Yuri Bezmenov - Western Destabilisation - early 80s
Discussion
Yuri Bezmenov defected from the USSR, landing in Canada, over 30 years ago.
He did a number of interviews and lectures regarding social subversion and the long term destabilisation of the Western World.
This is a short(ish) clip of a longer interview - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX3EZCVj2XA&t=
It specifies the US but that's due to the interview being for an American market - it rings true for Europe as well.
He even uses the phrase 'Social Justice' in a process that had been going on many years before the interview took place.
I cannot understand why this is an interview that relatively few have watched - I guess it fits into the Russia Tin Foil Hat territory, and I'm sure the usual suspects will mock me for posting it, but when applied more to the Socialist/Left/SJW aspect, it rings dangerously true. Whether or not there is still State intervention, they definitely started something that I think we're living now.
I've posted it before in response to long term social degradation only to have others say they aren't interested in watching it, it's all bunkum etc... ironically proving the points of the interview.
Be interesting to see what people think when the video has been watched and look at the current state of politics.
Here's the full lecture should you be interested - scary AF https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gnpCqsXE8g
He did a number of interviews and lectures regarding social subversion and the long term destabilisation of the Western World.
This is a short(ish) clip of a longer interview - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX3EZCVj2XA&t=
It specifies the US but that's due to the interview being for an American market - it rings true for Europe as well.
He even uses the phrase 'Social Justice' in a process that had been going on many years before the interview took place.
I cannot understand why this is an interview that relatively few have watched - I guess it fits into the Russia Tin Foil Hat territory, and I'm sure the usual suspects will mock me for posting it, but when applied more to the Socialist/Left/SJW aspect, it rings dangerously true. Whether or not there is still State intervention, they definitely started something that I think we're living now.
I've posted it before in response to long term social degradation only to have others say they aren't interested in watching it, it's all bunkum etc... ironically proving the points of the interview.
Be interesting to see what people think when the video has been watched and look at the current state of politics.
Here's the full lecture should you be interested - scary AF https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gnpCqsXE8g
Interesting, I’ll grant you that but looking round the world at the moment re. Marxist/Leninist vs Democratic capitalists, I think the latter have the upper hand! The social justice comment was interesting though and maybe we’re on the cusp of something; if, God forbid Corbyn gets in next week, it might be us that are the first domino to fall. I for one will welcome our Marxist overlords
It's interesting, but from 1984 and predicting communism overwhelming the US any minute now. This was the height of the cold war of course, which ultimately went the way it did around 1989 - effectively proving him wrong - about his era at least.
Around 8:00 minutes in he predicts the danger of promising lots and it not mattering whether it is delivered - which does strike true with the success of Trump.
His view that KRB is 85% overt is interesting, and could be a useful insight into how perhaps more recent events may have been targeted by Russia.
His answer is education - which indeed would have mitigated against both trump and brexit.
Around 8:00 minutes in he predicts the danger of promising lots and it not mattering whether it is delivered - which does strike true with the success of Trump.
His view that KRB is 85% overt is interesting, and could be a useful insight into how perhaps more recent events may have been targeted by Russia.
His answer is education - which indeed would have mitigated against both trump and brexit.
It would be good business and good propaganda to tack yourself on to something that was happening already.
What's happening now feels like a natural evolution of societies that have grown more indulged and more self obsessed since WW2. If comfort and safety is guaranteed then you start to turns inwards for your conflict and adversity.
All the same no doubt seeds have been sown here and there. And America has done the same and worse.
What's happening now feels like a natural evolution of societies that have grown more indulged and more self obsessed since WW2. If comfort and safety is guaranteed then you start to turns inwards for your conflict and adversity.
All the same no doubt seeds have been sown here and there. And America has done the same and worse.
I think that what I've seen in it.
It's almost as if the state plan went tits up in 89 due to the wall coming down, but the seeds had been sown in the preceding generations and the ball had started rolling.
Then again, we have the Shadow Cabinet in the street parading under the hammer and sickle...
It's almost as if the state plan went tits up in 89 due to the wall coming down, but the seeds had been sown in the preceding generations and the ball had started rolling.
Then again, we have the Shadow Cabinet in the street parading under the hammer and sickle...
Edited by Mothersruin on Saturday 7th December 11:22
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geo...
Military operations play relatively little role. The textbook advocates a sophisticated program of subversion, destabilization, and disinformation spearheaded by the Russian special services. The operations should be assisted by a tough, hard-headed utilization of Russia's gas, oil, and natural resources to bully and pressure other countries.[9]
The book states that "the maximum task [of the future] is the 'Finlandization' of all of Europe".[9]
In Europe:
Germany should be offered the de facto political dominance over most Protestant and Catholic states located within Central and Eastern Europe. Kaliningrad oblast could be given back to Germany. The book uses the term "Moscow–Berlin axis".[9]
France should be encouraged to form a "Franco-German bloc" with Germany. Both countries have a "firm anti-Atlanticist tradition".[9]
The United Kingdom should be cut off from Europe.[9]
Ukraine should be annexed by Russia because "Ukraine as a state has no geopolitical meaning, no particular cultural import or universal significance, no geographic uniqueness, no ethnic exclusiveness, its certain territorial ambitions represents an enormous danger for all of Eurasia and, without resolving the Ukrainian problem, it is in general senseless to speak about continental politics". Ukraine should not be allowed to remain independent, unless it is cordon sanitaire, which would be inadmissible.[9]
Military operations play relatively little role. The textbook advocates a sophisticated program of subversion, destabilization, and disinformation spearheaded by the Russian special services. The operations should be assisted by a tough, hard-headed utilization of Russia's gas, oil, and natural resources to bully and pressure other countries.[9]
The book states that "the maximum task [of the future] is the 'Finlandization' of all of Europe".[9]
In Europe:
Germany should be offered the de facto political dominance over most Protestant and Catholic states located within Central and Eastern Europe. Kaliningrad oblast could be given back to Germany. The book uses the term "Moscow–Berlin axis".[9]
France should be encouraged to form a "Franco-German bloc" with Germany. Both countries have a "firm anti-Atlanticist tradition".[9]
The United Kingdom should be cut off from Europe.[9]
Ukraine should be annexed by Russia because "Ukraine as a state has no geopolitical meaning, no particular cultural import or universal significance, no geographic uniqueness, no ethnic exclusiveness, its certain territorial ambitions represents an enormous danger for all of Eurasia and, without resolving the Ukrainian problem, it is in general senseless to speak about continental politics". Ukraine should not be allowed to remain independent, unless it is cordon sanitaire, which would be inadmissible.[9]
I don't think that people are watching or have their eye on the ball. I did a long post in one of the climate threads where I laid out my view that the science of that doesn't matter any more. The fact is that China and Russia are weaponising climate change and funding the likes of XR to bring Western de-stabilisation. There were next to no replies to that, as you're seeing with your link to the defector.
It's worth looking into 'The Chinese Dream' which is essentially the economic dominance of the world.
It's worth looking into 'The Chinese Dream' which is essentially the economic dominance of the world.
jshell said:
I don't think that people are watching or have their eye on the ball. I did a long post in one of the climate threads where I laid out my view that the science of that doesn't matter any more. The fact is that China and Russia are weaponising climate change and funding the likes of XR to bring Western de-stabilisation. There were next to no replies to that, as you're seeing with your link to the defector.
It's worth looking into 'The Chinese Dream' which is essentially the economic dominance of the world.
I was (mildly) concerened about posting the thread as it's so easy to label it as a conspiracy, Russian bogeymen, jumping at shadows etc... but I've known about Bezmenov a long time (ex-military) and was pleased when the stuff popped up on YT and have posted it since then when I've thought it relevant.It's worth looking into 'The Chinese Dream' which is essentially the economic dominance of the world.
It seems that either 13 minutes (for the short clip) is too long for people to invest to a forum debate, they don't understand it (which I don't think is really the case), they don't like it so won't comment hoping it sinks, they can't argue against it or it get's missed.
I can't understand why this isn't blindingly obvious, and worrying, to far more people - I can only hope that peak 'whatever it is/outcome' happens while there is enough strength to resist it and it devours itself while calmer heads prevail.
grumbledoak said:
I've seen this before. It's not funny. It's pretty accurate too, I would say. The only place Marxism is alive and thriving now is in academia in the West...
And it's been fueled in part by Russia supporting brexit, in turn damaging the tories and risking a Corbyn government.People voting for brexit have to shoulder a lot of responsibility for the mess we find ourselves in and the huge risks we face.
Mothersruin said:
I was (mildly) concerened about posting the thread as it's so easy to label it as a conspiracy, Russian bogeymen, jumping at shadows etc... but I've known about Bezmenov a long time (ex-military) and was pleased when the stuff popped up on YT and have posted it since then when I've thought it relevant.
It seems that either 13 minutes (for the short clip) is too long for people to invest to a forum debate, they don't understand it (which I don't think is really the case), they don't like it so won't comment hoping it sinks, they can't argue against it or it get's missed.
I can't understand why this isn't blindingly obvious, and worrying, to far more people - I can only hope that peak 'whatever it is/outcome' happens while there is enough strength to resist it and it devours itself while calmer heads prevail.
Plenty of people are worried about Russian influence on the west, and their role & interest in pushing brexit to split the UK from the EU.It seems that either 13 minutes (for the short clip) is too long for people to invest to a forum debate, they don't understand it (which I don't think is really the case), they don't like it so won't comment hoping it sinks, they can't argue against it or it get's missed.
I can't understand why this isn't blindingly obvious, and worrying, to far more people - I can only hope that peak 'whatever it is/outcome' happens while there is enough strength to resist it and it devours itself while calmer heads prevail.
Many deny there has been any role for Russia and fail to recognise that pushing brexit is consistent with Russian objectives - a key reason to realise that Brexit is the biggest failure in UK foreign policy since Suez (and you argue about that).
Mothersruin said:
Brexit? That's one drum to bang I suppose, however, Brexit is a symptom, not a cause.
In terms of destabilisation of the west - it's an enabler from a Russian point of view which is why they have pushed it.It's a symptom of the west turning in on itself, too comfy in its safe peaceful bubble.
Education on its wider implications would have avoided it.
Interested if you don't think brexit is an enabler related to your video link.
Linked to in another thread.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geo...
"The United Kingdom should be cut off from Europe."
I've never read it as it's not an area I know much about.
Just as common sense it does strike me that people are being selective in what they want Russian involvement to involve and it's rather odd to take the view that their interference will be limited to things that benefit Corbyn but they wouldn't dare try to influence a referendum etc.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geo...
"The United Kingdom should be cut off from Europe."
I've never read it as it's not an area I know much about.
Just as common sense it does strike me that people are being selective in what they want Russian involvement to involve and it's rather odd to take the view that their interference will be limited to things that benefit Corbyn but they wouldn't dare try to influence a referendum etc.
DeepEnd said:
Mothersruin said:
Brexit? That's one drum to bang I suppose, however, Brexit is a symptom, not a cause.
In terms of destabilisation of the west - it's an enabler from a Russian point of view which is why they have pushed it.It's a symptom of the west turning in on itself, too comfy in its safe peaceful bubble.
Education on its wider implications would have avoided it.
Interested if you don't think brexit is an enabler related to your video link.
b
hstewie said:
hstewie said: Linked to in another thread.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geo...
"The United Kingdom should be cut off from Europe."
I've never read it as it's not an area I know much about.
Just as common sense it does strike me that people are being selective in what they want Russian involvement to involve and it's rather odd to take the view that their interference will be limited to things that benefit Corbyn but they wouldn't dare try to influence a referendum etc.
You're looking at recent tactics. I've posted up the strategy.https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geo...
"The United Kingdom should be cut off from Europe."
I've never read it as it's not an area I know much about.
Just as common sense it does strike me that people are being selective in what they want Russian involvement to involve and it's rather odd to take the view that their interference will be limited to things that benefit Corbyn but they wouldn't dare try to influence a referendum etc.
And I agree with you.
Mothersruin said:
Oh, no doubt they'd be all over it, it's perfect. Education on the wider implications of European Socialist and Liberal Federal policies would have not created the environment for Brexit in the first place.
Is that education or Russia backed misinformation about the EU?An education in not falling for anti-EU propaganda would have avoided the environment for brexit.
DeepEnd said:
Mothersruin said:
Oh, no doubt they'd be all over it, it's perfect. Education on the wider implications of European Socialist and Liberal Federal policies would have not created the environment for Brexit in the first place.
Is that education or Russia backed misinformation about the EU?An education in not falling for anti-EU propaganda would have avoided the environment for brexit.
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