Marcus Rashford - School Meals Vouchers Campaign

[Murph7355]

R Mutt said:

Would they not actually be cold rather than starving? Because you'd spend money on food before heat and electric

I suppose modern 60" TVs are A+ energy rated..

It's still not a great choice to have to make in 2020 and I do agree with everyone noting that it's not the kids' fault.

But as you're intimating I really am not convinced any/very many people are in this situation in the UK due to anything other than personal choices of one or other or both parents. Tackling that is quite evidently very difficult, and I fear the answers will be most unpalatable to those getting most upset at the situation.

[R Mutt]

Murph7355 said:

R Mutt said:

Would they not actually be cold rather than starving? Because you'd spend money on food before heat and electric

I suppose modern 60" TVs are A+ energy rated..

It's still not a great choice to have to make in 2020 and I do agree with everyone noting that it's not the kids' fault.

But as you're intimating I really am not convinced any/very many people are in this situation in the UK due to anything other than personal choices of one or other or both parents. Tackling that is quite evidently very difficult, and I fear the answers will be most unpalatable to those getting most upset at the situation.

There's a local crackhead who requests you take her to the shop to top up her electric card when you say you don't have cash.

I'm not sure where food comes in the hierarchy (very low it would seem) but having her utilities paid for simply frees up money for drugs.

Any parent in that situation would have their kids taken away.

Why should 2020 mean you don't have to put the kids first because the government will? An improved standard of living shouldn't mean you are entitled to luxuries. It's the same people who have said food vouchers are oppressive that are now backing this, after effectively endorsing spending welfare on non essentials, and they wonder why others might question additional handouts.

[Pan Pan Pan]

stitched said:

Countdown said:

mjb1 said:

For anyone who works at all, it's highly unlikely they're kids will qualify for free school meals - the threshold is £7400 earned income per year, which is about 16 hours a week at min wage. For some reason, state benefits aren't taken into consideration, so it's really only families who live entirely on state benefits who qualify. And they could be better off financially than a single parent who's trying to work (around school times). The state benefits should be sufficient for parent's to feed their kids at lunch time during school holidays, at worst we're talking about a loaf of bread and something to put on it - pennies.

What is a rather worrying though, is that 17.3% of children in England qualify - that's a lot of kids with parents who aren't working...

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/54693906

Apologies if O/T - are either of the following OK?

1. PH Directors pays himself > £7,400 which enables his kids to get FSM (£50k divs)
2. PH Director pays himself > £7,400 which enables him to retain Child benefit (£50k divs)
3. PH PAYE puts £Xk into a SIPP so that his earnings are below £50k so retains Child benefit.
4. PH Director asks how to transfer his mum’s house into his name so the Council cant use it for care fees

The convoluted point I’m making - there’s a lot of criticism of people on benefits and yet lots of us, even those on very high salaries, will game the system in order to maximise how much WE can claim off the State. People in glas houses etc......

No I don't think that is OK, doubt it is legal either.
I don't do that, nor do I claim anything off the state, quite the reverse.
I do however structure my finances so that my tax expenditure is as efficient as possible.
Structuring your tax is as much part of efficiency as googling to get the best price on a product, massaging the figures to claim money off the state is IMHO fraud.

The problem is that whilst some are genuinely on their beam ends, and need assistance from the government (which was what it was introduced for in the first place), there are some who work the system, and who have contributed little, or nothing into the system, but have taken large sums `out' of it`
The country would not be able to survive, where the numbers taking more out than they contribute in terms of the work they do, grow to large levels.
It does not matter if they genuinely need assistance or they are the p*ss takers. If they are taking money out that they have not actually earned, then they are destroying the UK.
The problem is those that do this, don't give a monkeys about where the money comes from, as long as they keep getting it, and they don't have to do any work for it.

[R Mutt]

Another story from our local Facebook

"Yesterday only a few of these lunches were collected. Please, please, please come and collect a lunch today - they are great - each lunch bag contains a sandwich, a packet of crisps, a yogurt, a piece of fruit and a drink. Please pass this message on to anyone that is in need this half term and please don't feel embarrassed to collect one - everyone is suffering in some way or another during this pandemic and there is no judgment. There is a lot of love in our community please take some"

[anonymous-user]

R Mutt said:

Another story from our local Facebook

"Yesterday only a few of these lunches were collected. Please, please, please come and collect a lunch today - they are great - each lunch bag contains a sandwich, a packet of crisps, a yogurt, a piece of fruit and a drink. Please pass this message on to anyone that is in need this half term and please don't feel embarrassed to collect one - everyone is suffering in some way or another during this pandemic and there is no judgment. There is a lot of love in our community please take some"

A yoghurt? FRUIT?!

And how do I get there to pick up this half-arsed effort that's not even hot? Expect me to walk in the rain? I'M A PARENT. I'VE GOT KIDS. I want a taxi. I know what I'm entitled to.

[petemurphy]

R Mutt said:

Another story from our local Facebook

"Yesterday only a few of these lunches were collected. Please, please, please come and collect a lunch today - they are great - each lunch bag contains a sandwich, a packet of crisps, a yogurt, a piece of fruit and a drink. Please pass this message on to anyone that is in need this half term and please don't feel embarrassed to collect one - everyone is suffering in some way or another during this pandemic and there is no judgment. There is a lot of love in our community please take some"

can I have one

[Murph7355]

R Mutt said:

Another story from our local Facebook

"Yesterday only a few of these lunches were collected. Please, please, please come and collect a lunch today - they are great - each lunch bag contains a sandwich, a packet of crisps, a yogurt, a piece of fruit and a drink. Please pass this message on to anyone that is in need this half term and please don't feel embarrassed to collect one - everyone is suffering in some way or another during this pandemic and there is no judgment. There is a lot of love in our community please take some"

Screenshot required

But why would anybody be surprised by this? It was always going to happen.

Either their advertising was rubbish (on this topic I very much doubt that) or maybe there aren't enough people hungry enough to want some fruit...

Edited to add...the issue with non-targeted assistance writ large. But hey, they're helping and not mean

[R Mutt]

Murph7355 said:

R Mutt said:

Another story from our local Facebook

"Yesterday only a few of these lunches were collected. Please, please, please come and collect a lunch today - they are great - each lunch bag contains a sandwich, a packet of crisps, a yogurt, a piece of fruit and a drink. Please pass this message on to anyone that is in need this half term and please don't feel embarrassed to collect one - everyone is suffering in some way or another during this pandemic and there is no judgment. There is a lot of love in our community please take some"

Screenshot required

But why would anybody be surprised by this? It was always going to happen.

Either their advertising was rubbish (on this topic I very much doubt that) or maybe there aren't enough people hungry enough to want some fruit...

Edited to add...the issue with non-targeted assistance writ large. But hey, they're helping and not mean

I didn't record the conversation with my friend who works for a charity but he was telling me he saw the same level of uptake of similar lunch bags.

[PRTVR]

Record number of children with obesity , higher numbers in poorer households.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-44926893

[Chrissyboy555]

You can’t say there isn’t poverty in uk just because kids ain’t scavenging on rubbish tips!! If you think it’s ok for kids to go to school hungary and poorly fed then you need to have a look at yourself . And assuming parents can’t afford to feed their kids cos they smoke and have Sky is just embarrassing. There is food banks where I live now and that’s as close to middle England as you can get so somethings obviously wrong.

[bitchstewie]

Chrissyboy555 said:

You can’t say there isn’t poverty in uk just because kids ain’t scavenging on rubbish tips!!

Oh I think they'll give it a good try.

[Murph7355]

Chrissyboy555 said:

...If you think it’s ok for kids to go to school hungary and poorly fed then you need to have a look at yourself . ...

If you read what has been posted across the many pages on this topic you should realise that nobody does think it's OK.

The thrust of all the debate is why this is occurring (and has been for decades) and what the solution should be.

[R Mutt]

Chrissyboy555 said:

You can’t say there isn’t poverty in uk just because kids ain’t scavenging on rubbish tips!! If you think it’s ok for kids to go to school hungary and poorly fed then you need to have a look at yourself . And assuming parents can’t afford to feed their kids cos they smoke and have Sky is just embarrassing. There is food banks where I live now and that’s as close to middle England as you can get so somethings obviously wrong.

Or collecting free packed lunches god forbid.

The fact is many still spend the money on luxuries. Not necessarily at the expense of food but if that budget is then covered by vouchers and they have nothing left in the holidays, that is wrong and that is why everyone including yourself still want the vouchers, not because their children are starving.

If you think people should able to spend money on non essentials while others starve (although I can't see how equal benefit payments would cause such disparity) then do something to feed them while the others are smoking and drinking your tax.

I think you'll find that the people in the most need are those not covered by the system where there is a temporary change in circumstances for example, and that is where food banks etc. come in. Although if nurses use them as is alleged surely you'd rather that fed 1 nurse than provided 1 child with a mobile phone contract.

I don't want kids to starve but neither do I think the parents should have more to spend on food than someone working 50 hours a week and have the sort of luxuries only otherwise afforded by an above average income. I have 1 pay TV service at £6 a month. No one should have Sky or smoke, or have an iPhone contract if they don't work. They should have all their benefits on top of housing and utilities in the form of food and clothing vouchers. Can't be that demeaning if you'll all crying out for them to get these vouchers.

Edited by R Mutt on Thursday 29th October 16:01

[768]

Murph7355 said:

Chrissyboy555 said:

...If you think it’s ok for kids to go to school hungary and poorly fed then you need to have a look at yourself . ...

If you read what has been posted across the many pages on this topic you should realise that nobody does think it's OK.

Yep. Hungary is quite a few steps too far.

[anonymous-user]

Chrissyboy555 said:

You can’t say there isn’t poverty in uk just because kids ain’t scavenging on rubbish tips!!

No one did.

Chrissyboy555 said:

If you think it’s ok for kids to go to school hungary and poorly fed then you need to have a look at yourself .

I'd put good money on everyone here thinking that it is certainly not ok.

Chrissyboy555 said:

There is food banks where I live...

Is there? Open a free off license, that'll be popular too. Does that mean people can't afford booze?

[R Mutt]

fblm said:

Is there? Open a free off license, that'll be popular too. Does that mean people can't afford booze?

If you talk about people taking the mick wherever they can, this will probably go round in circles about tax loopholes and the net loss or gain to the economy where Amazon for worker's PAYE accounts for a large take etc.

Maybe even the mechanism of handouts evens itself out with VAT but the mentality of wanting it offers nothing.

Edited by R Mutt on Thursday 29th October 16:25

[Chrissyboy555]

Oh I can’t be bothered just think before you speak and just cos you drive a flash car don’t mean ya know everything about people less fortunates lives . Don’t assume

[Pan Pan Pan]

Chrissyboy555 said:

You can’t say there isn’t poverty in uk just because kids ain’t scavenging on rubbish tips!! If you think it’s ok for kids to go to school hungary and poorly fed then you need to have a look at yourself . And assuming parents can’t afford to feed their kids cos they smoke and have Sky is just embarrassing. There is food banks where I live now and that’s as close to middle England as you can get so somethings obviously wrong.

If you want to find out what is wrong, the FIRST thing you need to investigate are the reasons behind why their OWN parents are not feeding their children properly.
Some may be valid, others will shock you.
Not that many months ago we were being avalanched by the media with panic stories about how the there is / was an obesity pandemic in UK children, What happened then? Was it the government who was stuffing them full of junk food? It was the parents who were destroying their children's health then by stuffing them with too much to eat, It is the parents who are FIRST inline now causing hardship for the children by sending them to school hungry.
Some people are so dumb they should not be allowed to have children, for the children's sake.
The government cannot legislate against rank stupidity.

[R Mutt]

Pan Pan Pan said:

Chrissyboy555 said:

You can’t say there isn’t poverty in uk just because kids ain’t scavenging on rubbish tips!! If you think it’s ok for kids to go to school hungary and poorly fed then you need to have a look at yourself . And assuming parents can’t afford to feed their kids cos they smoke and have Sky is just embarrassing. There is food banks where I live now and that’s as close to middle England as you can get so somethings obviously wrong.

If you want to find out what is wrong, the FIRST thing you need to investigate are the reasons behind why their OWN parents are not feeding their children properly.
Some may be valid, others will shock you.
Not that many months ago we were being avalanched by the media with panic stories about how the there is / was an obesity pandemic in UK children, What happened then? Was it the government who was stuffing them full of junk food? It was the parents who were destroying their children's health then by stuffing them with too much to eat, It is the parents who are FIRST inline now causing hardship for the children by sending them to school hungry.
Some people are so dumb they should not be allowed to have children, for the children's sake.
The government cannot legislate against rank stupidity.

We hear often that 'the kids shouldn't suffer as a result'. which seems to acknowledge the neglect so I'm not sure why people ignore that. And they do because the only thing these campaigners are pushing for is this sticky plaster in the form FSM. No actual intervention in the form of educations. No, we're so libertarian, we let people harm their children because the government "in one of the richest countries" as we're often reminded should pick up the pieces.

[Pan Pan Pan]

R Mutt said:

Pan Pan Pan said:

Chrissyboy555 said:

You can’t say there isn’t poverty in uk just because kids ain’t scavenging on rubbish tips!! If you think it’s ok for kids to go to school hungary and poorly fed then you need to have a look at yourself . And assuming parents can’t afford to feed their kids cos they smoke and have Sky is just embarrassing. There is food banks where I live now and that’s as close to middle England as you can get so somethings obviously wrong.

If you want to find out what is wrong, the FIRST thing you need to investigate are the reasons behind why their OWN parents are not feeding their children properly.
Some may be valid, others will shock you.
Not that many months ago we were being avalanched by the media with panic stories about how the there is / was an obesity pandemic in UK children, What happened then? Was it the government who was stuffing them full of junk food? It was the parents who were destroying their children's health then by stuffing them with too much to eat, It is the parents who are FIRST inline now causing hardship for the children by sending them to school hungry.
Some people are so dumb they should not be allowed to have children, for the children's sake.
The government cannot legislate against rank stupidity.

We hear often that 'the kids shouldn't suffer as a result'. which seems to acknowledge the neglect so I'm not sure why people ignore that. And they do because the only thing these campaigners are pushing for is this sticky plaster in the form FSM. No actual intervention in the form of educations. No, we're so libertarian, we let people harm their children because the government "in one of the richest countries" as we're often reminded should pick up the pieces.

As noted earlier some of those who are bleating about the governments stance on meals provided by the government (or more accurately by those who contribute positively towards the UKs finances rather than those who only take from it) seem to think that only the government should be dealing with this issue. Why?
If the fact is, that some children are going hungry, the FIRST thing to do, is get them fed, and it does not matter where the cash to do this comes from as long as it comes. The fact that Marcus Rashford and some local businesses are stepping forward is only to be commended.
Do people think that a hungry child gives any thought to where or how the cash to provide the meal they are tucking into comes from?., I suspect they don't even think about why it was that their own parents did not provided it for them.
As long as the children are getting at least some of the food they need, where the cash to pay for it came from is irrelevant, But it seems that some here don't believe people like Mr Rashford or local businesses should be doing what they are doing, and just want to use the children's hunger as a political tool / opportunity to have a dig at the government, which is really sad.

Edited by Pan Pan Pan on Monday 2nd November 10:04