Yuri Bezmenov - Western Destabilisation - early 80s
Discussion
This link shows exactly the lengths that China, and I'm sure others, will go to in order to control and hack into Western systems. It's truly frightening how it happened and indeed how it was found out: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2018-10-04...
Mothersruin said:
jshell said:
I don't think that people are watching or have their eye on the ball. I did a long post in one of the climate threads where I laid out my view that the science of that doesn't matter any more. The fact is that China and Russia are weaponising climate change and funding the likes of XR to bring Western de-stabilisation. There were next to no replies to that, as you're seeing with your link to the defector.
It's worth looking into 'The Chinese Dream' which is essentially the economic dominance of the world.
I was (mildly) concerened about posting the thread as it's so easy to label it as a conspiracy, Russian bogeymen, jumping at shadows etc... but I've known about Bezmenov a long time (ex-military) and was pleased when the stuff popped up on YT and have posted it since then when I've thought it relevant.It's worth looking into 'The Chinese Dream' which is essentially the economic dominance of the world.
It seems that either 13 minutes (for the short clip) is too long for people to invest to a forum debate, they don't understand it (which I don't think is really the case), they don't like it so won't comment hoping it sinks, they can't argue against it or it get's missed.
I can't understand why this isn't blindingly obvious, and worrying, to far more people - I can only hope that peak 'whatever it is/outcome' happens while there is enough strength to resist it and it devours itself while calmer heads prevail.
It's a dilema too, though. If they do know, then what can they personally do about it? The answer is most like nothing, so why worry about it?
I'm a total anti-conspiracy theory nut, as in I need things to be believable before can entertain them. My issue on weaponising of Climate Change has been building for years, but the Soros financed Greta movement and Extinction Rebellion were the final proof, if needed.
On your post, i must admit to being one of those people who will simply no tlook at YouTube vidoes as proof of anything due to the volumes of excremental thinking on there!!
Mothersruin said:
I think that what I've seen in it.
It's almost as if the state plan went tits up in 89 due to the wall coming down, but the seeds had been sown in the preceding generations and the ball had started rolling.
Then again, we have the Shadow Cabinet in the street parading under the hammer and sickle...
Ever read anything by Anatoly Golytsin? He published a couple of books (Again ex- Soviet defector) and he states that the fall of communism was a bit of a ruse.... It's almost as if the state plan went tits up in 89 due to the wall coming down, but the seeds had been sown in the preceding generations and the ball had started rolling.
Then again, we have the Shadow Cabinet in the street parading under the hammer and sickle...
Edited by Mothersruin on Saturday 7th December 11:22
AW111 said:
jshell said:
AW111 said:
The conspiracy thread is ------>
Off you go then, there are people here trying to have a grown-up conversation. If you're out of your depth... 
AW111 said:
I'm all for grown-up discussions, but blaming every societal change you disagree with on the Russians isn't that.
jshell said:
No-one is blaming everything on the Russians. <snip>
Don't you read this thread?Pesty said:
They filled schools universities and the media with commies churning out limp wristed mealy mouthed NPCs who vote for polices that destroy social cohesion,family values, destroy the economy and who think we shouldn’t give draconian sentences to terrorists.
They won the Cold War, but they are playing the long game
They’ve created whole generations of people who hate their own kind and the media constantly push it and most soak it up.
Pesty's "I hate modern society and it's all Russia's fault" post is a minor classic of it's kind, but hardly grown-up thinking.They won the Cold War, but they are playing the long game
They’ve created whole generations of people who hate their own kind and the media constantly push it and most soak it up.
AW111 said:
AW111 said:
I'm all for grown-up discussions, but blaming every societal change you disagree with on the Russians isn't that.
jshell said:
No-one is blaming everything on the Russians. <snip>
Don't you read this thread?Pesty said:
They filled schools universities and the media with commies churning out limp wristed mealy mouthed NPCs who vote for polices that destroy social cohesion,family values, destroy the economy and who think we shouldn’t give draconian sentences to terrorists.
They won the Cold War, but they are playing the long game
They’ve created whole generations of people who hate their own kind and the media constantly push it and most soak it up.
Pesty's "I hate modern society and it's all Russia's fault" post is a minor classic of it's kind, but hardly grown-up thinking.They won the Cold War, but they are playing the long game
They’ve created whole generations of people who hate their own kind and the media constantly push it and most soak it up.
jshell said:
AW111 said:
AW111 said:
I'm all for grown-up discussions, but blaming every societal change you disagree with on the Russians isn't that.
jshell said:
No-one is blaming everything on the Russians. <snip>
Don't you read this thread?Pesty said:
They filled schools universities and the media with commies churning out limp wristed mealy mouthed NPCs who vote for polices that destroy social cohesion,family values, destroy the economy and who think we shouldn’t give draconian sentences to terrorists.
They won the Cold War, but they are playing the long game
They’ve created whole generations of people who hate their own kind and the media constantly push it and most soak it up.
Pesty's "I hate modern society and it's all Russia's fault" post is a minor classic of it's kind, but hardly grown-up thinking.They won the Cold War, but they are playing the long game
They’ve created whole generations of people who hate their own kind and the media constantly push it and most soak it up.
Mothersruin said:
Yuri Bezmenov defected from the USSR, landing in Canada, over 30 years ago.
He did a number of interviews and lectures regarding social subversion and the long term destabilisation of the Western World.
This is a short(ish) clip of a longer interview - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX3EZCVj2XA&t=
It specifies the US but that's due to the interview being for an American market - it rings true for Europe as well.
He even uses the phrase 'Social Justice' in a process that had been going on many years before the interview took place.
I cannot understand why this is an interview that relatively few have watched - I guess it fits into the Russia Tin Foil Hat territory, and I'm sure the usual suspects will mock me for posting it, but when applied more to the Socialist/Left/SJW aspect, it rings dangerously true. Whether or not there is still State intervention, they definitely started something that I think we're living now.
I've posted it before in response to long term social degradation only to have others say they aren't interested in watching it, it's all bunkum etc... ironically proving the points of the interview.
Be interesting to see what people think when the video has been watched and look at the current state of politics.
Here's the full lecture should you be interested - scary AF https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gnpCqsXE8g
I've worked with quite a few Russians. Without exception they have been absolutely certain in their opinions and operate on a spectrum that is binary. Neither of those things make them right though. He did a number of interviews and lectures regarding social subversion and the long term destabilisation of the Western World.
This is a short(ish) clip of a longer interview - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX3EZCVj2XA&t=
It specifies the US but that's due to the interview being for an American market - it rings true for Europe as well.
He even uses the phrase 'Social Justice' in a process that had been going on many years before the interview took place.
I cannot understand why this is an interview that relatively few have watched - I guess it fits into the Russia Tin Foil Hat territory, and I'm sure the usual suspects will mock me for posting it, but when applied more to the Socialist/Left/SJW aspect, it rings dangerously true. Whether or not there is still State intervention, they definitely started something that I think we're living now.
I've posted it before in response to long term social degradation only to have others say they aren't interested in watching it, it's all bunkum etc... ironically proving the points of the interview.
Be interesting to see what people think when the video has been watched and look at the current state of politics.
Here's the full lecture should you be interested - scary AF https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gnpCqsXE8g
Bezmenov is talking in 1984 about a 4 stage process: demoralisation (a 20 year project), destabilsation (2-5 years), crisis (6 months) and normalisation (long term consequence and proxy for the imposition of Marxist-Leninism over a nation). As he tells it. by the mid 1980s demoralisation in the US was complete. On to phase 2: destablisation.
35 years on, one can see that history hasn't treated his certainty and binary views kindly.
Yet there is nonetheless a seed of truth in what he says. One might speculate that demoralisation has been abandoned as a tactic, and the long term strategy of normalisation of the west has also been abandoned (and with it, its immediate precursor, crisis). However, the second phase, destabilisation, has become a permanent feature of Russia's foreign policy, and has assumed the role of the end, rather that the means to an end.
Destabilisation in this context means just that: a perpetual state of instability. Whatever the status quo is, upset it. What is interesting about this thread is seeing individuals frame that strategy within the confines of their personal world view. Eg: destabilisation is the promotion of SJW and left wing teaching in schools and universities. Or it is the promotion of climate change. Or it is Brexit. Or is it the rise of the extreme right in politics.
Those are or may be individual acts of destabilisation. But a well thought out strategy to destabilise (and one thing that can be said about Russians is their ability to think long term and war game is very high) will implement all of these factors. Sequentially or concurrently. Because the essence of destabilisation is to remove the status of stability, by whatever means available.
IMO Russia has long since given up on the idea of coverting the world to Marxist-Leninism. It's not even an idealogy that's pursued in Russia with great enthusiasm any more. Russia has long since realised that it is a economically underpowered on the global stage. There are two ways to bring parity of power: increase your own, or diminish the opposition. It's chosen the second option out of necessity.
TL;DR: Russian tin foil hat conspiracy theories are well founded; it's just that they have modernised their approach over the last 20-30 years.
jshell said:
'People' don't really want to be burdened with the existence of very high level plots to control or destabilise, in my honest opinion. They just want to be left alone to have a beer, go to work, play with their gadgets, etc.
IMHO the average chap on the Clapham omnibus thinks the threat receded after the wall toppled. No more Soviet, peace dividend, economy continues to grow (on average) and all is well in the world (unless you like glaciers).It could be that the agents of destabilisation are simply a function of the development of free, liberal societies. Perhaps it will swing back towards a more ‘grounded’ centre ground in a decade or two? After Corbyn’s first term, possibly.
The Don of Croy said:
jshell said:
'People' don't really want to be burdened with the existence of very high level plots to control or destabilise, in my honest opinion. They just want to be left alone to have a beer, go to work, play with their gadgets, etc.
IMHO the average chap on the Clapham omnibus thinks the threat receded after the wall toppled. No more Soviet, peace dividend, economy continues to grow (on average) and all is well in the world (unless you like glaciers).It could be that the agents of destabilisation are simply a function of the development of free, liberal societies. Perhaps it will swing back towards a more ‘grounded’ centre ground in a decade or two? After Corbyn’s first term, possibly.
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