The EU v UK vaccine tussle
Discussion
andymadmak said:
Thank you
The woman is at best delusional, and at worst a bare faced liar. Does anyone in Europe (other than Deltona) actually believe her guff? Clearly some must be, given the unused doses going to waste
I've come to the conclusion the woman is just thick as mince.The woman is at best delusional, and at worst a bare faced liar. Does anyone in Europe (other than Deltona) actually believe her guff? Clearly some must be, given the unused doses going to waste
She has now boxed them in to following the limited trials method of use, rather than following the science found in the real world.
Its absolutely clear as day now that extending the time between doses is the correct approach and will be the model of choice that provides the best outcome for a nation. I wouldn't be surprised if USA change to the UK system as the more transmissible strains become more prevalent.
DeltonaS said:
O dear, sorry my posted facts and opinions do not fit your narrative. A narrative that has a very clear direction.
So the UK's lead is a "nice to have" but in the grand scheme of things the real finish line is the end of the summer; august 2021.
Your alternative facts are not facts. It's like reading the posts of the most delusional Trump supporter.So the UK's lead is a "nice to have" but in the grand scheme of things the real finish line is the end of the summer; august 2021.
We are in a race against time, its not about nice, its about being effective in our application of science in order to save lives and reduce economic impact to a minimum.
Every moment of delay means more people die and more businesses fail.
jsf said:
I've come to the conclusion the woman is just thick as mince.
She has now boxed them in to following the limited trials method of use, rather than following the science found in the real world.
Its absolutely clear as day now that extending the time between doses is the correct approach and will be the model of choice that provides the best outcome for a nation. I wouldn't be surprised if USA change to the UK system as the more transmissible strains become more prevalent.
I can't recall which was the Spanish newspaper but it's questioned whether Spain is doing the right thing focusing on the second dose and not banging out the first dose to as many as possible.She has now boxed them in to following the limited trials method of use, rather than following the science found in the real world.
Its absolutely clear as day now that extending the time between doses is the correct approach and will be the model of choice that provides the best outcome for a nation. I wouldn't be surprised if USA change to the UK system as the more transmissible strains become more prevalent.
Spain politically is a basket-case at the best of times.
fblm said:
“ mounting evidence of the AstraZeneca vaccine being rejected and left unused in fridges following weeks of bad publicity, including Emmanuel Macron’s unsubstantiated claim that it is “quasi-ineffective” among older groups.”
Great work by Macron and Von de Leyen.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/24/astr...
This guy has done some good vignettes, and captures this situation well also: https://twitter.com/BBCRosAtkins/status/1364600353...Great work by Macron and Von de Leyen.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/24/astr...
andy_s said:
This guy has done some good vignettes, and captures this situation well also: https://twitter.com/BBCRosAtkins/status/1364600353...
Thank you, interesting piece. You know when both the BBC and Guardian are critical of the EU it must be really bad!fblm said:
jsf said:
Does Deltona ever get anything correct?
Not that I’ve ever seen. His posts on economics are even more ignorant. Presumably there’s a subject he knows something about. I’m guessing something like football.I have a suspicion he's either a Dutch politician, or perhaps works for the EC or similar?
fblm said:
andy_s said:
This guy has done some good vignettes, and captures this situation well also: https://twitter.com/BBCRosAtkins/status/1364600353...
Thank you, interesting piece. You know when both the BBC and Guardian are critical of the EU it must be really bad!i can't believe there is such a huge gulf in opinion when it comes to vaccination between people in the uk and the eu, is this a general thing regarding all vaccines (looks to be so in france) or just the new covid vaccines ?
b
hstewie said:
Sounds like a seventh of the total, but might not be. Might be more like a third.hstewie said:Germany aren't doing the 12-week delay thing.
It's entirely possible their dosage target at this point would be 50% in arms and 50% on shelves, waiting to be the 2nd doses in 3 weeks.
It's still a s
tshow, obviously, but maybe not quite as much as you'd think.leef44 said:
Blib said:
Iirc, yesterday the EU gave Germany et al 10 days to explain themselves and to do something about it.
Germany is the main contributor to the EU pot. The German banks also fund one or two EU countries. Surely they can do what they want.andymadmak said:
Jezza30 said:
andymadmak said:
Blib said:
Ursula Von der Leyen doubles down.
EU is 'catching up' with UK on coronavirus vaccinations, says Ursula von der Leyen
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/02/24/eu-cat...
Paywalled. Summary?EU is 'catching up' with UK on coronavirus vaccinations, says Ursula von der Leyen
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/02/24/eu-cat...
The president of the European Commission responded to criticism that the EU vaccination roll out was too slow by pointing out that 130 countries in the world had had no jabs at all.
Mrs von der Leyen said more than twice the number of Italians than Britons had had both jabs and the EU as a whole had given out more first doses.
“We're catching up. Britain has administered 17 million first doses. There are 27 million in the EU. In Italy, with a population similar to that of Great Britain, twice as many citizens received full vaccination protection with the second dose as in the UK,” she said.
She told the Augsburger Allgemeine newspaper, “I think it's risky to simply postpone the second vaccination. We should adhere to the specifications that the manufacturers determined in their extensive clinical tests.”
27.47 doses per 100 people have been administered in the UK, compared to just 6.12 across the EU. 5.7 jabs per 100 people have been given in France and 6.1 in Germany.
Mrs von der Leyen said she could understand the “frustration” felt by many EU citizens as the bloc lagged behind Britain, the US, Israel and Turkey in vaccinations.
The former German defence minister added, “Nobody has been vaccinated in 130 countries around the world. Europe is among the first, albeit with fewer doses in the start-up phase than expected.”
Britain used faster emergency authorisation procedures to approve vaccines than the EU. The UK negotiated to secure the doses alone after rejecting an offer from Brussels last year to join the EU joint procurement scheme.
Britain’s vaccination strategy was far more successful than the EU’s failed and slow response to the coronavirus pandemic, Hungary’s prime minister said.
“We’ve sought to do something together that we could have managed more successfully on an individual basis – take a look at the examples of Britain or Serbia,” Viktor Orbán said.
EU leaders will call for the continuation of tight coronavirus restrictions, including bans on non-essential travel such as holidays on Thursday, four days after Boris Johnson set out his roadmap out of lockdown.
They will call for the acceleration of “authorisation, production and distribution of vaccines, as well as vaccination, in the weeks and months to come”, according to leaked draft conclusions for their Thursday video summit.
Mrs von der Leyen said that she “would take the AstraZeneca vaccine without a second thought,” after reports in Germany and elsewhere in Europe that people were reluctant to have the jab.
The AstraZeneca vaccine was falsely described as ineffectual by Emmanuel Macron and inaccurate news reports in Germany claimed it was ineffective during the row with the EU over supply shortfalls.
AstraZeneca told the European Commission it will deliver less than half the vaccines it promised for the second quarter, an EU official told Reuters on Tuesday.
The British-Swedish pharmaceutical company said it would strive to fulfil its contracted 180m vaccines.
The woman is at best delusional, and at worst a bare faced liar. Does anyone in Europe (other than Deltona) actually believe her guff? Clearly some must be, given the unused doses going to waste
The EU can't stop talking about us!
CraigyMc said:
Sounds like a seventh of the total, but might not be. Might be more like a third.
Germany aren't doing the 12-week delay thing.
It's entirely possible their dosage target at this point would be 50% in arms and 50% on shelves, waiting to be the 2nd doses in 3 weeks.
It's still a stshow, obviously, but maybe not quite as much as you'd think.
I'd certainly hope there's more to it than a headline and short article would suggest.Germany aren't doing the 12-week delay thing.
It's entirely possible their dosage target at this point would be 50% in arms and 50% on shelves, waiting to be the 2nd doses in 3 weeks.
It's still a s
tshow, obviously, but maybe not quite as much as you'd think.amgmcqueen said:
Why is UVDL and the EU so obsessed with what the UK is doing...?
The EU can't stop talking about us!
UK doing well in such an easy to see way is a nightmare scenario for das project.The EU can't stop talking about us!
You would think they wouldn't want to talk about the UK at all on this, but they cant help trying to spin bulls
t. It's weird behavior.amgmcqueen said:
Why is UVDL and the EU so obsessed with what the UK is doing...?
The EU can't stop talking about us!
Why are EU politicians openly criticising what the UK is doing - I haven't seen any quote of UK politicians directly criticisingThe EU can't stop talking about us!
the mess they have made..
(but I stand to be corrected if someone posts a reputable link)
Interesting read:
https://www.politico.eu/article/the-key-difference...
Finland is following the UK's approach to the time gap between doses:
When are the first and second doses of the vaccines given? Why has the interval between doses of the coronavirus vaccine been extended?
All coronavirus vaccines in use in Finland require two doses - i.e., two vaccinations.
THL recommends 12 weeks as the interval between vaccinations for all coronavirus vaccines in the current situation in which the risk of a more extensive epidemic is significant, and in which consignments of the vaccine coming to the country are small.
The protection offered by the vaccine to those who are vaccinated is better with a longer interval. This is because the body’s immune response matures and can produce both antibodies that latch on to the virus more efficiently, and sufficient amounts of memory T cells (defender cells). Persons vaccinated with the help of memory T cells are better protected against serious diseases the next time that they confront the virus.
On the other hand, the longer interval between doses means that the vaccine can be offered quickly to more people than before even if supplies of the vaccines are limited. This makes it possible to prevent as many serious cases and deaths from the disease as possible in a menacing epidemic situation. The number of vaccine doses coming to Finland is expected to increase as the spring progresses.
https://thl.fi/en/web/infectious-diseases-and-vacc...
https://www.politico.eu/article/the-key-difference...
Finland is following the UK's approach to the time gap between doses:
When are the first and second doses of the vaccines given? Why has the interval between doses of the coronavirus vaccine been extended?
All coronavirus vaccines in use in Finland require two doses - i.e., two vaccinations.
THL recommends 12 weeks as the interval between vaccinations for all coronavirus vaccines in the current situation in which the risk of a more extensive epidemic is significant, and in which consignments of the vaccine coming to the country are small.
The protection offered by the vaccine to those who are vaccinated is better with a longer interval. This is because the body’s immune response matures and can produce both antibodies that latch on to the virus more efficiently, and sufficient amounts of memory T cells (defender cells). Persons vaccinated with the help of memory T cells are better protected against serious diseases the next time that they confront the virus.
On the other hand, the longer interval between doses means that the vaccine can be offered quickly to more people than before even if supplies of the vaccines are limited. This makes it possible to prevent as many serious cases and deaths from the disease as possible in a menacing epidemic situation. The number of vaccine doses coming to Finland is expected to increase as the spring progresses.
https://thl.fi/en/web/infectious-diseases-and-vacc...
bhstewie said:
hstewie said:jesusbuiltmycar said:
Why are EU politicians openly criticising what the UK is doing - I haven't seen any quote of UK politicians directly criticising
the mess they have made..
(but I stand to be corrected if someone posts a reputable link)
Nope at least not that I'm aware of.the mess they have made..
(but I stand to be corrected if someone posts a reputable link)
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