Coronavirus - the killer flu that will wipe us out? (Vol. 7)
Discussion
hotchy said:
s2art said:
hotchy said:
All this talk of a vaccine, any news on results so far? Anything promising? Anything looking likely to go to mass market? We dont even need a vaccine per say, a new pill that fights off the virus will do. Pop down to savers and buy it along with our 29p paracetamol.
Ask a stupid question and you expect any sensible answers? BTW google is your friend.s2art said:
hotchy said:
s2art said:
hotchy said:
All this talk of a vaccine, any news on results so far? Anything promising? Anything looking likely to go to mass market? We dont even need a vaccine per say, a new pill that fights off the virus will do. Pop down to savers and buy it along with our 29p paracetamol.
Ask a stupid question and you expect any sensible answers? BTW google is your friend.hotchy said:
Better close forums down then yes? Better not try and have a conversation eh. Nob
There are many posters / usernames on PH when you ask a question they say use google or give a link you click on it and it magic ups Google. As you say if you do that then close down all forums - also highlights a nasty streak in some individuals possible
Welshbeef said:
hotchy said:
Better close forums down then yes? Better not try and have a conversation eh. Nob
There are many posters / usernames on PH when you ask a question they say use google or give a link you click on it and it magic ups Google. As you say if you do that then close down all forums - also highlights a nasty streak in some individuals possible
s2art said:
Seriously what are you supposed to do when somebody asks a question like that. Just answer yes there is news? Or slavishly type in God knows how many reams of info that exists? The forum is for debate, hopefully backed up by citations when making assertions, not a news station.
I think it’s different things for different people and certainly not as narrow as you paint it. JagLover said:
Yes we seem to well involved as an independent country with the push to develop a vaccine
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-53061288
Stories like this just serve as catnip to bitter Remainers.
There are 200 vaccines currently being developed and I'm not sure all will be successful even if any at all. We have bet on the race with a long https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-53061288
Stories like this just serve as catnip to bitter Remainers.
It should be about politics. From the start there should have been cross party collaboration as a pandemic shouldn't be about politics it should be about the health of the nation.
Politics have so far meant we weren't involved in the EU ventilator scheme, now this drug scheme, ppe scheme etc
It just seems a massive coincidence that we are one of the worst hit country in Europe with all these 'political' decisions, are they really for the best of the country as a whole.
The Spruce Goose said:
There are 200 vaccines currently being developed and I'm not sure all will be successful even if any at all. We have bet on the race with a long
It should be about politics. From the start there should have been cross party collaboration as a pandemic shouldn't be about politics it should be about the health of the nation.
Politics have so far meant we weren't involved in the EU ventilator scheme, now this drug scheme, ppe scheme etc
It just seems a massive coincidence that we are one of the worst hit country in Europe with all these 'political' decisions, are they really for the best of the country as a whole.
As we are not measuring total level infected by country we cannot know if our death rate (which per 100,000 is similar to Italy Spain and marginally ahead of France) is actually way ahead of the pack or not. We locked down much later that means far more % of the population have had it that a country which locked down early. To the point that they might have simply delayed deaths which cannot be avoided. It should be about politics. From the start there should have been cross party collaboration as a pandemic shouldn't be about politics it should be about the health of the nation.
Politics have so far meant we weren't involved in the EU ventilator scheme, now this drug scheme, ppe scheme etc
It just seems a massive coincidence that we are one of the worst hit country in Europe with all these 'political' decisions, are they really for the best of the country as a whole.
Then again maybe not.
Bashing and wasting oxygen on this is bizarre to the extreme. Oddly so many people want to put our country down - shame on you I’d wager many here who do so wouldn’t dare actually get up and out and work for the public sector front line to make the difference they believe can be made. Lots of armchair PHD people which hindsight and comparing apples with pears and trusting data from countries when it’s been stated as fact there are big differences in the way countries are recording data (but SG for one will pedal a narrative say no more)
The Spruce Goose said:
There are 200 vaccines currently being developed and I'm not sure all will be successful even if any at all. We have bet on the race with a long
It should be about politics. From the start there should have been cross party collaboration as a pandemic shouldn't be about politics it should be about the health of the nation.
Politics have so far meant we weren't involved in the EU ventilator scheme, now this drug scheme, ppe scheme etc
It just seems a massive coincidence that we are one of the worst hit country in Europe with all these 'political' decisions, are they really for the best of the country as a whole.
Did we run out of ventilator capacity? It should be about politics. From the start there should have been cross party collaboration as a pandemic shouldn't be about politics it should be about the health of the nation.
Politics have so far meant we weren't involved in the EU ventilator scheme, now this drug scheme, ppe scheme etc
It just seems a massive coincidence that we are one of the worst hit country in Europe with all these 'political' decisions, are they really for the best of the country as a whole.
The government even cancelled orders when they realised putting everyone on one wasn't the way to treat the virus.
The EU PPE scheme supplied faulty mask, and looking at the numbers and what was claimed the NHS was using daily, a tiny amount that wouldn't have made much one divided between 27 countries. Unless the NHS numbers were exagerrated?
I'd say we've as much of a prospect of any country of successfully developing a vaccine, and the government are already working on supply.production.
https://www.fiercepharma.com/vaccines/sanofi-glaxo...
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/may/17/go...
And when you consider that not everyone will need a vaccine initially, just the most vulnerable, we won't need 66M straight away.
Slagathore said:
Did we run out of ventilator capacity?
The government even cancelled orders when they realised putting everyone on one wasn't the way to treat the virus.
The EU PPE scheme supplied faulty mask, and looking at the numbers and what was claimed the NHS was using daily, a tiny amount that wouldn't have made much one divided between 27 countries. Unless the NHS numbers were exagerrated?
I'd say we've as much of a prospect of any country of successfully developing a vaccine, and the government are already working on supply.production.
https://www.fiercepharma.com/vaccines/sanofi-glaxo...
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/may/17/go...
And when you consider that not everyone will need a vaccine initially, just the most vulnerable, we won't need 66M straight away.
Last I saw was an estimate of 30 million jabs by end October. Of course it isnt a proven vaccine yet, but the signs are promising.The government even cancelled orders when they realised putting everyone on one wasn't the way to treat the virus.
The EU PPE scheme supplied faulty mask, and looking at the numbers and what was claimed the NHS was using daily, a tiny amount that wouldn't have made much one divided between 27 countries. Unless the NHS numbers were exagerrated?
I'd say we've as much of a prospect of any country of successfully developing a vaccine, and the government are already working on supply.production.
https://www.fiercepharma.com/vaccines/sanofi-glaxo...
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/may/17/go...
And when you consider that not everyone will need a vaccine initially, just the most vulnerable, we won't need 66M straight away.
Slagathore said:
s2art said:
Last I saw was an estimate of 30 million jabs by end October. Of course it isnt a proven vaccine yet, but the signs are promising.
I think they've pre-empted one of the ones being trialed as working and have started production already on that?Muncher said:
Welshbeef said:
To jump the vaccine queue how much would any username here be prepared to pay? Assuming it was 100% guaranteed to work.
Given my risk profile, probably next to nothing if I am honest. I’m more worried about the effect to the economy this is having than the potential effect on my health of contracting the infection.
As such, I’d rather a vaccine shot meant for me went to someone hiding behind their sofa.
Welshbeef said:
Astro Zenica UK Oxford “vaccine”.
Fingers crossed it works
Fingers crossed it works
s2art said:
Slagathore said:
s2art said:
Last I saw was an estimate of 30 million jabs by end October. Of course it isnt a proven vaccine yet, but the signs are promising.
I think they've pre-empted one of the ones being trialed as working and have started production already on that?If anything, they're going to have an excess if they all prove successful and they've committed to buying then. So I look forward to some then complaining they bought too much
MX5Biologist said:
Ventilator Challenge UK has now stood down, and its members reverting to their normal operations.
The initial government order was 30,000 additional ventilators, based on usage rates in China and Italy. This was reduced to 18,000 and then 14,000. Ventilator Challenge delivered a remarkable 13,400 machines, hitting 400 per day at one point. The government likely made up the difference through normal channels. My understanding is that from late January, the UK started buying up additional ventilator supplies globally, on the quiet; this is essentially identifying any existing stock of types approved in the UK.
Most people don't understand there are basically two types of ventilator. There is the ICU ventilator; the complex, tubes down throat machine. And then there is the portable or transport ventilator usually used, as the name implies, during transport of patients, but which is also useful in a hospital setting. There was a need for additional machines, but the judgement was what was the split in machines.
With COVID-19, what has emerged is there are significant clinical differences from ARDS. With ARDS, a patient's lung loses elasticity, and mechanical ventilation is a necessity. But its always been known that mechanical ventilation can create complications. With COVID-19, the lungs remain elastic, and the infection has more in common with a vascular disease rather than a respiratory disease. Patients' lungs become clogged with debris. Modified CPAPs devices were originally devised as something to bridge the gap in ventilator shortages, but have been shown to have clinical efficacy.
The reduced need for ventilators is a combination of both improved knowledge of the virus, but also an evolving standard of care. I don't think anyone should be pilloried for being cautious at the start.
Thanks, I knew a lot had been cancelled, but wasn't aware of the numbers/details. I wasn't criticising the government for cancelling them, I was going to make the point you did. I was just pointing out to The Spruce Goose that all his points were poor arguements.The initial government order was 30,000 additional ventilators, based on usage rates in China and Italy. This was reduced to 18,000 and then 14,000. Ventilator Challenge delivered a remarkable 13,400 machines, hitting 400 per day at one point. The government likely made up the difference through normal channels. My understanding is that from late January, the UK started buying up additional ventilator supplies globally, on the quiet; this is essentially identifying any existing stock of types approved in the UK.
Most people don't understand there are basically two types of ventilator. There is the ICU ventilator; the complex, tubes down throat machine. And then there is the portable or transport ventilator usually used, as the name implies, during transport of patients, but which is also useful in a hospital setting. There was a need for additional machines, but the judgement was what was the split in machines.
With COVID-19, what has emerged is there are significant clinical differences from ARDS. With ARDS, a patient's lung loses elasticity, and mechanical ventilation is a necessity. But its always been known that mechanical ventilation can create complications. With COVID-19, the lungs remain elastic, and the infection has more in common with a vascular disease rather than a respiratory disease. Patients' lungs become clogged with debris. Modified CPAPs devices were originally devised as something to bridge the gap in ventilator shortages, but have been shown to have clinical efficacy.
The reduced need for ventilators is a combination of both improved knowledge of the virus, but also an evolving standard of care. I don't think anyone should be pilloried for being cautious at the start.
Agree 100%. I've said pretty much the same on other threads on here about how treatment has changed as it's become better understood what the virus was doing to the body and that ventilators weren't the solution.
I do remember reading that the CPAP machines were working well when people were put on them early. Looks like Mercedes developed and delivered some?
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