How do we think EU negotiations will go? (Vol 13)

[anonymous-user]

Stay in Bed Instead said:

These days I have trouble negotiating with my arse on whether it's a fart or a dump. But I digress ...

We did wonder about the stains.

[NerveAgent]

Murph7355 said:

Stay in Bed Instead said:

Gees, all the positive promises made by team leave and here we are threatening to leave with nothing if we don't get our own way.

Freedom to fk up half our exports.

Here we go... Rerun of the last 3yrs.

The fannies come out in force

You've never negotiated anything, have you?

An interesting point, Brits (well Northern Europeans in general) don’t really do bartering / haggling in everyday life as much. I think this can cause a strong reaction in this sort of thing.

For me, it just feels like we are going through some stupid motions.

[crankedup]

ollyprice87 said:

Stay in Bed Instead said:

They may if we become uncompetitive.

Did you not realise this?

Seems many didn't realise that if British good carried carried extra tariffs and thus become uncompetitive then EU countries may go elsewhere. Or they just believed all the jingoistic bks coming out of Johnson and Farage and that they'd always buy goods from good old Blighty.

Price is not always the deciding factor, did you know that goods ‘Made in England’ (and U.K.) carries a huge amount of prestige with buyers from overseas? The Chinese in particular place a very high respect and regard. It is understood that the U.K. will not, indeed cannot compete on the lowest cost highest production trade formula, there are some exceptions but I speak in general terms.

[anonymous-user]

crankedup said:

ollyprice87 said:

Stay in Bed Instead said:

They may if we become uncompetitive.

Did you not realise this?

Seems many didn't realise that if British good carried carried extra tariffs and thus become uncompetitive then EU countries may go elsewhere. Or they just believed all the jingoistic bks coming out of Johnson and Farage and that they'd always buy goods from good old Blighty.

Price is not always the deciding factor, did you know that goods ‘Made in England’ (and U.K.) carries a huge amount of prestige with buyers from overseas? The Chinese in particular place a very high respect and regard. It is understood that the U.K. will not, indeed cannot compete on the lowest cost highest production trade formula, there are some exceptions but I speak in general terms.

So just the small challenge of adjusting the ratio of manufacturing:services then?

[sugerbear]

Vanden Saab said:

Stay in Bed Instead said:

They may if we become uncompetitive.

Did you not realise this?

Why will they become uncompetitive?

In your head do you think Tariffs lower the price of goods for the end consumer?

[Jazzer77]

Chairman (and self titled Brexit hardman!) Steve Baker has resigned from the ERG.
He's been deleting tweets referencing an easy Brexit from his timeline.


Hardly the actions of someone thinking its all sunlit uplands.

[gazapc]

ollyprice87 said:

It'll be fine, these upstanding gentlemen told me.

Anyone who brings up these sort of quotes should be mocked.

Picking one example, of course you are well aware that the Liam Fox quote continued to say "The only reason that we wouldn’t come to a free and open agreement is because politics gets in the way of economics"

Like the politics of the EU's wish to not have a Britain that is 'too' competitive on their doorstep.

[ollyprice87]

gazapc said:

Anyone who brings up these sort of quotes should be mocked.

Picking one example, of course you are well aware that the Liam Fox quote continued to say "The only reason that we wouldn’t come to a free and open agreement is because politics gets in the way of economics"

Like the politics of the EU's wish to not have a Britain that is 'too' competitive on their doorstep.

Feel free to mock me. I honestly can't believe anyone will defend Liam Fox. Another classic from him;

"We're going to replicate the 40 EU free trade agreements that exist before we leave the European Union so we've got no disruption of trade,"

"I hear people saying 'oh we won't have any [free trade agreements] before we leave'. Well, believe me, we'll have up to 40 ready for one second after midnight in March 2019,"

"All these faint hearts saying we cannot do it — it's absolute rubbish."

You've been sold a pup.

[Jazzer77]

If I was on the European team, I'd squeeze the absolute gonads out of Britain.

Its a zero sum game and every loss of Britain is a win somewhere in the EU.
Eg. European Medicines agency relocating to Amsterdam with loss of 900 well paid jobs.

Any method to hinder would be on the table.


The British team looks completely inept.
Lis Truss -"Secretary of State for International Trade and President of the Board of Trade". I've never seen an individual so out of their depth.



Its a turkey shoot for the EU at the moment and we're lucky they are playing it so straight.
Whole thing would be laughable if it wasn't so serious.

[Stay in Bed Instead]

gazapc said:

Anyone who brings up these sort of quotes should be mocked.

Picking one example, of course you are well aware that the Liam Fox quote continued to say "The only reason that we wouldn’t come to a free and open agreement is because politics gets in the way of economics"

Like the politics of the EU's wish to not have a Britain that is 'too' competitive on their doorstep.

Or the politics of the UK to get brexit done.

[Crackie]

ollyprice87 said:

Tuna said:

ollyprice87 said:

Stay in Bed Instead said:

They may if we become uncompetitive.

Did you not realise this?

Seems many didn't realise that if British good carried carried extra tariffs and thus become uncompetitive then EU countries may go elsewhere. Or they just believed all the jingoistic bks coming out of Johnson and Farage and that they'd always buy goods from good old Blighty.

If you think tariffs uniquely control our competitiveness, you've not been paying attention.

There is the tariffs, also the supply chain issues with Just In Time production that will ravage our car industry. I feel I should qualify that statement with the fact that I work for one of the largest polymer automotive component manufacturers in the world.

Nice article here too - https://www.birmingham.ac.uk/research/perspective/...

In what capacity do you work for the moulding company?

Do you mean JIT production for suppliers based in the UK or the EU. In either case, why do think JIT production of plastic parts for cars will be impacted?

[ollyprice87]

Jazzer77 said:

If I was on the European team, I'd squeeze the absolute gonads out of Britain.

Its a zero sum game and every loss of Britain is a win somewhere in the EU.
Eg. European Medicines agency relocating to Amsterdam with loss of 900 well paid jobs.

Any method to hinder would be on the table.


The British team looks completely inept.
Lis Truss -"Secretary of State for International Trade and President of the Board of Trade". I've never seen an individual so out of their depth.



Its a turkey shoot for the EU at the moment and we're lucky they are playing it so straight.
Whole thing would be laughable if it wasn't so serious.

Pork Markets.

[Sway]

ollyprice87 said:

Tuna said:

ollyprice87 said:

Stay in Bed Instead said:

They may if we become uncompetitive.

Did you not realise this?

Seems many didn't realise that if British good carried carried extra tariffs and thus become uncompetitive then EU countries may go elsewhere. Or they just believed all the jingoistic bks coming out of Johnson and Farage and that they'd always buy goods from good old Blighty.

If you think tariffs uniquely control our competitiveness, you've not been paying attention.

There is the tariffs, also the supply chain issues with Just In Time production that will ravage our car industry. I feel I should qualify that statement with the fact that I work for one of the largest polymer automotive component manufacturers in the world.

Nice article here too - https://www.birmingham.ac.uk/research/perspective/...

Amazing how Honda Swindon can supply engines to Japan under JIT, with staggering variations in transit times - yet the UK factories can't with Continental suppliers and far lower delivery time variations...

Suppose I should clarify I've designed and implemented multinational JIT operations for quite a few companies...

[amusingduck]

You see it coming a mile off, but it always amuses

[ollyprice87]

Crackie said:

In what capacity do you work for the moulding company?

Do you mean JIT production for suppliers based in the UK or the EU. In either case, why do think JIT production of plastic parts for cars will be impacted?

EU and worldwide, (South Africa, Mexico to name a few) We make all sorts really. Seals, pipes for water and air, those vile panels on the Citroen Cactus but the main one is bumpers. Audi will literally come to us and say we are building x amount of A4's today in x colour and so the bumpers will leave our plant on a little train, go over to the Audi plant and they will bolt them straight on. Warehousing costs a fortune so stockpiling isn't a viable solution.

That's just one example but you've already seen Honda announce closure of Swindon. Nissan are getting jumpy with Sunderland. If there are any issues in this supply chain and they've got tariffs to consider as well, then they will say fk it. Lot of our factories in Germany are moving to places like Hungary where there is a huge quantity of auto factories and the workers to man them. Yes, the quality at the UK factories will be a big factor but the auto industry is dog eat dog and if this trade agreement doesn't suit them, they will pull out.

[jamoor]

Vanden Saab said:

Stay in Bed Instead said:

Gees, all the positive promises made by team leave and here we are threatening to leave with nothing if we don't get our own way.

Freedom to fk up half our exports.

Why will the Eu stop buying UK goods?

Because the factories have relocation to the EU

[hutchst]

amusingduck said:

ollyprice87 said:

There is the tariffs, also the supply chain issues with Just In Time production that will ravage our car industry.

BINGO!

I'm currently working in an industry that pumps huge quantities of liquids at very high pressures over very large distances. Interruption is not an option. We deal with that by including large buffer tanks at strategic locations throughout the networks.

[ollyprice87]

Sway said:

Amazing how Honda Swindon can supply engines to Japan under JIT, with staggering variations in transit times - yet the UK factories can't with Continental suppliers and far lower delivery time variations...

Suppose I should clarify I've designed and implemented multinational JIT operations for quite a few companies...

The same Honda that is closing it's Swindon plant next year? Nice.

[NoNeed]

ollyprice87 said:

Sway said:

Amazing how Honda Swindon can supply engines to Japan under JIT, with staggering variations in transit times - yet the UK factories can't with Continental suppliers and far lower delivery time variations...

Suppose I should clarify I've designed and implemented multinational JIT operations for quite a few companies...

The same Honda that is closing it's Swindon plant next year? Nice.

Due to the EU stitching us up

[amusingduck]

ollyprice87 said:

Sway said:

Amazing how Honda Swindon can supply engines to Japan under JIT, with staggering variations in transit times - yet the UK factories can't with Continental suppliers and far lower delivery time variations...

Suppose I should clarify I've designed and implemented multinational JIT operations for quite a few companies...

The same Honda that is closing it's Swindon plant next year? Nice.

No comments on how they managed to use JIT without an EU FTA then?

Colour me surprised