39 bodies found in Lorry : illegals ?
Discussion
Petrus1983 said:
Quick Wiki check on the last big incident like this was 60 Chinese immigrants - the driver in that case knew what he was doing and got 14 years for manslaughter. Can't blame the police for keeping the driver and working out what's gone on. If he didn't know anything I'd imagine he's very scared/sad/worried right now.
Precisely, just like they do with captains of the air and sea...red_slr said:
Last time I checked the UKBA are trained to monitor, check and detain etc.... its their job. Which they evidently cant do very well despite their budget of the best part of £3Bn.
We spend billions every year on the police and yet we still have crime. I mean, what on Earth is going on...From looking at the video on sky news it seems a random spot to have stopped the lorry. On a road opposite a T junction which may indicate the dirver was stopped by police?
I wonder if it was the lorry unit that entered the UK on Saturday while the container/trailer was shipped via another route?
Who knows how long the people must have spent in there in what would be a sealed fridge unit.
I wonder if it was the lorry unit that entered the UK on Saturday while the container/trailer was shipped via another route?
Who knows how long the people must have spent in there in what would be a sealed fridge unit.
Arrested for one thing. Will probably be charged with a lesser offence if the deceased got onto his lorry without his knowledge.
One of my brother’s drivers was arrested on a totally spurious higher level offence a few years ago when one was found to have clambered into his lorry (french side). It was complicated a bit by the fact that there were a couple of passports found in the wagon’s glove box which a previous driver and mate had left by mistake in the vehicle - leading to some serious questions to be answered about why there were two passports for people who weren’t in the vehicle! In the end my brother paid a £1,000 fine issued to his driver, which seems to be the baseline for each one found on your vehicle (or was at the time).
Interestingly, the responses when I posted for advice on here was that my brother was a people trafficking, passport forging, drug dealing no good b
d, which is about as far from the truth as can be imagined 
One of my brother’s drivers was arrested on a totally spurious higher level offence a few years ago when one was found to have clambered into his lorry (french side). It was complicated a bit by the fact that there were a couple of passports found in the wagon’s glove box which a previous driver and mate had left by mistake in the vehicle - leading to some serious questions to be answered about why there were two passports for people who weren’t in the vehicle! In the end my brother paid a £1,000 fine issued to his driver, which seems to be the baseline for each one found on your vehicle (or was at the time).
Interestingly, the responses when I posted for advice on here was that my brother was a people trafficking, passport forging, drug dealing no good b
d, which is about as far from the truth as can be imagined greygoose said:
Mrr T said:
red_slr said:
Sounds like a load of foreigners attempting illegal entry. Crazy we spend all this money on UK Border Force and they cant detect almost 40 people in the back of a truck.
Reading the story the lorry would not have passed through a UK border post. For the hard of thinking:
The driver has been ARRESTED on suspicion of murder. He/she has not yet been CHARGED with any offence. Arrest and charge (in England and Wales) are two VERY different things.
There are a number of possible outcomes for the arrested driver, ranging from being charged with 39 counts of murder, through 39 counts of manslaughter, through charges/summons/postal requisition for a load of other potential offences, to being released on bail, released under investigation or being released without charge.
It is way too early to know what the outcome will be fir the driver. I hope the ambulance crews, police officers and CSIs etc get the proper post incident support they may well need after this.
It’s a tragedy, whichever way you look at it. 39 people are dead and a load more people will have to deal with that - their families and friends, as well as people dealing with the incident.
The driver has been ARRESTED on suspicion of murder. He/she has not yet been CHARGED with any offence. Arrest and charge (in England and Wales) are two VERY different things.
There are a number of possible outcomes for the arrested driver, ranging from being charged with 39 counts of murder, through 39 counts of manslaughter, through charges/summons/postal requisition for a load of other potential offences, to being released on bail, released under investigation or being released without charge.
It is way too early to know what the outcome will be fir the driver. I hope the ambulance crews, police officers and CSIs etc get the proper post incident support they may well need after this.
It’s a tragedy, whichever way you look at it. 39 people are dead and a load more people will have to deal with that - their families and friends, as well as people dealing with the incident.
red_slr said:
The blame rests with the driver. Its his responsibility simple as that. That is assuming he picked up the trailer at the origin. Given he has been arrested I suspect that is going to be the case, because if he was simply trunking the trailer from A to B after it arrived in the UK he would just be interviewed one would presume.
It’s not a simple witness statement There are 39 people dead .. there is a criminal investigation
The driver is an significant part of that investigation
He need to answer questions .. serious questions and they need to be asked under caution and with him having appropriate legal representation
Therefore Arrest is the only way to do it
He may subsequently become a witness for the crown but at this time must be treated as a suspect and the law is rightly very prescriptive about how that should happen
Dr Murdoch said:
Eric Mc said:
It will almost undoubtedly be down to suffocation. It's not the first time this has happened - although I can't recall an incident on this scale before.
I agree, but shouldn't it be man slaughter?Eric Mc said:
Perhaps. The police charge based on what they see. The CPS will prosecute under what they consider is the most likely crime they feel has been committed - and on what charge they are most likely to get a conviction.
Police don’t charge Police gather evidence which they present to the CPS who make the charging decision
( except in some minor offences where the charging decision is still the Police )
Friend of mine worked in child and sex trafficking, police before any smartarse comments, this is not a well known route to get people into mainland UK from eastern Europe. However, Holyhead is the UKs second biggest port and it at capacity so trucks are just waved through.
He said unless they are given proper intel then there is no chance of stopping the trafficking.
The joys of open borders.
Oh, and the whole of the the Dartford area is being controlled by the Eastern Europeans.
He had to get out as he couldn't handle the stuff he was having to deal with. Proper nasty.
Poor fkers in there.
He said unless they are given proper intel then there is no chance of stopping the trafficking.
The joys of open borders.
Oh, and the whole of the the Dartford area is being controlled by the Eastern Europeans.
He had to get out as he couldn't handle the stuff he was having to deal with. Proper nasty.
Poor f
kers in there. Edited by gizlaroc on Wednesday 23 October 17:28
Paddymcc said:
From looking at the video on sky news it seems a random spot to have stopped the lorry. On a road opposite a T junction which may indicate the dirver was stopped by police?
I wonder if it was the lorry unit that entered the UK on Saturday while the container/trailer was shipped via another route?
Who knows how long the people must have spent in there in what would be a sealed fridge unit.
Possibly intelligence lead, like many customs investigations. Like drug smugglers, they may have wanted to know his destination to identify the wider gang?I wonder if it was the lorry unit that entered the UK on Saturday while the container/trailer was shipped via another route?
Who knows how long the people must have spent in there in what would be a sealed fridge unit.
Hereward said:
I had naively assumed every truck/container entering the country passed through some sort of giant x-ray and/or thermal imaging unit.
RIP
They don't have that infrastructure at Holyhead. They do have a mobile xray truck there at times. Biggest issue at Holyhead is space, worked on some detection kit there and when is use it used to cause chaos with traffic coming off the ferries.RIP
Edited by scrw. on Wednesday 23 October 11:33
I expect they won't.
However,. after Brexit, when the world is perfect, this will never happen again as the Border Force will be enlarged massively (at no cost to the Exchequer, of course) and every truck coming into the country will be thoroughly searched by a large team. Of course, it does mean that your French apples will have rotted before they hit the supermarket shelves and your waiting time for that spare part your washing machine needs will take a month to clear customs and border checks.
In reality, you just can't have smooth passage of goods through borders AND have thorough checking of vehicles. The two concepts are mutually incompatible.
However,. after Brexit, when the world is perfect, this will never happen again as the Border Force will be enlarged massively (at no cost to the Exchequer, of course) and every truck coming into the country will be thoroughly searched by a large team. Of course, it does mean that your French apples will have rotted before they hit the supermarket shelves and your waiting time for that spare part your washing machine needs will take a month to clear customs and border checks.
In reality, you just can't have smooth passage of goods through borders AND have thorough checking of vehicles. The two concepts are mutually incompatible.
vaud said:
Possibly intelligence lead, like many customs investigations. Like drug smugglers, they may have wanted to know his destination to identify the wider gang?
Possible however if you suspected people onboard a fridge trailer you would surely be looking to stop that ASAP and not let it drive from Holyhead on Saturday to Essex last night.About the only clear thing is the story reported doesnt add up, yet.
Eric Mc said:
However,. after Brexit, when the world is perfect, this will never happen again as the Border Force will be enlarged massively (at no cost to the Exchequer, of course) and every truck coming into the country will be thoroughly searched by a large team.
Don't turn it into a Brexit thread.Gameface said:
Eric Mc said:
However,. after Brexit, when the world is perfect, this will never happen again as the Border Force will be enlarged massively (at no cost to the Exchequer, of course) and every truck coming into the country will be thoroughly searched by a large team.
Don't turn it into a Brexit thread.Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff