Yellow vests - fuel protest day of action in France

[TVRJAS]

Bill said:

It undermines his credibility just a tad, don't you think?

Where he says "True there are some false pics floating around"

Have you scrolled down to the previous week yet? Or did you rub your eyes after seeing yellow vests in Australia... Bet that was a surprise for you.

So i presume if we are talking credibility you don't search MSM then.

Just to make it clear that's Australia where the kangaroos are from not the one with Vienna.

Edited by TVRJAS on Monday 21st January 19:34

[Earthdweller]

Well I hope they resolve it before they get to week 36 of protests

I have a lovely holiday booked in France for July

[EddieSteadyGo]

TVRJAS said:

We seriously are dealing with the blind here.... Not his photo and read the story. But did one photo tell you all you need to know. Keep going you might learn something.

You're being obtuse TVR. If we were talking about somewhere hard to get to like Iraq or Syria, we might need to rely on third party reports.

But we aren't. You get get to France for a £50 ticket on Eurotunnel. So there isn't the same need to listen to people pushing their own agenda on Twitter.

As I keep saying; get in your TVR. Drive a short distance. Report back what you see. Please stop quoting people until you can be bothered to look for yourself.

Then you will realise who is eating the bullst...

[Helicopter123]

tangerine_sedge said:

Who are these "elites" that you and many other posters refer to? Are they a secret organisation that meet regularly to plot the downfall of the working class? You couldn't just be referring to elected members of parliament could you?

Many posters on this thread seem to desparately want the yellow vest movement to be something more than it is. It is of little interest within the UK, hence little coverage in the MSM. It doesn't seem to have an impact on most French people, see comments from PH members who are in France. Few people seem outraged that the French police are acting like the French police always have, i.e. going in strong.

Finally, why the attack on hipsters? Probably for the same reason that the acid house scene, punks, skinheads, Mods & rockers and Teddy boys were attacked, i.e. attacked by fat bald middle aged people who have forgotten what it's like to be young and how to have fun.

Good post

[Henners]

I haven’t been paying much attention to where all the ruckus has been across France, but I’m at the Avenue des Champs-Élysées this week and its pretty quiet.

[gizlaroc]

Henners said:

I haven’t been paying much attention to where all the ruckus has been across France, but I’m at the Avenue des Champs-Élysées this week and its pretty quiet.

Saturday?

[gizlaroc]

Helicopter123 said:

Good post

No it's not.

It is real issue there, they are protesting and rioting in the streets to get Macron to change policy, which he is doing.

The article I posted explains why it is happening and if you think there is not and elite class who do not understand what is happening outside the cities they live in you are either purposefully dismissing the issue or one of them.

The hipster thing is spot on, hipster in the way many city dwellers now live their life as if they are some hippy from the 60s who has nothing but love for everyone yet dismiss those who are genuinely suffering because of the way capitalism and globalism is taking over as some sort of bigot/racist/xenophobe.

It is very similar to what we have here with Brexit.

You may even recognise yourself a bit in there Budgie.

[TVRJAS]

EddieSteadyGo said:

You're being obtuse TVR. ...

Oh the Irony...

So you obviously didn't look at https://twitter.com/sotiridi ... Why would I jump in a car when that journalist covers all over France and the other countries as does YT and the 1,000 of other info that can be obtained. Don't suppose you will see many yellow vests up the top of mountains or at the chateau or when you read your bbc.

The storm is coming Q

Edited by TVRJAS on Tuesday 22 January 01:38

[wisbech]

gizlaroc said:

It is real issue there, they are protesting and rioting in the streets to get Macron to change policy, which he is doing.

The article I posted explains why it is happening and if you think there is not and elite class who do not understand what is happening outside the cities they live in you are either purposefully dismissing the issue or one of them.

The hipster thing is spot on, hipster in the way many city dwellers now live their life as if they are some hippy from the 60s who has nothing but love for everyone yet dismiss those who are genuinely suffering because of the way capitalism and globalism is taking over as some sort of bigot/racist/xenophobe.

It is very similar to what we have here with Brexit.

You may even recognise yourself a bit in there Budgie.

However, globalism and capitalism have been hugely beneficial overall. Living standards in China, Indonesia, India etc have jumped over the last 30-40 years - more people have left poverty (true poverty) behind in this generation than ever before. To me that outweighs disaffected (but still far from poor) French protestors

Obv I am biased, as I split my childhood between Wisbech and South India, and my wife and her family are Indonesians. And wasn’t one of the issues behind Brexit about leaving a protectionist EU for enhanced links with India/ China etc, embracing this new world?

[wc98]

wisbech said:

However, globalism and capitalism have been hugely beneficial overall. Living standards in China, Indonesia, India etc have jumped over the last 30-40 years - more people have left poverty (true poverty) behind in this generation than ever before. To me that outweighs disaffected (but still far from poor) French protestors

Obv I am biased, as I split my childhood between Wisbech and South India, and my wife and her family are Indonesians. And wasn’t one of the issues behind Brexit about leaving a protectionist EU for enhanced links with India/ China etc, embracing this new world?

hard to disagree with most of that, i think the problems are arising due to what appears to be a rise in crony capitalism. my idea of globalism would be more toward genuine free trade,not large global conglomerates becoming bigger. too much control of anything in the hands of anyone/business is never a good idea and it can also lead to the "too big to fail" scenario where ordinary punters end up on the hook.

[Digga]

wc98 said:

wisbech said:

However, globalism and capitalism have been hugely beneficial overall. Living standards in China, Indonesia, India etc have jumped over the last 30-40 years - more people have left poverty (true poverty) behind in this generation than ever before. To me that outweighs disaffected (but still far from poor) French protestors

Obv I am biased, as I split my childhood between Wisbech and South India, and my wife and her family are Indonesians. And wasn’t one of the issues behind Brexit about leaving a protectionist EU for enhanced links with India/ China etc, embracing this new world?

hard to disagree with most of that, i think the problems are arising due to what appears to be a rise in crony capitalism. my idea of globalism would be more toward genuine free trade,not large global conglomerates becoming bigger. too much control of anything in the hands of anyone/business is never a good idea and it can also lead to the "too big to fail" scenario where ordinary punters end up on the hook.

There's now over 50% of the global population living in (loosely defined) democracies. That is due to global trade and liberalised economic policy. There are issues with the system, it can be gamed, but nothing like the issues associated with communism.

However, the yellow vests do have a valid purpose, as there is inequality. IMHO it is merely indicative that the right checks and balances have yet to be devised.

[Borghetto]

I was in Nice last November and watched the first Yellow Vest gathering and March. It was all very good natured. I am flying back there this weekend and it will be interesting to see if the numbers and/or the atmosphere has changed.

[longblackcoat]

TVRJAS said:

Oh the Irony...

So you obviously didn't look at https://twitter.com/sotiridi ... Why would I jump in a car when that journalist covers all over France and the other countries as does YT and the 1,000 of other info that can be obtained. Don't suppose you will see many yellow vests up the top of mountains or at the chateau or when you read your bbc.

The storm is coming Q

Edited by TVRJAS on Tuesday 22 January 01:38

I thought you said you were going to stop with your Qanon idiocy?

[tangerine_sedge]

TVRJAS said:

gizlaroc said:

tangerine_sedge said:

Finally, why the attack on hipsters? Probably for the same reason that the acid house scene, punks, skinheads, Mods & rockers and Teddy boys were attacked, i.e. attacked by fat bald middle aged people who have forgotten what it's like to be young and how to have fun.

Did you read the article?

He couldn't read it from the big high horse he sits on so his Secretary will read through it then pass it on to his advisory.

I didn't realise the original post was in response to that article. I have now read the article and see the relevance. It's still bks though.

The article is basically blaming 'the elites'(*1) for globalisation and demonising the people who have adapted to globalisation, i.e. the city dwellers/hipsters.

(*1) still have no definition of who these elites are, probably just anybody who is doing better than them, aka good old fashioned socialist envy.

[gizlaroc]

wisbech said:

However, globalism and capitalism have been hugely beneficial overall. Living standards in China, Indonesia, India etc have jumped over the last 30-40 years - more people have left poverty (true poverty) behind in this generation than ever before. To me that outweighs disaffected (but still far from poor) French protestors

A handful are doing very well, most are on their arse....

https://www.thelocal.fr/20160226/french-farming-hi...

https://www.euractiv.com/section/agriculture-food/...

It is the same for so many across France (Greece, Spain, Italy blah blah blah) in all sorts of industries.


The EU with their tax breaks and subsidies is great for a few large corporations and land owners, it is great for all of us to keep food artificially cheap (which is most certainly is) but it is decimating anyone outside the circle.

Same with imported staff from eastern Europe, keeps our double mocha latte cheap, keeps our NHS cheap enough for us to contract out every aspect of running it so these large companies can stay on the gravy train and saves us having to pay for training up our youngsters up.

Don't get me wrong, Poland ship their youth here, and they then take on staff from Indonesia and the like.
The problem is the whole world is going for this race to the bottom and all so we can get everything cheap so we can buy the latest iPhone, Macbook and drive around in a nice shiny car on PCP.

I'm as guilty of that as everyone else, what I don't like is when I have some hipster gobbing off about how the right have killed society while sitting in a cafe in Hamstead with his Macbook drinking a £5 coffee before trotting back across the heath to his £2,000,000 house with a Range Rover sitting outside.


Just be fking honest with yourself.
Most of us don't want Brexit because we want to keep things cheap, we don't care about fairness or anyone else, we care about ourselves.

Just read the financial reports that say GDP "may" be down by as much as 4.6%.
Yeah it may, but the same reports show that this is in the sectors that can afford it most, those that make the huge profits each year, what those reports also show is many small businesses could well see their business improve, without having to fight against the corporations with their unfair advantage with tax breaks and subsidies it actually levels the playing field.

Many are arguing Brexit could see a rebalance, a much fairer society.

fk that though, before I know it I may not be able to afford to swap my iPhone, Macbook and car every 2 years. Selfish tts!

[tangerine_sedge]

gizlaroc said:

I'm as guilty of that as everyone else, what I don't like is when I have some hipster gobbing off about how the right have killed society while sitting in a cafe in Hamstead with his Macbook drinking a £5 coffee before trotting back across the heath to his £2,000,000 house with a Range Rover sitting outside.

(1) hipsters are unlikely to own big houses or big cars, they are more likely to be working in the coffee shops.

(2) sounds like the politics of envy.

[amusingduck]

tangerine_sedge said:

(*1) still have no definition of who these elites are, probably just anybody who is doing better than them, aka good old fashioned socialist envy.

A cynic would think you were deliberately avoiding educating yourself as to what the definition is, to allow you to continue to make "misinformed" quips like that

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_elite#United...

Here you go, there's a start.

[gizlaroc]

tangerine_sedge said:

(1) hipsters are unlikely to own big houses or big cars, they are more likely to be working in the coffee shops.

(2) sounds like the politics of envy.

Yeah of course they don't own big houses or big cars.

Maybe the early hipsters worked in coffee shops in Shoreditch 15 years ago. Not now.

[tangerine_sedge]

amusingduck said:

tangerine_sedge said:

(*1) still have no definition of who these elites are, probably just anybody who is doing better than them, aka good old fashioned socialist envy.

A cynic would think you were deliberately avoiding educating yourself as to what the definition is, to allow you to continue to make "misinformed" quips like that

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_elite#United...

Here you go, there's a start.

Thats the definition of 'liberal elite'. Not the same.

Edited to add : responded too quickly. Is it only the left leaning and educated elite, or is it also the capitalistic 'born with a silver spoon' lot too? I'm really struggling to understand what straw-man enemy you are trying to build. Who are the yellow vests supposed to be against?

Edited by tangerine_sedge on Tuesday 22 January 14:51

[tangerine_sedge]

gizlaroc said:

tangerine_sedge said:

(1) hipsters are unlikely to own big houses or big cars, they are more likely to be working in the coffee shops.

(2) sounds like the politics of envy.

Yeah of course they don't own big houses or big cars.

Maybe the early hipsters worked in coffee shops in Shoreditch 15 years ago. Not now.

Hipsters can be found in cities, towns and villages up and down the country. Walk into any coffee shop and you can almost guarantee being served by one.

Now, about this politics of envy that is being displayed....