45th President of the United States, Donald Trump. (Vol 6)

[deckster]

paulguitar said:

Monty Python said:

So the HJC is now going beyond oversight and is now conducting "investigations". Why don't they just get Mueller in front of the committee and ask him....but maybe they don't want to hear what he has to say.

It's hard to know whether to take this seriously.

No, it's really not....

[Lazermilk]

deckster said:

paulguitar said:

Monty Python said:

So the HJC is now going beyond oversight and is now conducting "investigations". Why don't they just get Mueller in front of the committee and ask him....but maybe they don't want to hear what he has to say.

It's hard to know whether to take this seriously.

No, it's really not....

Think he is just living up to the username with his surreal/satire comedy...

[paulguitar]

Lazermilk said:

deckster said:

paulguitar said:

Monty Python said:

So the HJC is now going beyond oversight and is now conducting "investigations". Why don't they just get Mueller in front of the committee and ask him....but maybe they don't want to hear what he has to say.

It's hard to know whether to take this seriously.

No, it's really not....

Think he is just living up to the username with his surreal/satire comedy...

[PAULJ5555]

Without reading 400 pages,

Everyweek there is somthing they are after him for, why is Trump still in the White House?

[paulguitar]

PAULJ5555 said:

Without reading 400 pages,

Everyweek there is somthing they are after him for, why is Trump still in the White House?

It's a genuinely new situation, and they do really revere the position of president in the states. Hopefully, lessons will be learned from this, but I feel strongly that they need to stop pissing about and just get the poisonous turd out of the WH before any further damage is done.

It's truly amazing a once widely respected country has come to this so quickly.

[PAULJ5555]

paulguitar said:

PAULJ5555 said:

Without reading 400 pages,

Everyweek there is somthing they are after him for, why is Trump still in the White House?

It's a genuinely new situation, and they do really revere the position of president in the states. Hopefully, lessons will be learned from this, but I feel strongly that they need to stop pissing about and just get the poisonous turd out of the WH before any further damage is done.

It's truly amazing a once widely respected country has come to this so quickly.

If they wanted him out he would be out? Why cant they get him out then?

[Eric Mc]

Because they haven't really had a rogue President in the same way before. Trump's behaviour has exposed serious weaknesses in the ability to control a rogue President, especially if the party of the President is prepared to place partisanship above the law and/or the Constitution.

It is a very dangerous period for the USA where its laws and rules are being severely tested by a wilfully obstructive Chief Executive - and it remains to be seen whether their system can cope with this form of internal attack on its democratic institutions.

[Gameface]

PAULJ5555 said:

If they wanted him out he would be out? Why cant they get him out then?

Trump is using social media, obstructing and lying like no other President. It's caught the lawmakers and establishment off guard.

Even without that, convicting/impeaching a president is not the work of a moment.

[minimoog]

PAULJ5555 said:

If they wanted him out he would be out?

Where did you get that idea from? Who's 'they'?

PAULJ5555 said:

Why cant they get him out then?

Again, who's they?

Let's assume you mean the Democrat party. It's already been 'decided' (i.e. proclaimed) by the Dept of Justice i.e. Trump's pet AG Barr that a sitting president can't be indicted. So the crimes he apparently committed (obstruction of justice chiefly) can't be prosecuted. The Mueller report acknowledges this constraint and effectively states the only remaining recourse, while Trump is still president, is impeachment. The Dems don't hold a majority in both houses of Congress, therefore realistically impeachment has zero chance of succeeding as long as GOP senators toe the party line and ignore their oaths to uphold the law and the Constitution. And so far all except one of them has.

There's a strong argument for going ahead with impeachment anyway even though it will fail, the notion being the process will air Trump and his cronies' misdeeds formally in public at length and, the theory goes, consequently damage his stock among floating voters come the next election. Who knows if that has merit - some argue it could have the reverse effect - but either way the Dems haven't shown the bottle to do it. And that's on them.

Edited by minimoog on Wednesday 22 May 13:10

[minimoog]

Re. 'the only remaining recourse, while Trump is still president, is impeachment.' - the implication here of course is that as soon as Trump isn't President, he will be prosecuted for obstruction of justice (at the very least).

Now does Trump strike you as the sort to say' fair enough guv, bang to rights', or would you expect him to throw every dirty trick he can muster to make sure that doesn't happen? And I mean everything, from voter fraud, voter suppression, foreign interference (again), to flat out refusing to concede he did in fact lose the election, if indeed he does despite his best efforts. There's no way he is voluntarily going to concede he is no longer president. No way. Only the other day at his latest rally he was talking about serving 4 or 5 terms (they have a 2 term limit). And on current evidence the GOP will back him all the way, and if they do the USA as we know it is lost.

Melodramatic? Maybe. We'll see...

Edited by minimoog on Wednesday 22 May 13:25

[Byker28i]

Gameface said:

PAULJ5555 said:

If they wanted him out he would be out? Why cant they get him out then?

Trump is using social media, obstructing and lying like no other President. It's caught the lawmakers and establishment off guard.

Even without that, convicting/impeaching a president is not the work of a moment.

You've also got to remember he's surrounded himself with people who will protect him, because they think trump will favour them, especially in the legal areas, Kavanaugh to Supreme court, Barr as attorney general, a number of lower cvourt judges. Then there's those in the GOP who want to keep power at any cost, or who are also implicated in taking money from Oligarchs, or from the russians via the NRA etc.

Swamp is an understatement.

On top of that, the position of Potus has been given too much power, with limited oversight if there's key people who support him, so Mitch McConnel etc.

History in the making right here and the US will take some time to recover.

[Rivenink]

PAULJ5555 said:

Without reading 400 pages,

Everyweek there is somthing they are after him for, why is Trump still in the White House?

Simply, 'they' need a super majority to successfully impeach him.

There isn't enough of 'them' to get that.

The issue right now is Trumps obstructions of oversight. The attempts to prevent Congress from getting access to documents and testimonies are testing the system of checks and balances.

He might not even be guilty of anything. There may be nothing to find in the evidence being requested. Certainly the Russia Collusion thing seems have turned up not a lot against Trump.

But the danger is in what happens if his obstructions are allowed... the position of U.S. President starts to become more and more that of a dictator.

Trumps efforts may not even end up benefiting him massively.... but it may set up the stage for someone else to decimate American democracy.

[Byker28i]

minimoog said:

Re. 'the only remaining recourse, while Trump is still president, is impeachment.' - the implication here of course is that as soon as Trump isn't President, he will be prosecuted for obstruction of justice (at the very least).

Now does Trump strike you as the sort to say' fair enough guv, bang to rights', or would you expect him to throw every dirty trick he can muster to make sure that doesn't happen? And I mean everything, from voter fraud, voter suppression, foreign interference (again), to flat out refusing to concede he did in fact lose the election, if indeed he does despite his best efforts. There's no way he is voluntarily going to concede he is no longer president. No way. Only the other day at his latest rally he was talking about serving 4 or 5 terms (they have a 2 term limit). And on current evidence the GOP will back him all the way, and if they do the USA as we know it is lost.

Melodramatic? Maybe. We'll see...

Edited by minimoog on Wednesday 22 May 13:25

Have you seen his latest tweet?

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump

Without the ILLEGAL Witch Hunt, my poll numbers, especially because of our historically “great” economy, would be at 65%. Too bad! The greatest Hoax in American History.

4:00 AM - 22 May 2019

[Byker28i]

House Intel scraps this morning's meeting to take "enforcement action" against DOJ after DOJ pledges access to 12 sets of counterintel docs, in a rare case of the Trump administration and House Democrats successfully negotiating around a Dem subpoena

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/05/22/politics/adam-s...

Looks like progress can be made. Just need to actually enforce the subpoenas. It would't take long. McGahn is worth around $3m. $25000 a day fines would soon hit home

[Byker28i]

trumps built 1.7miles of fencing with his $1.5bn
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-05-21...

[Shakermaker]

Byker28i said:

trumps built 1.7miles of fencing with his $1.5bn
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-05-21...

A billion dollars per mile? That better be some good fencing!

[Byker28i]

A federal appeals court has refused to block a grand jury subpoena for testimony by Roger Stone associate Andrew Miller in an investigation launched by Mueller. Miller now has seven days to appeal the decision, testify, or face jail time

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/legal-issues/...

If he fails, or the high court rules against him, Miller faces an August contempt finding by U.S. District Chief Judge Beryl A. Howell of Washington for refusing to testify, an order that would leave him facing jail if he continues to decline to appear.

[Byker28i]

Shakermaker said:

Byker28i said:

trumps built 1.7miles of fencing with his $1.5bn
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-05-21...

A billion dollars per mile? That better be some good fencing!

The biggest, best ever, obviously

[Rivenink]

Byker,

If there was one source that you would recommend for mostly unbiased reporting about Trump, which would it be?

[Slaav]

Rivenink said:

Byker,

If there was one source that you would recommend for mostly unbiased reporting about Trump, which would it be?

I thought this thread was just such a place?