45th President of the United States, Donald Trump (Vol. 7)

45th President of the United States, Donald Trump (Vol. 7)

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Gandahar

8,923 posts

83 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
midenginedcoupe said:
Gandahar said:
Countdown said:
Gandahar said:
she throws popularistic comments as grinder to the mill rather than saying something that make you think. Just reaction, rather than ignoring it all and giving a valid viewpoint. She's no Churchill.

It's loud but it is not deep.
i thought she made a couple of fair points. Obviously YMMV.
I think she might be well falling into a trap .

"Men like him have been telling women like me to go back to my country for a long time"

Any proof? She comes from the USA, so surely she should be calling him out on that
stupid Donaldism rather than this silly claim.

"when he is doing that with thousands of people, he is putting millions of American people in danger"

scratchchin

That is something that Donald would come up with, thousands to millions .... what?

Like I said, it's not clever but it is a soundbite.
If that’s what you’re basing your complaint on, I’m utterly certain she’s more clever than you.

What on earth more do you need as “proof” that entitled white men have been telling women of Hispanic origin to go home? Do you really doubt that this doesn’t happen day in, day out, the length and breadth of the US? To think this is just a “silly claim” is to be ignorant of the entire social landscape of the US. If you can’t grasp this then there’s no point even moving on to the rest that you evidently can’t grasp.
Can I ask why you put "silly claim" in quotes ?

i didn't even say that, you did.



Countdown

27,498 posts

151 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
Gandahar said:
I think she might be well falling into a trap .

"Men like him have been telling women like me to go back to my country for a long time"

Any proof?
You're kidding? You've never heard of the likes of NF/BNP saying that Black/Asian people should "fk off back to where they came from!" That's precisely the kind of things that racists say and that's exactly what Trump was referencing. Next you'll be saying that there's no proof that Donald's a racist


Gandahar

8,923 posts

83 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
Seventy said:
Gandahar said:
"when he is doing that with thousands of people, he is putting millions of American people in danger"

scratchchin

That is something that Donald would come up with, thousands to millions .... what?

Like I said, it's not clever but it is a soundbite.
What she is saying is that when Trump whips up his thousands of supporters at his rallies with his divisive racist rhetoric he is putting millions of lives at risk.
"What she is saying is that when Trump whips up his thousands of supporters at his rallies with his divisive racist rhetoric he is putting millions of lives at risk."

And I disagree with this as overegging the pudding, as Donald does too.

That is my whole point, one side goes nuclear , mainly Donald, and the other side goes nuclear too. Which is not the right way because as history shows more left and right wing parties do worse for their countries than middle of the road ones.

The USA seems to be going down more left and right, at some point it will come back to be more centralised. At that point the current combatants will be history.

Hopefully.



midenginedcoupe

4,985 posts

87 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
Gandahar said:
midenginedcoupe said:
Gandahar said:
Countdown said:
Gandahar said:
she throws popularistic comments as grinder to the mill rather than saying something that make you think. Just reaction, rather than ignoring it all and giving a valid viewpoint. She's no Churchill.

It's loud but it is not deep.
i thought she made a couple of fair points. Obviously YMMV.
I think she might be well falling into a trap .

"Men like him have been telling women like me to go back to my country for a long time"

Any proof? She comes from the USA, so surely she should be calling him out on that
stupid Donaldism rather than this silly claim.

"when he is doing that with thousands of people, he is putting millions of American people in danger"

scratchchin

That is something that Donald would come up with, thousands to millions .... what?

Like I said, it's not clever but it is a soundbite.
If that’s what you’re basing your complaint on, I’m utterly certain she’s more clever than you.

What on earth more do you need as “proof” that entitled white men have been telling women of Hispanic origin to go home? Do you really doubt that this doesn’t happen day in, day out, the length and breadth of the US? To think this is just a “silly claim” is to be ignorant of the entire social landscape of the US. If you can’t grasp this then there’s no point even moving on to the rest that you evidently can’t grasp.
Can I ask why you put "silly claim" in quotes ?

i didn't even say that, you did.
It’s literally right there in your comment. That we both quoted. FFS.

This isn’t over-egging the pudding, or a swing to an extreme leftist position. Standing up against fascists who tell foreign-looking people to “go home” is a point of basic decency.

If you’re at the point that basic decency is seen as a far left position that we need to moderate against, then you need to take a step back and have a look at your Overton Window.

Alpinestars

13,397 posts

199 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
Gandahar said:
Can I ask why you put "silly claim" in quotes ?

i didn't even say that, you did.
And you’re inferring she’s not very smart? Words as well as numbers passing you by now.

Gandahar

8,923 posts

83 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
midenginedcoupe said:
Gandahar said:
midenginedcoupe said:
Gandahar said:
Countdown said:
Gandahar said:
she throws popularistic comments as grinder to the mill rather than saying something that make you think. Just reaction, rather than ignoring it all and giving a valid viewpoint. She's no Churchill.

It's loud but it is not deep.
i thought she made a couple of fair points. Obviously YMMV.
I think she might be well falling into a trap .

"Men like him have been telling women like me to go back to my country for a long time"

Any proof? She comes from the USA, so surely she should be calling him out on that
stupid Donaldism rather than this silly claim.

"when he is doing that with thousands of people, he is putting millions of American people in danger"

scratchchin

That is something that Donald would come up with, thousands to millions .... what?

Like I said, it's not clever but it is a soundbite.
If that’s what you’re basing your complaint on, I’m utterly certain she’s more clever than you.

What on earth more do you need as “proof” that entitled white men have been telling women of Hispanic origin to go home? Do you really doubt that this doesn’t happen day in, day out, the length and breadth of the US? To think this is just a “silly claim” is to be ignorant of the entire social landscape of the US. If you can’t grasp this then there’s no point even moving on to the rest that you evidently can’t grasp.
Can I ask why you put "silly claim" in quotes ?

i didn't even say that, you did.
It’s literally right there in your comment. That we both quoted. FFS.

This isn’t over-egging the pudding, or a swing to an extreme leftist position. Standing up against fascists who tell foreign-looking people to “go home” is a point of basic decency.

If you’re at the point that basic decency is seen as a far left position that we need to moderate against, then you need to take a step back and have a look at your Overton Window.
Firstly I never wrote "silly claim" you did and then put it in quotes, go read back the posts.

I still think it is over egging the pudding and falling into Donalds trap. It just plays into his hand come 2020, him John Wayne riding in to clear the swamp / homestead.

When he got elected he sucked up to the US distrust of central government. Now he has the swamp and the squad ! Double whammy to prey/pray? on right wing white central american fears.

The only way the Democrats can win 2020 is rallying around a non socialist middle of the road candidate like Biden.

They seem to have their own left wing Tea Party to deal with first though ....

On those words of wisdom, I shall leave to give your phlegm coated keyboards a chance to cool off wink

Have a very nice Sunday evening y'all !





Gandahar

8,923 posts

83 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
Alpinestars said:
Gandahar said:
Can I ask why you put "silly claim" in quotes ?

i didn't even say that, you did.
And you’re inferring she’s not very smart? Words as well as numbers passing you by now.
As a a PS I never said she was not smart. I said she was not smart fighting with Donald on his own terms on media. When you start flinging st ....

re-read again everything from the start. Basic summary is you will never win against Donald on his own terms. Thinking you can is not smart. It makes it worse for the Dems come 2020.


Seventy

2,852 posts

93 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
Gandahar said:
A s a a PS I never said she was not smart.
You sort of did.

Gandahar said:
She is no sharp knife is she?

br d

7,545 posts

181 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
Gandahar said:
Alpinestars said:
Gandahar said:
Can I ask why you put "silly claim" in quotes ?

i didn't even say that, you did.
And you’re inferring she’s not very smart? Words as well as numbers passing you by now.
As a a PS I never said she was not smart. I said she was not smart fighting with Donald on his own terms on media. When you start flinging st ....

re-read again everything from the start. Basic summary is you will never win against Donald on his own terms. Thinking you can is not smart. It makes it worse for the Dems come 2020.
I think you're wasting your time. Put just about anything anybody else says into Trumps mouth and it will be slaughtered, leave it at source and it will be praised, justified and redeemed.

The only acceptable argument in here is complete compliance with the groupthink, you aren't even allowed to hate trump but disagree with the narrow-band conclusions, that makes you a filthy racist supporter.

And yes I don't post here normally so you can all berate me for bombing and leaving which I'll happily do but you lot have honestly lost all sense of perspective, the years of thread hug has made this place an entirely debate free zone.

And as hoary an old chestnut as it is the complete refusal to see anything other than your laser beam like attention to a tiny slice of the spectrum is why this idiot is president in the first place. God fking help us if he gets in again but it's entirely possible while everyone obsesses with the colour of his hair and what party he went to in the eighties.

Only the crappy number plate thread is weirder than this place on PH and that's saying something.

midenginedcoupe

4,985 posts

87 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
Gandahar said:
midenginedcoupe said:
Gandahar said:
midenginedcoupe said:
Gandahar said:
Countdown said:
Gandahar said:
she throws popularistic comments as grinder to the mill rather than saying something that make you think. Just reaction, rather than ignoring it all and giving a valid viewpoint. She's no Churchill.

It's loud but it is not deep.
i thought she made a couple of fair points. Obviously YMMV.
I think she might be well falling into a trap .

"Men like him have been telling women like me to go back to my country for a long time"

Any proof? She comes from the USA, so surely she should be calling him out on that
stupid Donaldism rather than this silly claim.

"when he is doing that with thousands of people, he is putting millions of American people in danger"

scratchchin

That is something that Donald would come up with, thousands to millions .... what?

Like I said, it's not clever but it is a soundbite.
If that’s what you’re basing your complaint on, I’m utterly certain she’s more clever than you.

What on earth more do you need as “proof” that entitled white men have been telling women of Hispanic origin to go home? Do you really doubt that this doesn’t happen day in, day out, the length and breadth of the US? To think this is just a “silly claim” is to be ignorant of the entire social landscape of the US. If you can’t grasp this then there’s no point even moving on to the rest that you evidently can’t grasp.
Can I ask why you put "silly claim" in quotes ?

i didn't even say that, you did.
It’s literally right there in your comment. That we both quoted. FFS.

This isn’t over-egging the pudding, or a swing to an extreme leftist position. Standing up against fascists who tell foreign-looking people to “go home” is a point of basic decency.

If you’re at the point that basic decency is seen as a far left position that we need to moderate against, then you need to take a step back and have a look at your Overton Window.
Firstly I never wrote "silly claim" you did and then put it in quotes, go read back the posts.

I still think it is over egging the pudding and falling into Donalds trap. It just plays into his hand come 2020, him John Wayne riding in to clear the swamp / homestead.

When he got elected he sucked up to the US distrust of central government. Now he has the swamp and the squad ! Double whammy to prey/pray? on right wing white central american fears.

The only way the Democrats can win 2020 is rallying around a non socialist middle of the road candidate like Biden.

They seem to have their own left wing Tea Party to deal with first though ....

On those words of wisdom, I shall leave to give your phlegm coated keyboards a chance to cool off wink

Have a very nice Sunday evening y'all !
Not playing with a full deck tonight, are we.

I've gone back and bolded your own words for you.

There's nothing even remotely equivalent between the tea party movement and AOC!? This false-equivalence nonsense of "I think one is far right, the other far left, so the sensible position must be somewhere in-between" is just politically illiterate and demonstrates a lack of applying any critical thought whatsoever.

Byker chose a good time to have a few days away from the thread. Seagulling "specials" don't exactly add to the experience.

_dobbo_

12,108 posts

203 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
Gandahar said:
On those words of wisdom, I shall leave to give your phlegm coated keyboards a chance to cool off wink
Perhaps your phlegm coated computer screen is stopping you from reading the words you literally wrote, then denied writing, in a textbook move from the Trump playbook.

Gameface

12,902 posts

32 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
br d said:
what party he went to in the eighties.
If he was fking kids at those parties, that's something worth looking into is it not?

Alpinestars

13,397 posts

199 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
Gandahar said:
As a a PS I never said she was not smart. I said she was not smart fighting with Donald on his own terms on media. When you start flinging st ....

re-read again everything from the start. Basic summary is you will never win against Donald on his own terms. Thinking you can is not smart. It makes it worse for the Dems come 2020.
I’d suggest you re watch the video. And re read your words. Slowly.

Escapegoat

4,832 posts

90 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
br d said:
Only the crappy number plate thread is weirder than this place on PH and that's saying something.
OK, 'fess up: what's your vanity plate?

Tartan Pixie

1,538 posts

102 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
br d said:
I think you're wasting your time. Put just about anything anybody else says into Trumps mouth and it will be slaughtered, leave it at source and it will be praised, justified and redeemed.

The only acceptable argument in here is complete compliance with the groupthink, you aren't even allowed to hate trump but disagree with the narrow-band conclusions, that makes you a filthy racist supporter.

And yes I don't post here normally so you can all berate me for bombing and leaving which I'll happily do but you lot have honestly lost all sense of perspective, the years of thread hug has made this place an entirely debate free zone.

And as hoary an old chestnut as it is the complete refusal to see anything other than your laser beam like attention to a tiny slice of the spectrum is why this idiot is president in the first place. God fking help us if he gets in again but it's entirely possible while everyone obsesses with the colour of his hair and what party he went to in the eighties.

Only the crappy number plate thread is weirder than this place on PH and that's saying something.
How much of this is self fulfilling prophecy?

Are there people in this thread who are rabidly anti-Trump? Yes.

Are there people like myself and others who are very welcoming of debate? Yes.

When someone comes in to this thread to provide balance they never come at me, to the point where I have have to go out on a limb to try and engage. My posts must run in to tens of thousands of words so it's not like there isn't opportunity to engage with me, however the people wanting to provide balance avoid posters like me and go straight for the low intellect engagement with anti-Trumpers. Every. F'ing. Time.

What you see of the world is a reflection of how you engage with the world.

RobDickinson

29,892 posts

209 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
From the experts in nazi/fascism..


vonuber

13,507 posts

120 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
Gameface said:
br d said:
what party he went to in the eighties.
If he was fking kids at those parties, that's something worth looking into is it not?
Apparently not, it seems - a lot of those 'I don't support trump but' posters seem oddly quiet on this.

paulguitar

6,028 posts

68 months

Sunday 21st July 2019
quotequote all
br d said:
Put just about anything anybody else says into Trumps mouth and it will be slaughtered, leave it at source and it will be praised, justified and redeemed.
I'm amazed if you sincerely belive that.



Gameface

12,902 posts

32 months

Monday 22nd July 2019
quotequote all
I have to say, having met Brad briefly and having read his posts on here over the years, I'm surprised by his stance on this one.

Tartan Pixie

1,538 posts

102 months

Monday 22nd July 2019
quotequote all
midenginedcoupe said:
It’s literally right there in your comment. That we both quoted. FFS.

This isn’t over-egging the pudding, or a swing to an extreme leftist position. Standing up against fascists who tell foreign-looking people to “go home” is a point of basic decency.

If you’re at the point that basic decency is seen as a far left position that we need to moderate against, then you need to take a step back and have a look at your Overton Window.
Where in this world do we put an overton window where 'basic decency is seen as a far left position'?

From the small slice I've seen of this world my understanding is that the UK and northern Europe is actually quite extreme in its liberalism. Outside of the home countries I have huge blind spots in Asia and South America which I've never been to so can't say how our British overton window compares to them, however I am familiar with the overton windows in parts of southern Africa and the middle east so that is to me the benchmark for the global overton window and frankly the trumpettes barely touch the sides.

Even if like me your Arabic is rusiter than the front wheel arches of a ford puma then google translate does a good enough job that it's worth diving in to the content of mainstream channels like Al Jazera and you'll quickly find that Fox looks seriously tame compared to their debates about what a woman is allowed to do, or indeed the general level of racism and sexism that is considered normal.

The point here is regression to a mean value: The overton window is now global therefore the trend is towards the global average of opinion, of which the UK is on the extreme liberal end.

Whatever we fought for via the suffragettes, pride, etc, we've got to do it again on a global scale.
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