Teenager slapped by Policeman
Discussion
Rovinghawk said:
ousy internet here so I haven't seen the video yet so won't comment on it.
However, do you really think pre-emptive strike is an acceptable procedure? Jesus wept.
Yes However, do you really think pre-emptive strike is an acceptable procedure? Jesus wept.
Pre-emptive strikes
There is no rule in law to say that a person must wait to be struck first before they may defend themselves, (see R v Deana, 2 Cr App R 75).
https://www.cps.gov.uk/legal-guidance/self-defence...
Also:
Common Law
s.117 PACE
s.3 Criminal Law Act which govern the use of force
Human Rights Act
Edited by pavarotti1980 on Tuesday 21st August 16:00
Rovinghawk said:
ousy internet here so I haven't seen the video yet so won't comment on it.
However, do you really think pre-emptive strike is an acceptable procedure? Jesus wept.
Yes.However, do you really think pre-emptive strike is an acceptable procedure? Jesus wept.
And so does the law.
f
k me, you're getting crucified on here today. First the Hillsborough nonsense you were spouting earlier and now this.Dear me.
Red 4 said:
What situations ?
Sometimes a punch (or indeed repeated punches - and kicks - and whatever else may be necessary in the circumstances) is lawful.
Or do you think that nobody resists much and the cops should be able to deal with everyone simply by taking hold of their arm(s) and restraining them ?
Situations where striking the suspect/detainee isn't necessary. Sometimes a punch (or indeed repeated punches - and kicks - and whatever else may be necessary in the circumstances) is lawful.
Or do you think that nobody resists much and the cops should be able to deal with everyone simply by taking hold of their arm(s) and restraining them ?
Someone followed my post with a statement from the police force explaining why the strike was used; and if those circumstances are true then it indeed was necessary.
With the video and the information given, it did not look to be necessary.
necessary is the key word here.
esxste said:
Situations where striking the suspect/detainee isn't necessary.
Someone followed my post with a statement from the police force explaining why the strike was used; and if this those circumstances are true then it indeed was necessary.
With the video and the information given, it did not look to be necessary.
necessary is the key word here.
reasonable force and proportionate...other option could have taser if she had tried to grab itSomeone followed my post with a statement from the police force explaining why the strike was used; and if this those circumstances are true then it indeed was necessary.
With the video and the information given, it did not look to be necessary.
necessary is the key word here.
The fact you find it necessary after the statement sort of proves that without more facts its impossible to make the judgement of it being unnecessary
esxste said:
Red 4 said:
What situations ?
Sometimes a punch (or indeed repeated punches - and kicks - and whatever else may be necessary in the circumstances) is lawful.
Or do you think that nobody resists much and the cops should be able to deal with everyone simply by taking hold of their arm(s) and restraining them ?
Situations where striking the suspect/detainee isn't necessary. Sometimes a punch (or indeed repeated punches - and kicks - and whatever else may be necessary in the circumstances) is lawful.
Or do you think that nobody resists much and the cops should be able to deal with everyone simply by taking hold of their arm(s) and restraining them ?
Someone followed my post with a statement from the police force explaining why the strike was used; and if those circumstances are true then it indeed was necessary.
With the video and the information given, it did not look to be necessary.
necessary is the key word here.
You said the female officer held the male officer's hand back, red mist, blah blah, etc. etc.
It's very easy to judge when you don't know all the facts. That can make you look a little silly.
Personally, I can't see anything wrong with the officers' actions and good on Andy Rhodes for supporting his officers.
Not all Chiefs would do the same.
Edited by Red 4 on Tuesday 21st August 16:25
pavarotti1980 said:
reasonable force and proportionate...other option could have taser if she had tried to grab it
The fact you find it necessary after the statement sort of proves that without more facts its impossible to make the judgement of it being unnecessary
Ahh ok... The fact you find it necessary after the statement sort of proves that without more facts its impossible to make the judgement of it being unnecessary
Shall I just join the baying mob celebrating the copper smacking the girl with just as much certainty about the necessity of the action?
esxste said:
Ahh ok...
Shall I just join the baying mob celebrating the copper smacking the girl with just as much certainty about the necessity of the action?
yes i think you should unless you feel it acceptable for the scum of society to act in such fashion with what the believe is no culpabilityShall I just join the baying mob celebrating the copper smacking the girl with just as much certainty about the necessity of the action?
Red 4 said:
It appeared, by your previous post, that you were judging the officers.
You said the female officer held the male officer's hand back, red mist, blah blah, etc. etc.
It's very easy to judge when you don't know all the facts. That can make you look a little silly.
Personally, I can't see anything wrong with the officers' actions and good on Andy Rhodes for supporting his officers.
Not all Chiefs would do the same.
That's what it appears to be in the video. I can't see obvious movement for the taser, even watching it again. I'm not an expert though, and I'm inclined, as subsequent posts have shown, to believe the Chief Constables explanation. You said the female officer held the male officer's hand back, red mist, blah blah, etc. etc.
It's very easy to judge when you don't know all the facts. That can make you look a little silly.
Personally, I can't see anything wrong with the officers' actions and good on Andy Rhodes for supporting his officers.
Not all Chiefs would do the same.
Edited by Red 4 on Tuesday 21st August 16:25
Coppers deal with tough situations, and losing control and going into red mist is a danger. You'll note I've not actually criticised the officer beyond that, suggested anything about his character, or suggested suitable consequences.
Again, would you prefer I instead post with glee about a girl being smacked in the face with the same information?
the irony of the whole video is thick as a brick mouthpiece shouting and bawling about being violent and aggresive and then when she tries to wriggle free starts laughing as they cant control her.
the little scumbag also bit the female cop as well so deserves everything she gets. Show respect and respect is shown in return. Act like that and expect to be dealt with robustly
the little scumbag also bit the female cop as well so deserves everything she gets. Show respect and respect is shown in return. Act like that and expect to be dealt with robustly
Edited by pavarotti1980 on Tuesday 21st August 16:42
pavarotti1980 said:
yes i think you should unless you feel it acceptable for the scum of society to act in such fashion with what the believe is no culpability
I don't believe corporal punishment is an effective way to apply culpability. My viewpoint is that such people experience violence enough in their lives, such that our allowing our society to dive to such a level would be ineffectual and valueless.
esxste said:
I don't believe corporal punishment is an effective way to apply culpability.
My viewpoint is that such people experience violence enough in their lives, such that our allowing our society to dive to such a level would be ineffectual and valueless.
Thats not corporal punishment is it? Its using reasonable force to arrest someone as backed up in law. Children are not exempt for very good reason.My viewpoint is that such people experience violence enough in their lives, such that our allowing our society to dive to such a level would be ineffectual and valueless.
What do suggest would have been the appropriate course of action for this "person" resisting arrest and offering violence in the form of biting?
Can of coke and a mars bar?
Thought it'd be clear cut, but its not at all.
To be honest, it looks like he just lost his rag and gave her a thwump. No noticeable signs that shes going for the taser, and didn't look like she was suddenly about to lunge or try and strike anyone. Understandable and good on the chief for defending him, but it definitely looks like a red mist moment!
To be honest, it looks like he just lost his rag and gave her a thwump. No noticeable signs that shes going for the taser, and didn't look like she was suddenly about to lunge or try and strike anyone. Understandable and good on the chief for defending him, but it definitely looks like a red mist moment!
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