How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 10)
Discussion
Troubleatmill said:
Helicopter123 said:
I repeat, in case you are having some trouble understanding, Faisal has asked me not to post his personal number online, in full or in part.
I'm sure Faisal would have no problem with you posting up a selfie with the pair of you - and a tin of custard.I expect you to come back with a busted flush... (again)
ClaphamGT3 said:
Id like to agree but I don’t think this one will fade away that quickly; we have transcended the “a week is a long time in politics” rule. I suspect we are in for generational resentment on the EU issue, made worse when Brexiteers - or many of them - realise that leaving the EU is not a solution to their frustrations with the political establishment and the old chestnut that “whoever you vote for, the Government gets in” still holds true
IF we leave !!! if not I think this will be a cancer that will eat us , still smug though old chap , we didn't know what we were voting for etc Eh !!! oh well onward and upward ,,
Sorting this out is entirely in the gift of the tory party leave on no deal and it's the peoples fault if it goes wrong!!
water it down with May's treaty or stay in and it will be the death of the tory party, reset the resentment or we will have a Corbyn gov , Maybe you could ask Tarzan to stab May in the back like he did with Mrs T !! we need to see the back of that toxic bh before it's too late looks like 5 mins to midnight from where I am ...
Edited by powerstroke on Friday 19th April 00:27
TeamD said:
Toaster said:
Some in the UK couldn't give a stuff about where a trading border would have to go in the event we had a hard Brexit. So it is good to see others such as the US do not want to see a hard border between the north and south either
Wtf has is got to do with the US? B'stard Child said:
I've been banned for saying "foxtrot oscar" - seriously how easily offended do you have to be to press the report button for that.......
On the other side of the coin I've been called a on several occasions and I've not pressed the report button
I have pressed the report button many times when duplicate threads have been started or threads have been posted in the wrong section because that's far more important
Snowflakes everywhere.On the other side of the coin I've been called a on several occasions and I've not pressed the report button
I have pressed the report button many times when duplicate threads have been started or threads have been posted in the wrong section because that's far more important
The way of the world these days, best get used to it.
wisbech said:
TeamD said:
Toaster said:
Some in the UK couldn't give a stuff about where a trading border would have to go in the event we had a hard Brexit. So it is good to see others such as the US do not want to see a hard border between the north and south either
Wtf has is got to do with the US? S1KRR said:
ClaphamGT3 said:
Id like to agree but I don’t think this one will fade away that quickly; we have transcended the “a week is a long time in politics” rule. I suspect we are in for generational resentment on the EU issue, made worse when Brexiteers - or many of them - realise that leaving the EU is not a solution to their frustrations with the political establishment and the old chestnut that “whoever you vote for, the Government gets in” still holds true
Cant speak for othersMy vote to leave was never based on frustrations with National government. Only well known and long established frustrations with the EU.
A good idea run incredibly badly and to the detriment of millions.
wisbech said:
A US senator was the main facilitator/ go between in the talks, so they feel some ownership. Plus the Irish vote/ lobby is rather important in US
Yes, it appears easy to forget how that lobby ensured that the US authorities turned a blind eye to open IRA fund-raising in the US for years until the Americans got a taste of terrorism themselves. psi310398 said:
wisbech said:
A US senator was the main facilitator/ go between in the talks, so they feel some ownership. Plus the Irish vote/ lobby is rather important in US
Yes, it appears easy to forget how that lobby ensured that the US authorities turned a blind eye to open IRA fund-raising in the US for years until the Americans got a taste of terrorism themselves. Don't forget the wonderful US trade deal that our Bojo'esque politicians said would benefit us all so very much. And let's not forget that the US needs us more than the UK needs the US?
The murder of a journalist Lyra McKee in Derry/Londonderry last night demonstrates how toxic the UK political could become. My thoughts are with Lyra's loved ones this morning.
Ridgemont said:
Helicopter123 said:
ClaphamGT3 said:
A disturbing one. Even taking this at face value (never wise with a poll) it suggests that we are no closer to a meaningful national consensus on Brexit and, without very effective political leadership, we are set to remain a divided nation for some time to come
MPs will be paying attention.
Wonderful.
As a follow up I’d love to know what you think the impact to belief in a democratic process will be.
The house has a strong remain bias, but many MPs are fence sitting in effect, until they can be certain which way the wind is blowing. While reluctant to support leave, any indication of a shift towards remain in the public is quickly matched by behaviour in the commons.
We saw this recently when the revoke A50 petition attracted 6m signatures and made news headlines. Revoking A50 went from being a pariah in the HoC to getting 180 or so supporters in an indicative vote. It also made a 2nd confirmatory referendum mainstream. Note the language as well - it is confirming the selected Brexit outcome against the status quo. I see this poll very much as part of this context.
For me, revoking A50 outright would be democratically challenging and while some would welcome this, I don't think it would do any good in bringing the country back together again.
If we can find a consensus option that can unite enough 'soft leavers' and 'soft remainers', and win public support in a referendum then I think that is a positive outcome for democracy, achieved in very difficult circumstances. If the same option is rejected in a second vote, then we are probably back to square 1. In the EU, but not fully committed, UKIP/Brexit party polling 15-20% and we muddle on.
I cannot see any chain of events being allowed to unfold where 'no deal' happens as parliament simply will not permit it. The house, like the DUP, are above all Unionists with a few notable exceptions. Possibly a GE if Farage can make the breakthrough and win enough seats to prop up a Tory government although that is going to be tough with a FPTP electoral system? Realistically though, I can't see that as Labour Vote holding up much better around a soft brexit option/possible 2nd ref.
Edited by Helicopter123 on Friday 19th April 09:04
Both parties stood on a manifesto of Leave.
There is no such thing as “extreme leaving”.
It is just leaving.
I don’t really like the analogies I have seen on Brexit And this one is probably no better.
But when you told your folks you are leaving the family home- living in the attached double garage doesn’t count.
The Remainers (just a timely reminder lost the referendum) want to keep us on the family property by any means possible.
It would be easier to just leave.
Let the UK/EU then negotiate what kind of future relation they want.
Almost all Remainers were very clear that Leave means leaving the single market and customs union.
I agree.
There is no such thing as “extreme leaving”.
It is just leaving.
I don’t really like the analogies I have seen on Brexit And this one is probably no better.
But when you told your folks you are leaving the family home- living in the attached double garage doesn’t count.
The Remainers (just a timely reminder lost the referendum) want to keep us on the family property by any means possible.
It would be easier to just leave.
Let the UK/EU then negotiate what kind of future relation they want.
Almost all Remainers were very clear that Leave means leaving the single market and customs union.
I agree.
B'stard Child said:
I've been banned for saying "foxtrot oscar" - seriously how easily offended do you have to be to press the report button for that.......
On the other side of the coin I've been called a on several occasions and I've not pressed the report button
I have pressed the report button many times when duplicate threads have been started or threads have been posted in the wrong section because that's far more important
I've been banned once and was never told why? not even an email telling what rule I had broken.On the other side of the coin I've been called a on several occasions and I've not pressed the report button
I have pressed the report button many times when duplicate threads have been started or threads have been posted in the wrong section because that's far more important
I pressed the red button once on one of the house Trolls and announced I would do so.
I wouldn't want a Mods job for all the tea in China
ClaphamGT3 said:
S1KRR said:
I think its only because its on the news daily. Its constantly re-opening the scabs.
When we leave. Give it 12-18 months, people will adapt and politics will take more of a back seat in everyone's consciousness.
Id like to agree but I don’t think this one will fade away that quickly; we have transcended the “a week is a long time in politics” rule. I suspect we are in for generational resentment on the EU issue, made worse when Brexiteers - or many of them - realise that leaving the EU is not a solution to their frustrations with the political establishment and the old chestnut that “whoever you vote for, the Government gets in” still holds trueWhen we leave. Give it 12-18 months, people will adapt and politics will take more of a back seat in everyone's consciousness.
Robertj21a said:
S1KRR said:
ClaphamGT3 said:
Id like to agree but I don’t think this one will fade away that quickly; we have transcended the “a week is a long time in politics” rule. I suspect we are in for generational resentment on the EU issue, made worse when Brexiteers - or many of them - realise that leaving the EU is not a solution to their frustrations with the political establishment and the old chestnut that “whoever you vote for, the Government gets in” still holds true
Cant speak for othersMy vote to leave was never based on frustrations with National government. Only well known and long established frustrations with the EU.
A good idea run incredibly badly and to the detriment of millions.
Personally I just wish more of the Younger generation had have gotten if their backsides and voted as I think it would have swung the vote the other way, but cest las vie.
ClaphamGT3 said:
Id like to agree but I don’t think this one will fade away that quickly; we have transcended the “a week is a long time in politics” rule. I suspect we are in for generational resentment on the EU issue, made worse when Brexiteers - or many of them - realise that leaving the EU is not a solution to their frustrations with the political establishment and the old chestnut that “whoever you vote for, the Government gets in” still holds true
No resentment at all from dinner-table Remainers who will continue to refer to 'Brexiteers' and blame every small shift to the negative on being out of the EU? The memes I see on social media suggest that some are determined to keep the candle burning for the EU regardless of what happens in the UK.Our society seems to accumulate groups that 'will never forget' some sleight that has long stopped actually affecting their lives, but still dominates their politics. How far should we pander to them?
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