when they need to buy their votes.
fido said:
I don't know if you run your own business, or have been involved in running any business .. the thought of this scares me a little ..
but all owners/employers will try to MINIMISE their employees wages (in accordance with legal requirements of course) - well public services are no different. Except when they need to buy their votes.
I do and have done for years. but all owners/employers will try to MINIMISE their employees wages (in accordance with legal requirements of course) - well public services are no different. Except when they need to buy their votes.
I have never tried to minimise employee wages, that would be incredibly shortsighted of me.
Uni students are just *posh benefit-scroungers*.
They are *grown adults* who want someone to give them free money for 3-6 years to go drinking and banging.
Grown adults (not kids) who moan relentlessly about their £30k graduation "debt"... but can't wait to get a £30k BMW on PCP debt... and a £3k diving holiday in Thailand on creditcard debt... and a £300k shed on a cringey newbuild estate with even more debt...
They are just chancers and scroungers.
They are *grown adults* who want someone to give them free money for 3-6 years to go drinking and banging.
Grown adults (not kids) who moan relentlessly about their £30k graduation "debt"... but can't wait to get a £30k BMW on PCP debt... and a £3k diving holiday in Thailand on creditcard debt... and a £300k shed on a cringey newbuild estate with even more debt...
They are just chancers and scroungers.
fido said:
Okay based on your expertise, if you ran the NHS would you increase everyone's wages? (I think the total bill is currently around 48 billion)
The NHS is beyond f
ked and way out of my area of expertise.I would say that if I was looking at controlling public sector expenditure I wouldn't be looking at the wages of nurses and hospital cleaners (As an example)
Yipper said:
Uni students are just *posh benefit-scroungers*.
They are *grown adults* who want someone to give them free money for 3-6 years to go drinking and banging.
Grown adults (not kids) who moan relentlessly about their £30k graduation "debt"... but can't wait to get a £30k BMW on PCP debt... and a £3k diving holiday in Thailand on creditcard debt... and a £300k shed on a cringey newbuild estate with even more debt...
They are just chancers and scroungers.
Sometimes, NPE really delivers! Usually you need a Muslim thread to get that level of primo quality NPE, but that's a humdinger! Thanks and well done!They are *grown adults* who want someone to give them free money for 3-6 years to go drinking and banging.
Grown adults (not kids) who moan relentlessly about their £30k graduation "debt"... but can't wait to get a £30k BMW on PCP debt... and a £3k diving holiday in Thailand on creditcard debt... and a £300k shed on a cringey newbuild estate with even more debt...
They are just chancers and scroungers.
Anyway, must dash, off to visit my mum who is being looked after in a university that has a hospital for some reason. They've even got some experienced doctors there who are graduate students or something. Yeah, weird, I know.
I hope that road designed by that engineer dude is finished. If not I will just have to listen to the radio in my car designed by some other engineer dude. Perhaps I will listen to some music performed by some wastrels with music degrees.
Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 3rd October 11:46
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff