Dyson job losses
Discussion
Tuna said:
Oh dear.
This is a car forum and how many people understand what Dyson is doing? He previously announced a £3Bn investment in electric vehicles, and (like most other electric vehicle companies) has not surprisingly identified that the vast majority of growth in that area is going to come from the Asian markets.
In that light, moving HQ to Singapore is not even slightly surprising.
That said, the timing of the announcement is remarkable. Can't see how he expected that not to be seized on by the Brexit obsessed. Never mind that it's probably taken months or even years to put into place, the hard of thinking inevitably assume that he's decided at the drop of the hat because Brexit is not going the way that they want it to go. Yeah, that's how companies work. Get up, have breakfast, read the papers, decide to move HQ.
Of course the hypocrisy is hilarious
Remainers: "Those evil little englanders want to stop our right to work and live anywhere! We're global citizens!"
also Remainers "How Dare Dyson move his company away from Britain!"
The bigger question for the government is what do we need to do to make our country as economically attractive as Singapore for companies like Dyson?
I agree the hypocrisy is hillarious but not the hypocrisy of ‘remainers’This is a car forum and how many people understand what Dyson is doing? He previously announced a £3Bn investment in electric vehicles, and (like most other electric vehicle companies) has not surprisingly identified that the vast majority of growth in that area is going to come from the Asian markets.
In that light, moving HQ to Singapore is not even slightly surprising.
That said, the timing of the announcement is remarkable. Can't see how he expected that not to be seized on by the Brexit obsessed. Never mind that it's probably taken months or even years to put into place, the hard of thinking inevitably assume that he's decided at the drop of the hat because Brexit is not going the way that they want it to go. Yeah, that's how companies work. Get up, have breakfast, read the papers, decide to move HQ.
Of course the hypocrisy is hilarious
Remainers: "Those evil little englanders want to stop our right to work and live anywhere! We're global citizens!"
also Remainers "How Dare Dyson move his company away from Britain!"
The bigger question for the government is what do we need to do to make our country as economically attractive as Singapore for companies like Dyson?
Can you point to anyone on here that has said ‘how dare he move his company away from Britain’?
I think people are calling him out on grandstanding that brexit will be great for british companies whilst moving his to Singapore 2 months before Brexit happens, I certainly don’t bregrudge him doing whatever hecwants with his business but I can call him out on the timing and hypocrisy.
Tuna said:
The bigger question for the government is what do we need to do to make our country as economically attractive as Singapore for companies like Dyson?
Is it just economics? Skills density is pretty good in Singapore. An increasingly digital savvy workforce, etc. High quality of life. Some negatives, but it is quite attractive if you have, say, a good comp sci / engineering degree from an APAC university. If you were 25, single and could choose... Malmesbury or Singapore?
chrispmartha said:
I agree the hypocrisy is hillarious but not the hypocrisy of ‘remainers’
Can you point to anyone on here that has said ‘how dare he move his company away from Britain’?
I think people are calling him out on grandstanding that brexit will be great for british companies whilst moving his to Singapore 2 months before Brexit happens, I certainly don’t bregrudge him doing whatever hecwants with his business but I can call him out on the timing and hypocrisy.
He's not moving his company. He's moving the domicile of a holding company. Not quite the same thing...Can you point to anyone on here that has said ‘how dare he move his company away from Britain’?
I think people are calling him out on grandstanding that brexit will be great for british companies whilst moving his to Singapore 2 months before Brexit happens, I certainly don’t bregrudge him doing whatever hecwants with his business but I can call him out on the timing and hypocrisy.
skwdenyer said:
chrispmartha said:
I agree the hypocrisy is hillarious but not the hypocrisy of ‘remainers’
Can you point to anyone on here that has said ‘how dare he move his company away from Britain’?
I think people are calling him out on grandstanding that brexit will be great for british companies whilst moving his to Singapore 2 months before Brexit happens, I certainly don’t bregrudge him doing whatever hecwants with his business but I can call him out on the timing and hypocrisy.
He's not moving his company. He's moving the domicile of a holding company. Not quite the same thing...Can you point to anyone on here that has said ‘how dare he move his company away from Britain’?
I think people are calling him out on grandstanding that brexit will be great for british companies whilst moving his to Singapore 2 months before Brexit happens, I certainly don’t bregrudge him doing whatever hecwants with his business but I can call him out on the timing and hypocrisy.
chrispmartha said:
He is moving his company as a legal entity to singapore
Which will affect what exactly? Ford is a US based company, do we pay EU tariffs on American cars when we buy a Fiesta?The stuff about the Singapore FTA giving Dyson special access to EU makes no sense if the plan has always been to manufacture vehicles in Asia (I believe it has).
Equally the stuff about patents being ignored in China really doesn't understand how intellectual property is handled over there. Ho hum.
Tuna said:
chrispmartha said:
He is moving his company as a legal entity to singapore
Which will affect what exactly? Ford is a US based company, do we pay EU tariffs on American cars when we buy a Fiesta?The stuff about the Singapore FTA giving Dyson special access to EU makes no sense if the plan has always been to manufacture vehicles in Asia (I believe it has).
Equally the stuff about patents being ignored in China really doesn't understand how intellectual property is handled over there. Ho hum.
And as I’ve said he’s free to register his company wherever he chooses.
Doesn’t the FTA with singapore mean there will be no tarifs on the electric vehicles for countries within the EU? If so it could mean the UK has to pay tarifs on a car made by a supposedly british company?
Dindoit said:
otis criblecoblis said:
Dindoit said:
Nothing to see here. Everything is fine.
Farage’s kids with German passports
Lawson off to France
Mogg’s fund to Dublin
Ratcliffe gone to Monaco
Nothing to see here. Move along.
Who could have predicted this thread would have attracted the dolt end of the Remain vote to post gibberish ?Farage’s kids with German passports
Lawson off to France
Mogg’s fund to Dublin
Ratcliffe gone to Monaco
Nothing to see here. Move along.
chrispmartha said:
It will effect where corporation tax is paid.
And as I’ve said he’s free to register his company wherever he chooses.
Doesn’t the FTA with singapore mean there will be no tarifs on the electric vehicles for countries within the EU? If so it could mean the UK has to pay tarifs on a car made by a supposedly british company?
I think you need to read this: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46968726 - think carefully about how taxes are collected from multinationals.And as I’ve said he’s free to register his company wherever he chooses.
Doesn’t the FTA with singapore mean there will be no tarifs on the electric vehicles for countries within the EU? If so it could mean the UK has to pay tarifs on a car made by a supposedly british company?
You also don't appear to understand how tariffs work. What tariffs or FTAs the EU chooses to apply to Singapore would have no effect on the tariffs we would pay in the UK. As we'd be likely to replicate the EU tariff regime in the short term post-Brexit, we wouldn't apply tariffs to Dyson's cars.
Like many others, I'm a proponent of a low tariff regime which we'd be free to apply post Brexit if we take the sensible steps to reclaim control over our tariffs. Regardless, there isn't much of a case for our Government to introduce a new tariff on products on Singapore.
Tuna said:
chrispmartha said:
It will effect where corporation tax is paid.
And as I’ve said he’s free to register his company wherever he chooses.
Doesn’t the FTA with singapore mean there will be no tarifs on the electric vehicles for countries within the EU? If so it could mean the UK has to pay tarifs on a car made by a supposedly british company?
I think you need to read this: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46968726 - think carefully about how taxes are collected from multinationals.And as I’ve said he’s free to register his company wherever he chooses.
Doesn’t the FTA with singapore mean there will be no tarifs on the electric vehicles for countries within the EU? If so it could mean the UK has to pay tarifs on a car made by a supposedly british company?
You also don't appear to understand how tariffs work. What tariffs or FTAs the EU chooses to apply to Singapore would have no effect on the tariffs we would pay in the UK. As we'd be likely to replicate the EU tariff regime in the short term post-Brexit, we wouldn't apply tariffs to Dyson's cars.
Like many others, I'm a proponent of a low tariff regime which we'd be free to apply post Brexit if we take the sensible steps to reclaim control over our tariffs. Regardless, there isn't much of a case for our Government to introduce a new tariff on products on Singapore.
It also doesn’t say anything about my actual point that James Dyson has been hypocritical, again I will say I don’t particularly give a shiny s
te where Dyson is registered Regarding your second point where did I say The EU-Singapore tariffs will affect what we will pay in the UK?, I said the exact opposite if you read it.
Yes we might replicate the EU tariff and we may not, who knows?
Edited by chrispmartha on Wednesday 23 January 20:50
chrispmartha said:
Tuna said:
chrispmartha said:
It will effect where corporation tax is paid.
And as I’ve said he’s free to register his company wherever he chooses.
Doesn’t the FTA with singapore mean there will be no tarifs on the electric vehicles for countries within the EU? If so it could mean the UK has to pay tarifs on a car made by a supposedly british company?
I think you need to read this: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46968726 - think carefully about how taxes are collected from multinationals.And as I’ve said he’s free to register his company wherever he chooses.
Doesn’t the FTA with singapore mean there will be no tarifs on the electric vehicles for countries within the EU? If so it could mean the UK has to pay tarifs on a car made by a supposedly british company?
You also don't appear to understand how tariffs work. What tariffs or FTAs the EU chooses to apply to Singapore would have no effect on the tariffs we would pay in the UK. As we'd be likely to replicate the EU tariff regime in the short term post-Brexit, we wouldn't apply tariffs to Dyson's cars.
Like many others, I'm a proponent of a low tariff regime which we'd be free to apply post Brexit if we take the sensible steps to reclaim control over our tariffs. Regardless, there isn't much of a case for our Government to introduce a new tariff on products on Singapore.
Regarding your second point where did I say The EU-Singapore tariffs will affect what we will pay in the UK?, I said the exact opposite if you read it.
Yes we might replicate the EU tariff and we may not, who knows?
chrispmartha said:
Dyson being registered in Singapore will mean it pays corporation tax in Singapore, true or not?
You didn't actually read the article, did you? chrispmartha said:
Regarding your second point where did I say The EU-Singapore tariffs will affect what we will pay in the UK?, I said the exact opposite if you read it.
chrispmartha said:
Doesn’t the FTA with singapore mean there will be no tarifs on the electric vehicles for countries within the EU? If so it could mean the UK has to pay tarifs on a car made by a supposedly british company?
You made a comment about tariffs being due in the EU, followed by If so.... That's basic 'Statement A, if true, statement B' logic. You absolutely suggested EU-Singapore tariff conditions could affect UK's tariff obligations.chrispmartha said:
Yes we might replicate the EU tariff and we may not, who knows?
Why on earth would we? We're currently in alignment with the EU, we're generally against protectionist tariffs and there is absolutely no will to increase the costs to UK consumers.chrispmartha said:
Yes we might replicate the EU tariff and we may not, who knows?
Singapore seems happy to roll over the FTA when we leave the EU. I doubt they wouldn't given our close Commonwealth links.https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/spore-open-...
Tuna said:
chrispmartha said:
Dyson being registered in Singapore will mean it pays corporation tax in Singapore, true or not?
You didn't actually read the article, did you? chrispmartha said:
Regarding your second point where did I say The EU-Singapore tariffs will affect what we will pay in the UK?, I said the exact opposite if you read it.
chrispmartha said:
Doesn’t the FTA with singapore mean there will be no tarifs on the electric vehicles for countries within the EU? If so it could mean the UK has to pay tarifs on a car made by a supposedly british company?
You made a comment about tariffs being due in the EU, followed by If so.... That's basic 'Statement A, if true, statement B' logic. You absolutely suggested EU-Singapore tariff conditions could affect UK's tariff obligations.chrispmartha said:
Yes we might replicate the EU tariff and we may not, who knows?
Why on earth would we? We're currently in alignment with the EU, we're generally against protectionist tariffs and there is absolutely no will to increase the costs to UK consumers.By your condescending tone you seem to be trying to argue against something you want me to have said not what I actually think but anyway, read what I wrote about the tarrifs between the EU and Singapore, I am not saying what you think I am.
I said the FTA between Singapore and the EU (you know the one we are leaving) will mean there are no tariffs between Singapore and the EU, right?
If so (because we are keavingbthe EU, remember we are leaving the EU) the UK (you know the UK that’s leaving the EU who has a FTA with Singapore) may have to pay a tarrif on things from Singapore, right?
Anyway hope my condescending tone makes it easier for you to understand?
Edited by chrispmartha on Wednesday 23 January 21:10
fido said:
chrispmartha said:
Yes we might replicate the EU tariff and we may not, who knows?
Singapore seems happy to roll over the FTA when we leave the EU. I doubt they wouldn't given our close Commonwealth links.https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/spore-open-...
fido said:
Singapore seems happy to roll over the FTA when we leave the EU. I doubt they wouldn't given our close Commonwealth links.
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/spore-open-...
That's great news. Presumably our brilliant Trade Secretary Liam Fox has the deal ready to sign. Meanwhile back in the real world our buffoon of a trade secretary is not even close to signing even one deal to replace the ones we are losing by leaving the EU, let alone one with a new country. https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/spore-open-...
richie99 said:
fido said:
Singapore seems happy to roll over the FTA when we leave the EU. I doubt they wouldn't given our close Commonwealth links.
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/spore-open-...
That's great news. Presumably our brilliant Trade Secretary Liam Fox has the deal ready to sign. Meanwhile back in the real world our buffoon of a trade secretary is not even close to signing even one deal to replace the ones we are losing by leaving the EU, let alone one with a new country. https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/spore-open-...
"From the economic point of view, it is hard to make the argument that you will be in a superior position outside the EU than in. But I fully understand you have other considerations which may outweigh the economic one."
As for the UK looking to countries like Singapore and forging new ties, PM Lee said: "We are on the other side of the world... So I do not know that it is possible to model Britain on the same basis as Singapore."
chrispmartha said:
I said the FTA between Singapore and the EU (you know the one we are leaving) will mean there are no tariffs between Singapore and the EU, right?
If so (because we are keavingbthe EU, remember we are leaving the EU) the UK (you know the UK that’s leaving the EU who has a FTA with Singapore) may have to pay a tarrif on things from Singapore, right?
Anyway hope my condescending tone makes it easier for you to understand?
How do I tell it apart from your usual tone? If so (because we are keavingbthe EU, remember we are leaving the EU) the UK (you know the UK that’s leaving the EU who has a FTA with Singapore) may have to pay a tarrif on things from Singapore, right?
Anyway hope my condescending tone makes it easier for you to understand?
Maybe you need to work on explaining yourself. Your original text did not read the way of your heavy handed explanation. The only obligations on Brexit are that we do not apply preferential rates to countries unless there is a tariff agreement in place. Singapore has said it's very happy to roll over the FTA, so there really is no reason why we would 'have' to put a tariff on things from Singapore.
The irony being that the theoretical cost savings of manufacturing in Singapore would probably outweigh any tariffs we might apply anyway.
chrispmartha said:
I did read the article, can you show me where it says tgat Dyson won’t pay corporation tax in Singapore when it is registered there?
If my understanding of the taxation rules in Singapore is correct, they will pay pretty much the same level of corporation tax over there that they currently do. According to the article, the tax take in the UK will also stay much the same. What point were you trying to make?Tuna said:
chrispmartha said:
I did read the article, can you show me where it says tgat Dyson won’t pay corporation tax in Singapore when it is registered there?
If my understanding of the taxation rules in Singapore is correct, they will pay pretty much the same level of corporation tax over there that they currently do. According to the article, the tax take in the UK will also stay much the same. What point were you trying to make?“The move, announced on Tuesday, means Dyson is no longer a British registered company, with Singapore now becoming its main tax base.”
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/sir-james-dyson...
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