The EU v UK vaccine tussle
Discussion
loafer123 said:
NerveAgent said:
I’m I reading it right that the EU are trying to spin that AZ have to deliver “50 million doses” by September but they have actually already supplied 40 million of those as its based on numbers from the start of the court case?
According to AZ, they have already delivered 70m of the 80m required.VdL needs to be careful, she's spinning so hard she might implode!
M.
Mortarboard said:
loafer123 said:
NerveAgent said:
I’m I reading it right that the EU are trying to spin that AZ have to deliver “50 million doses” by September but they have actually already supplied 40 million of those as its based on numbers from the start of the court case?
According to AZ, they have already delivered 70m of the 80m required.VdL needs to be careful, she's spinning so hard she might implode!
M.
Jazzy Jag said:
So if AZ sell doses else where for 12 Euro/dose and pay the EU the 10 Euro/dose fine.
They can p
s off the EU and make 2 Euro/dose for the pleasure.
Now that is a Win-Win
There is no likelihood of any fine. That's only for doses below 80m before Sept which they will have achieved by end of June / first week July.They can p
s off the EU and make 2 Euro/dose for the pleasure.Now that is a Win-Win
So forget what AZ told them they will supply, just supply what the court has now determined it has to under the contract and then flog the remaining 3 months production for 12 Euro/dose.
That's a real win.
Better still tell the EU it's 25 euros a dose for anything they want for themselves in excess of the 80m that they are now contractually obliged to supply.
madbadger said:
As I understand it NL are binning masks from next Tuesday.
I was in a call with a colleague this week who commented on the fact that the NL are catching up with the UK on vaccine rollout (not the first time he has said that) despite the fact that he is early 60s and is still a few weeks away from jab 2 and all of us in England and Wales in our 40s are now double jabbed.
Managed to do my first event abroad since this all kicked off this last weekend in France, we were due to go to Holland next, that's just been cancelled due to Covid restrictions.I was in a call with a colleague this week who commented on the fact that the NL are catching up with the UK on vaccine rollout (not the first time he has said that) despite the fact that he is early 60s and is still a few weeks away from jab 2 and all of us in England and Wales in our 40s are now double jabbed.
https://www.lemonde.fr/planete/article/2021/06/18/...
The view from France.
The punitive damages that the EU were seeking would have destroyed AZ. The Brussels judge has effectively ordered AZ to deliver what it can.
I don't think either AZ, or the EU have come out of this smelling of roses. But IMO the EU have shown themselves to be incompetent at making purchases of this sort. A simple due-diligence process would have demonstrated that AZ were unlikely to be able to fulfil the contract from within resources over which they had full control.
Moral, if it looks too good to be true, it probably is.
In terms of vaccinating the world, AZ is still really the only game in town.
The view from France.
The punitive damages that the EU were seeking would have destroyed AZ. The Brussels judge has effectively ordered AZ to deliver what it can.
I don't think either AZ, or the EU have come out of this smelling of roses. But IMO the EU have shown themselves to be incompetent at making purchases of this sort. A simple due-diligence process would have demonstrated that AZ were unlikely to be able to fulfil the contract from within resources over which they had full control.
Moral, if it looks too good to be true, it probably is.
In terms of vaccinating the world, AZ is still really the only game in town.
rdjohn said:
https://www.lemonde.fr/planete/article/2021/06/18/...
The view from France.
The punitive damages that the EU were seeking would have destroyed AZ. The Brussels judge has effectively ordered AZ to deliver what it can.
I don't think either AZ, or the EU have come out of this smelling of roses. But IMO the EU have shown themselves to be incompetent at making purchases of this sort. A simple due-diligence process would have demonstrated that AZ were unlikely to be able to fulfil the contract from within resources over which they had full control.
Moral, if it looks too good to be true, it probably is.
In terms of vaccinating the world, AZ is still really the only game in town.
Hopefully SII gets up to speed soon. The numbers of vaccines needed for just India and China are mind-boggling.The view from France.
The punitive damages that the EU were seeking would have destroyed AZ. The Brussels judge has effectively ordered AZ to deliver what it can.
I don't think either AZ, or the EU have come out of this smelling of roses. But IMO the EU have shown themselves to be incompetent at making purchases of this sort. A simple due-diligence process would have demonstrated that AZ were unlikely to be able to fulfil the contract from within resources over which they had full control.
Moral, if it looks too good to be true, it probably is.
In terms of vaccinating the world, AZ is still really the only game in town.
Pfizer should be up to speed by the end of the year in the Grangecastle plant, so at least there will be drug sustance for that vaccine available (can fill finish locally as needed)
M.
NRS said:
You'd have to imagine after this it's likely the end of cost-price medicines done for the benefit of humanity in the future.
Profit = Taxes!!!It's why the National Lottery was not appointed to Richard Branson ( who offered to do it for non profit ).
The EU do not want not for profit.
633Squadron said:
If I were AZ. Deliver the bare contractual/legal minimum to the EU.
Then f**k them. Do not take any additional orders from them.
Deliver everything you can to the rest of the world.
We have 7 Billion people to protect.
VDL, EU etc - are just toxic/ incompetent/ deluded.
If someone had taken me to court, and the court had found in my favour, then yes, I’d switch to the bare minimum thereafter.Then f**k them. Do not take any additional orders from them.
Deliver everything you can to the rest of the world.
We have 7 Billion people to protect.
VDL, EU etc - are just toxic/ incompetent/ deluded.
If they gave a public apology and promised not to be such dicks again then I’d probably try to work with them again.
Northernboy said:
633Squadron said:
If I were AZ. Deliver the bare contractual/legal minimum to the EU.
Then f**k them. Do not take any additional orders from them.
Deliver everything you can to the rest of the world.
We have 7 Billion people to protect.
VDL, EU etc - are just toxic/ incompetent/ deluded.
If someone had taken me to court, and the court had found in my favour, then yes, I’d switch to the bare minimum thereafter.Then f**k them. Do not take any additional orders from them.
Deliver everything you can to the rest of the world.
We have 7 Billion people to protect.
VDL, EU etc - are just toxic/ incompetent/ deluded.
If they gave a public apology and promised not to be such dicks again then I’d probably try to work with them again.
While others who have failed to deliver do not get a murmur of complaint.
This was all about Brexit punishment.
F**k them.
Vaccinate the rest of the world.
633Squadron said:
Bear in mind - they have very publicly trashed your reputation.
While others who have failed to deliver do not get a murmur of complaint.
This was all about Brexit punishment.
F**k them.
Vaccinate the rest of the world.
Yes, the selective outrage and legal action showed what it was really about.While others who have failed to deliver do not get a murmur of complaint.
This was all about Brexit punishment.
F**k them.
Vaccinate the rest of the world.
On the other hand, we do live next door to them, so have to bear that in mind.
Northernboy said:
633Squadron said:
Bear in mind - they have very publicly trashed your reputation.
While others who have failed to deliver do not get a murmur of complaint.
This was all about Brexit punishment.
F**k them.
Vaccinate the rest of the world.
Yes, the selective outrage and legal action showed what it was really about.While others who have failed to deliver do not get a murmur of complaint.
This was all about Brexit punishment.
F**k them.
Vaccinate the rest of the world.
On the other hand, we do live next door to them, so have to bear that in mind.
And the EU have decided on and off to use/ not to use the AZ vaccines they have.
MOTORVATOR said:
EddieSteadyGo said:
MadCaptainJack said:
The EU has a different take: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail...
Would be good to read the full judgement but it seems like AZN did win. The EU said:
Today, the Court of First Instance of Brussels decided to grant interim measures in the case brought against AstraZeneca by the European Commission and the 27 EU Member States.
The court orders AstraZeneca to urgently deliver 50 million doses of vaccine by 27 September 2021 - according to a binding schedule:
The judge's decision on the requested interim measures is based on the fact, that AstraZeneca committed a serious breach (‘faute lourde') of its contractual obligations with the EU.
The court also holds that AstraZeneca should have deployed all its efforts to deliver the vaccines within the agreed timetable including the British production sites explicitly mentioned in the contract – especially given the big delays in deliveries to the EU.
The court orders AstraZeneca to urgently deliver 50 million doses of vaccine by 27 September 2021 - according to a binding schedule:
- 15 million doses by 26 July, at 9 a.m.,
- 20 million doses by 23 August,
- 15 million doses at 27 September.
The judge's decision on the requested interim measures is based on the fact, that AstraZeneca committed a serious breach (‘faute lourde') of its contractual obligations with the EU.
The court also holds that AstraZeneca should have deployed all its efforts to deliver the vaccines within the agreed timetable including the British production sites explicitly mentioned in the contract – especially given the big delays in deliveries to the EU.
The court have said AZN need to deliver to a revised schedule of doses. And said if they don't there is a penalty of 10 euros per dose not delivered. Which is what the EU are quoting and how they are claiming "victory". However, the new schedule is far below what the EU were demanding. And far later as well. And the new schedule seems to be below the level which AZN would have achieved anyway.
Plus there is no penalty being applied for the current late deliveries. So they haven't got any more doses, nor have they been promised any more doses than they were going to get anyway, nor received compensation for the delay. So its hard to say objectively how the EU have won.
I imagine that then leaves them free to use their two EU plants to supply wherever they fancy?
Frankly they went out of their way to destroy only AZ as opposed to any other company which didn't deliver everything, in some cases nothing, because of? Well, what was the underlying motivation exactly?
Edited by FiF on Saturday 19th June 09:35
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