Old tyres bill blocked again
Discussion
spaximus said:
I agree totally with what you say Realist. In my experience accidents due to tyres are a very low problem. When I was working in the Tyre trade for over 10 years as a regional manager, the biggest single problem was ordinary people doing ordinary mileages in two to 5 year old cars, running them on the canvas.
I would be a very rich man if I got a pound every time I quoted for a premium tyre, then was asked is there anything cheaper, it is just the wifes car.
It was rare to see tyres cracked on the sidewalls with lots of tread left. The tyres that fail the most are trailer and caravan tyres which was more often down to overloading and poor inflation
Of course some would love to sell more tyres on tread depth but the facts are against that, if you read the article below.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/motors/3591028/changing-t...
The police we used to service changed their motorway patrol car and fast response car tyres at 3mm, the rest was 2mm which seemed to work out well.
I don't doubt what you say - the campers I've seen with old tyres are clearly a problem though. One I drove it was clear had been sat in the sun for years, the tyres did not even feel round anymore! I would be a very rich man if I got a pound every time I quoted for a premium tyre, then was asked is there anything cheaper, it is just the wifes car.
It was rare to see tyres cracked on the sidewalls with lots of tread left. The tyres that fail the most are trailer and caravan tyres which was more often down to overloading and poor inflation
Of course some would love to sell more tyres on tread depth but the facts are against that, if you read the article below.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/motors/3591028/changing-t...
The police we used to service changed their motorway patrol car and fast response car tyres at 3mm, the rest was 2mm which seemed to work out well.
What I'm not sure of is it old tyres are more of an issue on commercial vehicles - do they last years with retread after retread? I get the impression some trucks with 10 yr old tires might not be that rare? The odd coachbuilt truck in the M5 crash would seem like a candidate for old tyres. Old tyre meets motorway pot hole = disaster. This is only speculation of course.
PS Aircraft tyres are very different in this respect - yes they may get 2-3 retreads, but they only last 2-300 landings - and flying 30-50 flights a week you can see they are not getting anywhere near the same aging issues as 10 year old camper tyres.
PPS Interesting to see the "replace rear tyres" advice is still new to some PHers. Always did that even on e.g. high power FWD cars chew the fronts. New on back, backs on front. The video of under/over steer makes the case very convincingly.
Lord Marylebone said:
Red 4 said:
I rotate my tyres (front to back) so at some stage I'll have to live dangerously. I'll wear my crash helmet when the time comes.
Just out of interest, what is the purpose of rotating tyres front to back or back/front?On my FWD vehicles for example, the front tyres seem to wear out at least twice as fast as the rears, but each time this happens I usually just replace the fronts and leave the rears to continue wearing out as they are. My possibly flawed theory is that it's the front that does all the steering, braking and accelerating so I would rather just keep having the new tyres on the front.
On my front engine - rear drive cars, I find that they usually all wear out near enough the same time.
Most of my vehicles have staggered width tyres so they cannot be rotated front to back anyway...
Maybe I'm doing it wrong!
It's actually on the service schedule for my car and on the car's computer - the car also tells you when to do it based on mileage.
I know some will say I will probably die in a ball of flames - and I understand the points being made re; handling but that's what it says !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbD7104kM64.
Edited by Red 4 on Sunday 25th February 12:11
i'm more concerned about the amount of people that I see driving on a flat tyre,either because they can't or don't want to put a spare on but just drive it home or to a tyre fitters.
how many of those tyres are repaired and reused without knowing what damage could have been done internally to the carcass.
how many of those tyres are repaired and reused without knowing what damage could have been done internally to the carcass.
eldar said:
V6Pushfit said:
Same here I run two tyres which are now over 70 years old as do others I know. Sounds to me like the tyre industry desperate for more sales.
70 years old. What sort of tyre?If not, he's an utter liability
ChemicalChaos said:
eldar said:
V6Pushfit said:
Same here I run two tyres which are now over 70 years old as do others I know. Sounds to me like the tyre industry desperate for more sales.
70 years old. What sort of tyre?If not, he's an utter liability
crankedup said:
On one of my previous vintage cars I decided to replace tyres and tubes, the tubes were likely over 40years old. Really thick very heavy rubber, the new ones I purchased marketed as heavy duty were about one third weight of old tubes.
More advanced materials need less mass to do the same job.ChemicalChaos said:
I hope to god he's being obtuse and talking about a veteran lorry with solid rubber tyres.
If not, he's an utter liability
The US WW2 military tyres go for good money if they’re useable a lot of people run them and if they’re utterly knackered at least use the best one as a spare.If not, he's an utter liability
Red 4 said:
davepoth said:
Because cars are designed to crash into things head first. Put the new tyres on the back and then the front will always lose grip first, meaning you'll go head first into the tree with all of the crash structures and airbags to protect you. With the new tyres on the front the rear will let go first, meaning you'll go sideways or backwards into the tree - much less safe.
Added to that, an understeer skid is much easier to sort out if you aren't expecting it - I love a dab of oppo as much as the next man, but not when I'm commuting to work in January.
OK - thanks for your rationale.Added to that, an understeer skid is much easier to sort out if you aren't expecting it - I love a dab of oppo as much as the next man, but not when I'm commuting to work in January.
It's, well, can I just say an "interesting" philosophy.
Personally, in a FWD car, I'd prefer to have the better tyres on the front to avoid understeer in the first place.
Each to their own I suppose. Ta.
eldar said:
V6Pushfit said:
eldar said:
70 years old. What sort of tyre?
Bar treaded military, tubed, and with run flat liners. If I go over 44 it’s because I’m being towed.
I'm sure you can explain in court how expensive new bargrips are and how the old ones still work just fine, whilst you're on trial for running over someone you couldn't stop for even at 30mph.
When was the last time you tried doing an emergency stop in your wagon? Even at low speeds there's a lot of momentum there and even on new, supple, soft bargrips the tarmac contact patch is frighteningly small
ChemicalChaos said:
Oh, so you're a one of the many people I see at shows with a lovely vintage truck, running on shiny, rock hard tyres that have practically turned to plastic by now and are full of craze lines?
I'm sure you can explain in court how expensive new bargrips are and how the old ones still work just fine, whilst you're on trial for running over someone you couldn't stop for even at 30mph.
When was the last time you tried doing an emergency stop in your wagon? Even at low speeds there's a lot of momentum there and even on new, supple, soft bargrips the tarmac contact patch is frighteningly small
In fact bar grips are extremely good at grip under braking and I haven’t (and don’t know anyone else who has) had a problem with stopping. I'm sure you can explain in court how expensive new bargrips are and how the old ones still work just fine, whilst you're on trial for running over someone you couldn't stop for even at 30mph.
When was the last time you tried doing an emergency stop in your wagon? Even at low speeds there's a lot of momentum there and even on new, supple, soft bargrips the tarmac contact patch is frighteningly small
You’d better not try to drive a vintage vehicle though it doesnt sound like you would know how to !
ChemicalChaos said:
Oh, so you're a one of the many people I see at shows with a lovely vintage truck, running on shiny, rock hard tyres that have practically turned to plastic by now and are full of craze lines?
I'm sure you can explain in court how expensive new bargrips are and how the old ones still work just fine, whilst you're on trial for running over someone you couldn't stop for even at 30mph.
When was the last time you tried doing an emergency stop in your wagon? Even at low speeds there's a lot of momentum there and even on new, supple, soft bargrips the tarmac contact patch is frighteningly small
Are you 15 ?I'm sure you can explain in court how expensive new bargrips are and how the old ones still work just fine, whilst you're on trial for running over someone you couldn't stop for even at 30mph.
When was the last time you tried doing an emergency stop in your wagon? Even at low speeds there's a lot of momentum there and even on new, supple, soft bargrips the tarmac contact patch is frighteningly small
Checking a tyre's condition at MOT time should be sufficient- rejecting the very few 10+ year old tyres at MOT time based purely on an arbitrary number seems to be lawmaking for the sake of lawmaking.
There's plenty of tyres out there with zero tread & cracked sidewalls and existing laws only really get enforced at MOT time, so why do we think a new rule is going to make much difference?
To all those who mention a massive drop-off in track performance for an older tyre, how many tyres driven sportily last for 10 years & how many 10 year old tyres are driven in that manner?
Legislate based on condition not an arbitrary age.
There's plenty of tyres out there with zero tread & cracked sidewalls and existing laws only really get enforced at MOT time, so why do we think a new rule is going to make much difference?
To all those who mention a massive drop-off in track performance for an older tyre, how many tyres driven sportily last for 10 years & how many 10 year old tyres are driven in that manner?
Legislate based on condition not an arbitrary age.
Rovinghawk said:
Checking a tyre's condition at MOT time should be sufficient- rejecting the very few 10+ year old tyres at MOT time based purely on an arbitrary number seems to be lawmaking for the sake of lawmaking.
There's plenty of tyres out there with zero tread & cracked sidewalls and existing laws only really get enforced at MOT time, so why do we think a new rule is going to make much difference?
To all those who mention a massive drop-off in track performance for an older tyre, how many tyres driven sportily last for 10 years & how many 10 year old tyres are driven in that manner?
Legislate based on condition not an arbitrary age.
Isn’t There's plenty of tyres out there with zero tread & cracked sidewalls and existing laws only really get enforced at MOT time, so why do we think a new rule is going to make much difference?
To all those who mention a massive drop-off in track performance for an older tyre, how many tyres driven sportily last for 10 years & how many 10 year old tyres are driven in that manner?
Legislate based on condition not an arbitrary age.
1.6mm arbitrary. Why not 1.7 or 1.5 etc?
Welshbeef said:
Rovinghawk said:
Checking a tyre's condition at MOT time should be sufficient- rejecting the very few 10+ year old tyres at MOT time based purely on an arbitrary number seems to be lawmaking for the sake of lawmaking.
There's plenty of tyres out there with zero tread & cracked sidewalls and existing laws only really get enforced at MOT time, so why do we think a new rule is going to make much difference?
To all those who mention a massive drop-off in track performance for an older tyre, how many tyres driven sportily last for 10 years & how many 10 year old tyres are driven in that manner?
Legislate based on condition not an arbitrary age.
Isn’t There's plenty of tyres out there with zero tread & cracked sidewalls and existing laws only really get enforced at MOT time, so why do we think a new rule is going to make much difference?
To all those who mention a massive drop-off in track performance for an older tyre, how many tyres driven sportily last for 10 years & how many 10 year old tyres are driven in that manner?
Legislate based on condition not an arbitrary age.
1.6mm arbitrary. Why not 1.7 or 1.5 etc?
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