How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 13)
Discussion
DeepEnd said:
loafer123 said:
I’m a Leaver who believes that immigration has added huge value to this country and should continue, but which should be controlled closely by government.
Where do I sit in your binary world?
Do you feel strongly about the need for controlled immigration, or are you relaxed about freedom of movement with the EU?Where do I sit in your binary world?
Tuna said:
DeepEnd said:
Tuna said:
Silly claims that Brexit will be either a disaster or softer than the softest puppy (both "wins" for people opposed to it), based on the fear of change.
Again with this "resistance to change" myth. It's presumably thrown around as a mild insult but missing the mark in an amusingly ironic way. I haven't said changes to GI would be bad - I've explained why the rules have implications (which the example amusingly led you to say "nevermind champagne and it's really rare isn't it?) and we are likely to maintain them. It's true its another example of why when you get into the realities the divergence benefits are fictional - a theoretical benefit that sounded good as a by line for "take back control".
I do think when all the "benefits" of divergence are weighed up, Brexit will look like the huge net failure it is widely predicted to be by those pesky experts.
You have been free to refute this idea for months with a counter argument with specific benefits and yet refuse to do so.
Helicopter123 said:
DeepEnd said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
Most Brexiteers are not against immigration, they support controlled immigration. You don't seem to understand the distinction between the two.
They still have a fear around immigration which leads to their obsession with it - controlled. legal, illegal or otherwise. You don't seem able to understand your own fixation - uttering "controlled" in front of immigration doesn't make you any less fanatical about it.
It's all just dog-whistle stuff.
loafer123 said:
DeepEnd said:
loafer123 said:
I’m a Leaver who believes that immigration has added huge value to this country and should continue, but which should be controlled closely by government.
Where do I sit in your binary world?
Do you feel strongly about the need for controlled immigration, or are you relaxed about freedom of movement with the EU?Where do I sit in your binary world?
Many people don't care.
Those that do care enough to bang on about it clearly do have an issue with immigration, no matter why you think those concerns are "legitimate".
DeepEnd said:
loafer123 said:
DeepEnd said:
loafer123 said:
I’m a Leaver who believes that immigration has added huge value to this country and should continue, but which should be controlled closely by government.
Where do I sit in your binary world?
Do you feel strongly about the need for controlled immigration, or are you relaxed about freedom of movement with the EU?Where do I sit in your binary world?
Many people don't care.
Those that do care enough to bang on about it clearly do have an issue with immigration, no matter why you think those concerns are "legitimate".
We aren’t going to be in the EU....
DeepEnd said:
In net terms, no, I forecast only net downsides and a negative economic & reputational impact. I keep asked for examples of benefits and no one here can articulate any with any tangible evidence or monetary predictions.
I haven't said changes to GI would be bad - I've explained why the rules have implications (which the example amusingly led you to say "nevermind champagne and it's really rare isn't it?) and we are likely to maintain them. It's true its another example of why when you get into the realities the divergence benefits are fictional - a theoretical benefit that sounded good as a by line for "take back control".
I do think when all the "benefits" of divergence are weighed up, Brexit will look like the huge net failure it is widely predicted to be by those pesky experts.
You have been free to refute this idea for months with a counter argument with specific benefits and yet refuse to do so.
It's a good job you are neither an expert, or been able to quantify downside risks. There are loads of benefits, within the last few pages; we've quoted Carney and the Head of a Legal and General talking about benefits of divergence. I haven't said changes to GI would be bad - I've explained why the rules have implications (which the example amusingly led you to say "nevermind champagne and it's really rare isn't it?) and we are likely to maintain them. It's true its another example of why when you get into the realities the divergence benefits are fictional - a theoretical benefit that sounded good as a by line for "take back control".
I do think when all the "benefits" of divergence are weighed up, Brexit will look like the huge net failure it is widely predicted to be by those pesky experts.
You have been free to refute this idea for months with a counter argument with specific benefits and yet refuse to do so.
Of course, you can constantly display your ignorance or contempt by saying it didn't or hasn't happened; but it has. These experts are constantly aligned AGAINST your point of view - but you claim the contrary. The forecast for PMI data is up from 49.3 to 50.7 (which indicates economic expansion). You claim that you have experts aligned, but when it comes to actual data - its non-existent.
If you view the world entirely through the prism of BREXIT, you will inevitably fail in here (and how you deal with BREXIT "if" you are in business).
It simply doesn't exist in isolation.
DeepEnd said:
gooner1 said:
Does the EU financially award Turkey for allowing people from outside of the EU into it?
Thus taking a perceived or real concern over services , infrastructure away from some EU
member states, or fear of as some like to name it?
You seem fixated with immigration. kiThus taking a perceived or real concern over services , infrastructure away from some EU
member states, or fear of as some like to name it?
Not surprised by your refusal to answer the relevant question though ajd.
Stay in Bed Instead said:
Can any positive outcomes yet be guaranteed?
Can anything in the future be "guaranteed"? We might not leave on the 31st - if the sun decides to throw a coronal mass ejection in our direction in the next week or so, I'd almost guarantee we won't...
We'll be too busy trying to survive to worry about st like supranational politics.
And when asked for links to Carney making positive predictions (he's on record saying the deal is not as good for the economy as Mays, albeit it's better than no deal), we get the well worn "no one can predict the future!".
Which is it - "we've proved it's going to be great on these pages many times" or "we can't possibly know?"
Which is it - "we've proved it's going to be great on these pages many times" or "we can't possibly know?"
Sway said:
Dont like rolls said:
Sway said:
Fortunately, the expensive steak I ate was on expenses. Annoyingly, it means I've still not managed to try true Kobe wagyu beef... One day...
I have twice, both times in Japan, I can honestly say it is a pleasure I treasure, it defies description. (My host paid both time thank god)Do you know which 'grade' you had, and if different across each steak, how it effected the experience?
It is very much worth the investment, I would rather spend on that experience again rather than ANY other experience in Japan (if I had to choose). Memorable seems superficial.
Dont like rolls said:
I do not, but I have since seen Tv travel/food program and I believe it was the top grade. I remember being rather shocked at the price and very happy not to be the one paying for it. The Restaurant was called Kokubu.
It is very much worth the investment, I would rather spend on that experience again rather than ANY other experience in Japan (if I had to choose). Memorable seems superficial.
It is very much worth the investment, I would rather spend on that experience again rather than ANY other experience in Japan (if I had to choose). Memorable seems superficial.
I restate my jealousy.
I've had the opportunity to buy grade 5 Wagyu Kobe twice - neither time did I have anything like the spare funds available.
I now know someone who can get it for me "whenever" - I think one of my goals for 2020 is to make that my birthday meal treat... I'll start saving, only got until June.
Sway said:
I restate my jealousy.
I've had the opportunity to buy grade 5 Wagyu Kobe twice - neither time did I have anything like the spare funds available.
I now know someone who can get it for me "whenever" - I think one of my goals for 2020 is to make that my birthday meal treat... I'll start saving, only got until June.
The only bad bit was that I did have to fund the meal myself, but it was my birthday, so easily justified!
There was no-one else at the Teppenyaki grill, so I got a one to one chat with the chef too!
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff