Old tyres bill blocked again

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Discussion

ChemicalChaos

Original Poster:

10,360 posts

159 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
Apologies if there is a thread already on this, I did search a fair bit.

Anyway, a few years ago a woman's son was killed in a coach crash caused by a 20 year old tyre delaminating. Since the inquest, she has been lobbying government to change the law, and ban tyres over 10 years old from the road.
It's a simple premise and easy go enforce. Germany already does similar.
Tyres have a date of manufacture code in the sidewall which could be checked at each mot. Old tyres, apart from dubious carcass condition and the more obvious sidewall cracks, also have scarily poor wet grip as the rubber goes off.
Not only would the roads be safer, but there would be even be a boost to the economy from increased tyre sales.

Seems like a no brainer, right?

So WHY THE fk was the bill blocked for the 3RD TIME in the commons last night by the Conservatives? What is this "more research needed" that they cited as an excuse?

jmorgan

36,010 posts

283 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
Who is lobbying the Cons?

Murph7355

37,648 posts

255 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
Probably frightened to death they'll get accused of pricing the poor off the road, or hitting the motorist in the wallet again.

Why 10yrs? I thought tyres were meant to drop off at 7-8.

spaximus

4,230 posts

252 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
Probably more to do with commercial tyres being retreaded onto an old carcase. It is big business and there is no evidence to my knowledge that old tyres are that dangerous.

Manufacturers want us to buy new tyres when they are not worn out and having worked in the tyre industry I very rarely saw old tyres that would not be picked up by an mot as the wear was obvious and visible cracks are easy to spot.

In fact it was usually the high mileage cars that had worn tyres that should have been changed. If an old tyres is stored correctly there is no issue in selling one that has been in storage a few years, but if stored in bright sunlight or at the bottom of a pile then yes there is an increased risk.

I would hazard a guess that those who voted had access to all sorts of information and concluded that there isn't a large issue to fix. And know classic vehicles are MOT exempt how would it be policed if made law?

You can sympathise with the mother but it has to be fact based and Germany is slightly different as higher speeds on Autobahn are regular and they use winter tyres as well so not comparable in many ways.

TooMany2cvs

29,008 posts

125 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
spaximus said:
And know classic vehicles are MOT exempt how would it be policed if made law?
In the exact same way as minimum tread or cracking is going to be policed on those vehicles.

It's not just the Bestival coach crash.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-23320526

There was a guy killed when an old tyre blew on his MG.
https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/great...

I binned some Michelins from SWMBO's 2cv a while back - they were just over 10yo, plenty of tread, and had always been stored properly inflated on the car in a dark, dry garage. The new ones - nominally identical - were chalk and cheese from the old. MUCH more grip, much more predictable at the limit, and generally much, much nicer. I've also seen photos of tyres on friends' cars that have delaminated suddenly - and have turned out to be 20+ years old, but looked just fine and had recently passed MOTs.

Bring it on.

As for parliament... Hansard will tell you what happened with the debates.
July 2014:
https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/2014-07-15/d...
Progress:
https://services.parliament.uk/bills/2014-15/tyres...
So it just had a first reading, no more than that.

Currently:
October 2017 first reading:
https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/2017-10-31/d...
Current progress:
https://services.parliament.uk/bills/2017-19/tyres...
It's already got further than last time, but it looks like it didn't get the second reading yesterday - https://hansard.parliament.uk/Commons/2018-02-23
It's a private members' bill, so no great surprise. They very rarely get anywhere, just raise awareness. And, as it stands, it wouldn't apply to cars anyway - just buses and coaches.

Red 4

10,744 posts

186 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
This is Frances Molloy's Tyred website ;

http://www.tyred.org.uk/

Click the icon in the top right corner for stories/ tyre info.

Binning tyres over 10 years old (max) seems sensible to me

untakenname

4,953 posts

191 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
My last car had the same tyres all round but the rear ones were four years newer than the fronts, I didn't realise at first and when I had the wheels off they were put on with different ages on different sides of the car on the same axel, the handling felt off till I realised and switched them round again.

I don't see why the manufacturers don't put the age of tyres on the sidewall in a larger font rather than the tiny one atm, guess it may hurt their bottom line if people easily knew how old their 'new' tyres were when fitted.
On a related matter, tyre sidewall data really does need an overhaul, the mixture of metric and imperial for the tyre sizes is rather confusing as well.

CoolHands

18,496 posts

194 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
Have you considered not everyone will agree it’s a no brainier? I don’t want them banned, thanks.

TooMany2cvs

29,008 posts

125 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
CoolHands said:
Have you considered not everyone will agree it’s a no brainier? I don’t want them banned, thanks.
Why not?

CoolHands

18,496 posts

194 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
Incre@ed costs? All costs would rise and be paid by consumers as cost would be passed on. I can put up with the risk of 1 death per zillion due to tyres being more than 10 years old.

If it did get in, then what, 5 years old? But then 3 is safer than than 5 etc

Waste of time.

TooMany2cvs

29,008 posts

125 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
CoolHands said:
Incre@ed costs? All costs would rise and be paid by consumers as cost would be passed on.
What's the annual cost difference between a tenth of a new set of tyres and a twentieth, compared to the total running/ownership costs of a vehicle?

Red 4

10,744 posts

186 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
CoolHands said:
Have you considered not everyone will agree it’s a no brainier? I don’t want them banned, thanks.
Apart from the safety issue to you - I don't particularly want to meet somebody coming the other way who has knackered tyres.

The amount of dodgy tyres out there is already scary - lots of people don't give a monkey's and think that because their car has an MOT it's fully legal.

This is simple to check and legislate for - I don't understand why the government are stalling.
The "research" isn't difficult.
Rubber degrades. Simple.


fido

16,752 posts

254 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
Red 4 said:
The amount of dodgy tyres out there is already scary - lots of people don't give a monkey's and think that because their car has an MOT it's fully legal.
The MOT is meant to check for defective tyres and brakes - if it's not up to the job then improve it.

untakenname

4,953 posts

191 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
Like extending the age for the first MOT from three years to four?
Workmate was complaining he got done for having defective tyres when pulled over for a random stop because his car was only two years old so therefore in his mind was roadworthy.

Red 4

10,744 posts

186 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
fido said:
The MOT is meant to check for defective tyres and brakes - if it's not up to the job then improve it.
I know.

That doesn't mean the vehicle remains roadworthy/ legal for the next 12 months though.

bitchstewie

50,767 posts

209 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
CoolHands said:
I can put up with the risk of 1 death per zillion due to tyres being more than 10 years old.
So can I unless the death happens to be mine because someone didn't want to spend the money necessary to keep their vehicle roadworthy.

CoolHands

18,496 posts

194 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
Yeah but that’s life. Not every death is preventable without unbearable cost. It’s hardly death and carnage out there due to OLD tyres. It’s a complete non event.

bitchstewie

50,767 posts

209 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
CoolHands said:
Yeah but that’s life. Not every death is preventable without unbearable cost. It’s hardly death and carnage out there due to OLD tyres. It’s a complete non event.
If a set of tyres every ten years is an "unbearable cost" it's probably time to reconsider driving.

CoolHands

18,496 posts

194 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
You seem to be unable to follow the principle as outlined further up.

bitchstewie

50,767 posts

209 months

Saturday 24th February 2018
quotequote all
CoolHands said:
You seem to be unable to follow the principle as outlined further up.
I'm able to follow it, I just don't agree with you.