Gulf of Oman incidents

[Countdown]

BlackLabel said:

“NEW YORK (AP) — Britain has concluded that Iran was responsible for attacks on oil facilities in Saudi Arabia, U.K. Prime Minister Boris Johnson said Sunday. He said the U.K. would consider taking part in a U.S.-led military effort to bolster the Gulf kingdom’s defenses.”

https://apnews.com/ee973164333e44f4b94ea590590f4ed...

BoJo demonstrating what an arsewipe he can be. The problem is that we need the Saudis to buy our arms and the US for trade. Let's be completely honest about this; the US doesn't need our support in bombing the Iranians (or anybody else). We're just handy to have around when the stbomb explodes.

[Byker28i]

Countdown said:

BlackLabel said:

“NEW YORK (AP) — Britain has concluded that Iran was responsible for attacks on oil facilities in Saudi Arabia, U.K. Prime Minister Boris Johnson said Sunday. He said the U.K. would consider taking part in a U.S.-led military effort to bolster the Gulf kingdom’s defenses.”

https://apnews.com/ee973164333e44f4b94ea590590f4ed...

BoJo demonstrating what an arsewipe he can be. The problem is that we need the Saudis to buy our arms and the US for trade. Let's be completely honest about this; the US doesn't need our support in bombing the Iranians (or anybody else). We're just handy to have around when the stbomb explodes.

Boris had a long phone call with trump (well for trumps standards). No doubt being told that the UK would have a great deal, the best deal possible, after brexit if they went along with blaming Iran.
https://www.politico.eu/article/boris-johnson-blam...

Whats missing here is that if Iran launched/was responsible for the attack, then the russians probably also knew about it...

Edited by Byker28i on Monday 23 September 09:01

[IanH755]

BlackLabel said:

The Saudi armed forces, in particular their Air Force, are lavishly equipped with some of the best military gear money can buy yet when it comes to retaliation for this drone attack it’s America and it’s allies that are most likely to take action. The Saudis should fight their own wars. They are happy enough to bomb civilians in Yemen or take military action against protesters in Bahrain yet when it comes to Iran they want others to do their dirty work.

They won't because, despite having "all the best gear" they deep down know that they've "got no idea" and don't want to be humiliated if they fought (and potentially lost large numbers of planes) against a nation which could actually fight back, unless of course the US was there to hold their hand and make it "safe" first before the RSAF would fight.

I mean look at Yemen, their ground offensive was planned by officers who've studied at Sandhurst, Westpoint etc and therefore "should" be peer level to UK/US officers, yet the offensive is/was a disaster because despite having "all the gear" the troops themselves had "no idea" and the pretty planning boards the highly trained officers used bore zero relation to reality on the ground.

Plus the laughingly called "intel" of the air campaign which in some cases has been a Yemen "cousin" phoning his Saudi "cousin" and telling him that the big wedding party at Location XYZ is actually a meeting which needs bombing etc - zero story checking done, zero intel cross-checks, zero care about whether the story is true or not, just load-up and bombs away.

The UAE's Air Force (also involved) is actually pretty good however, their ground forces aren't great but the pilots are pretty good.

[Mothersruin]

IanH755 said:

BlackLabel said:

The Saudi armed forces, in particular their Air Force, are lavishly equipped with some of the best military gear money can buy yet when it comes to retaliation for this drone attack it’s America and it’s allies that are most likely to take action. The Saudis should fight their own wars. They are happy enough to bomb civilians in Yemen or take military action against protesters in Bahrain yet when it comes to Iran they want others to do their dirty work.

They won't because, despite having "all the best gear" they deep down know that they've "got no idea" and don't want to be humiliated if they fought (and potentially lost large numbers of planes) against a nation which could actually fight back, unless of course the US was there to hold their hand and make it "safe" first before the RSAF would fight.

I mean look at Yemen, their ground offensive was planned by officers who've studied at Sandhurst, Westpoint etc and therefore "should" be peer level to UK/US officers, yet the offensive is/was a disaster because despite having "all the gear" the troops themselves had "no idea" and the pretty planning boards the highly trained officers used bore zero relation to reality on the ground.

Plus the laughingly called "intel" of the air campaign which in some cases has been a Yemen "cousin" phoning his Saudi "cousin" and telling him that the big wedding party at Location XYZ is actually a meeting which needs bombing etc - zero story checking done, zero intel cross-checks, zero care about whether the story is true or not, just load-up and bombs away.

The UAE's Air Force (also involved) is actually pretty good however, their ground forces aren't great but the pilots are pretty good.

Have a read - https://www.meforum.org/441/why-arabs-lose-wars

From my experience, it's pretty much bang on - the core psychology applies to much of life in the Middle East with business, shopping (haggling), etc... being a series of mini-conflicts.

Just one note of the UAE pilots - not bad but treat their equipment like they do their cars - Daddy will buy them a new one if they trash it.

Also - they do buy the best gear, they also have problems with compatibility and having kit integrate well due to buying whatever was the shiniest at the time - rather than think about how it will work with it's older stuff and what their purchasing policy will be in the future. Their homegrown arms industry is starting to pick up as well. Small arms stuff is alright.

Edited by Mothersruin on Monday 23 September 13:37

[IanH755]

Mothersruin said:

IanH755 said:

BlackLabel said:

The Saudi armed forces, in particular their Air Force, are lavishly equipped with some of the best military gear money can buy yet when it comes to retaliation for this drone attack it’s America and it’s allies that are most likely to take action. The Saudis should fight their own wars. They are happy enough to bomb civilians in Yemen or take military action against protesters in Bahrain yet when it comes to Iran they want others to do their dirty work.

They won't because, despite having "all the best gear" they deep down know that they've "got no idea" and don't want to be humiliated if they fought (and potentially lost large numbers of planes) against a nation which could actually fight back, unless of course the US was there to hold their hand and make it "safe" first before the RSAF would fight.

I mean look at Yemen, their ground offensive was planned by officers who've studied at Sandhurst, Westpoint etc and therefore "should" be peer level to UK/US officers, yet the offensive is/was a disaster because despite having "all the gear" the troops themselves had "no idea" and the pretty planning boards the highly trained officers used bore zero relation to reality on the ground.

Plus the laughingly called "intel" of the air campaign which in some cases has been a Yemen "cousin" phoning his Saudi "cousin" and telling him that the big wedding party at Location XYZ is actually a meeting which needs bombing etc - zero story checking done, zero intel cross-checks, zero care about whether the story is true or not, just load-up and bombs away.

The UAE's Air Force (also involved) is actually pretty good however, their ground forces aren't great but the pilots are pretty good.

Have a read - https://www.meforum.org/441/why-arabs-lose-wars

From my experience, it's pretty much bang on - the core psychology applies to much of life in the Middle East with business, shopping (haggling), etc... being a series of mini-conflicts.

Just to add, I work with the Saudi Military on a daily basis and every point in that link is 100% correct.

[6th Gear]

Houthis claim to have killed 500 Saudi soldiers in major attack

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/29/hout...

[Mothersruin]

Interesting.

If true, I wonder where these 'Saudi' soldiers are from. They seem to be doing a rather lot of outsourcing so they can ensure no locals are captured or killed.

[Scobblelotcher]

The site is protected by US Patriot but it can’t cope with drones or sea skimming missiles (like cruise missiles) and provided no protection during the attack.

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-sendin...

[skwdenyer]

Scobblelotcher said:

The site is protected by US Patriot but it can’t cope with drones or sea skimming missiles (like cruise missiles) and provided no protection during the attack.

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-sendin...

So the attacks were actually a pre-sales demonstration by the Israelis in support of their Iron Dome system?

[Countdown]

skwdenyer said:

Scobblelotcher said:

The site is protected by US Patriot but it can’t cope with drones or sea skimming missiles (like cruise missiles) and provided no protection during the attack.

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-sendin...

So the attacks were actually a pre-sales demonstration by the Israelis in support of their Iron Dome system?

I think the problem with Iron Dome is that each missile costs something IRO $40k and each drone costs £24.99p (buy 3 for £50)

[Pupp]

And another...?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-50011...

[Biker 1]

Pupp said:

And another...?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-50011...

Assuming this is tit for tat, all it achieves is upping the oil price. I hope things don't escalate - a proper tinder box

[red_slr]

I wondered how long it would take after the release of the British ship for someone to pop cap in their @ss.

Now we know!