Who is going to continue to wear a mask after 21st June?

[gazapc]

Iminquarantine said:

Uggers said:

Iminquarantine said:

The evidence is that masks help, probably by a lot. This includes studies where the effect of incorrect use by some people is accounted for in the study method. Recent summary of research here https://www.pnas.org/content/118/4/e2014564118

Show me a graph and point to me in big fk off arrows where the introduction of masks had an effect on the RoC or the volume of infections rates in any country.

Thanks.

blade runner said:

And then the water evaporates, leaving the virus particle still on your mask, free to be launched into the air the next time you breath out.

I posted a link showing a summary of several studies, in peer reviewed literature, showing that masks work to reduce the spread of Covid-19. Where is your information which contradicts this? Are you just getting the vibe from somewhere that masks don't work?

I'm not going to pretend to be able to refute everypoint in that paper however it does state the following as the main point in the summary.

"The available evidence suggests that near-universal adoption of nonmedical masks when out in public, in combination with complementary public
health measures, could successfully reduce Re to below 1, thereby reducing community spread if such measures are sustained."

As early as October last year 92% of Americans were wearing a mask when leaving home. Did that help to keep R below one....? Errr...no


Is there any correlation between those states that mandated masks and deaths...err no

Did cases sky rocket when mask mandates were dropped for example in Florida...err no.

As the other poster said, post an example with a big arrow where it had a noticable impact on cases/trends. There are so many examples showing it making no or little apparent difference.

If the evidence is so strong that they do have a signfiicant impact, how do we explain real world data like this?

[Harrison Bergeron]

The Spruce Goose said:

i honestly don't see the issue here, the benefits massively outweigh the negatives. If people don't want to wear them, well in gave no issue with that, there are always people that don't like being told what to do.

Well except in all those countries that mandated masks.

oyster said:

I will not take care of my own health, regardless of consequences on others. What matters most is me.

Am I responding correctly to this thread?

Yes

[blade runner]

omniflow said:

blade runner said:

omniflow said:

Step 4 - No sooner than June 21

- All limits on social contact, such as rule of six, to be removed for both indoor and outdoor settings
- Rest of society to reopen, such as nightclubs and other businesses which did not reopen following first lockdown
- Social distancing will remain in place until Step 4, with a review taking place ahead of that date looking at how the advice can be removed

How that's supposed to work with Nightclubs opening June 21st if social distancing remains in place until September? It's been a good few years since I've been in a nightclub I'll admit, but from what I recall they are not exactly known for being places where people keep their distance from one another - whether that be at the bar or on the dance floor.

I think you mis-read Step 4 to read Sept 4 :-)

Doh... My fault for skim reading too quickly!

[anonymous-user]

Surely the fact that we went back into lockdown despite the masks, visors and plastic dividers in shops proves they don't work anyway? If it did work then we wouldn't be in lockdown?

Plus, I am not convinced a non sanitised, non medical grade mask that has been stuck in your pocket and reused 20 times is going to work anyway?

Personally I only wear them in shops when I have no choice, I cannot wait to see the back of them.

[stitched]

ReallyReallyGood said:

Mr Whippy said:

Everyone I see fiddles with their mask and then touches everything else, so I'd say masks are a net zero benefit.

For every droplet they catch from a lurgy person, another person is spreading the lurgy around because of them.


And no I don't believe we should learn how to use them better, because people won't, just like people don't follow lockdown etc.

Finally, give it another year and discarded masks will be the bane of littering and water course pollution.


You have an immune system for a reason. If you're that ill, stay at home if you want to avoid spreading it. Or take the new annual 'cold' vaccine, which I'm sure will appear now we have effective coronavirus vaccines.

Have you told Sage of your findings?

Perhaps you could point out to us the SAGE member who would be qualified to comment?

[CallThatMusic]

Me. I like masks.
Batman and Robin wear them.

[craigjm]

We will get much more of an indication how this will pan out when they start allowing large indoor events again. Will be interesting to see what the criteria will be to attend a music concert for instance.

[stitched]

Iminquarantine said:

Uggers said:

Iminquarantine said:

The evidence is that masks help, probably by a lot. This includes studies where the effect of incorrect use by some people is accounted for in the study method. Recent summary of research here https://www.pnas.org/content/118/4/e2014564118

Show me a graph and point to me in big fk off arrows where the introduction of masks had an effect on the RoC or the volume of infections rates in any country.

Thanks.

blade runner said:

And then the water evaporates, leaving the virus particle still on your mask, free to be launched into the air the next time you breath out.

I posted a link showing a summary of several studies, in peer reviewed literature, showing that masks work to reduce the spread of Covid-19. Where is your information which contradicts this? Are you just getting the vibe from somewhere that masks don't work?

I am curious, whom do you believe peer reviewed this study?
The article in question does not contain a single example where the wearing of masks is correlated against the non wearing of masks.
A quick skim read shows it to be pseudo scientific claptrap.
And no, the water droplets do not drop off the virus during their easy passage through a mask.

[rxe]

Isn’t the best graph the one that shows infection rates in US states vs. requirements to wear masks? You’d expect to see some correlation but there really is none at all.

Don’t get me wrong, proper, trained infection control works. Unfortunately, that’s not what we’ve been doing over the last few months. A quick review of my fellow bus passengers last night suggested that over 50% had their noses out...

[Eyersey1234]

As soon as they stop mandating them I stop wearing them.

[PeteinSQ]

Joey Deacon said:

Surely the fact that we went back into lockdown despite the masks, visors and plastic dividers in shops proves they don't work anyway? If it did work then we wouldn't be in lockdown?

Plus, I am not convinced a non sanitised, non medical grade mask that has been stuck in your pocket and reused 20 times is going to work anyway?

Personally I only wear them in shops when I have no choice, I cannot wait to see the back of them.

We can't say one way or the other with any real degree of certainty though. Whilst clearly we can say they don't stop the spread of the virus we don't know that they dont stop the spread at all. There could have been many more cases without masks etc.

I won't be wearing masks once all this is over BUT (and I still won't be doing it) there could be a case for wearing them in places like the tube. Not because of Covid but if it reduces the chance of getting things like a cold that is actually a bit of an advantage.

[deeps]

Masks likely do more harm than good. Speaking as a germophobe and prolific hand washer, I won't wear a mask.

I think in perfect clinically clean conditions, single use disposable masks may have a benefit, but in the real world people use masks again and again, pull the mask from their pocket to go shopping, touch door handles, money, goods etc, fiddle with mask, then back into dirty pocket. Next day, out it comes again. I really think it's likely to spread germs more so than help in any way.

Last year I watched people in restaurants put their mask on to leave their table and use the loo, touch door handles, tap handles etc, then sit down and take mask off and back into the pocket ready to take out again for when they walk out.

How they can't see what they are actually doing is remarkable, potentially wrapping germs around their face, but from my observations, it's very common. They simply wear a mask as they have been instructed with no further thoughts about it.

[nonsequitur]

CallThatMusic said:

Me. I like masks.
Batman and Robin wear them.

And Zorro, the Lone Ranger, Phantom of the Opera, Cat woman and the Incredibles. THEY know that wearing a mask is cool. (and Covid secure).

[oyster]

semisane said:

kiethton said:

Douglas Quaid said:

I don’t wear one now. I would like to believe they’ll be dropped in June but angry Karen will scream on Facebook about it so I think they’re here forever.

This - not worn one throughout the pandemic, agree that most will ditch them as soon as (legally) able including the angry Karen who will blindly believe whatever they're told....there will still be some weirdos that continue however

Many anxious / fearful people may continue to wear once no longer mandated, perhaps those too that cannot be vaccinated - I think they need understanding as opposed to being ridiculed.

When I think back to pre Covid times and all those threads decrying the feebleness of the snowflake generation for one reason or another, it amazes me now to see grown men on PH get into such a tortured state about a piece of light fitting fabric across their face for a few minutes each day.

I suggest these modern-day ‘snowflakes’ don’t take up scuba diving, mountaineering, DIY or careers as firemen, fighter pilots etc as they will quit.

[Jasandjules]

blade runner said:

Iminquarantine said:

A mask will stop these water droplets and therefore stop the virus which is attached to them

And then the water evaporates, leaving the virus particle still on your mask, free to be launched into the air the next time you breath out.

And each time they touch it to move and adjust it they spread the germs onto everything they touch, so all over the supermarkets etc..

[TheJimi]

deeps said:

Masks likely do more harm than good. Speaking as a germophobe and prolific hand washer, I won't wear a mask.

I think in perfect clinically clean conditions, single use disposable masks may have a benefit, but in the real world people use masks again and again, pull the mask from their pocket to go shopping, touch door handles, money, goods etc, fiddle with mask, then back into dirty pocket. Next day, out it comes again. I really think it's likely to spread germs more so than help in any way.

Last year I watched people in restaurants put their mask on to leave their table and use the loo, touch door handles, tap handles etc, then sit down and take mask off and back into the pocket ready to take out again for when they walk out.

How they can't see what they are actually doing is remarkable, potentially wrapping germs around their face, but from my observations, it's very common. They simply wear a mask as they have been instructed with no further thoughts about it.

Mental, isn't it?

[survivalist]

deeps said:

Masks likely do more harm than good. Speaking as a germophobe and prolific hand washer, I won't wear a mask.

I think in perfect clinically clean conditions, single use disposable masks may have a benefit, but in the real world people use masks again and again, pull the mask from their pocket to go shopping, touch door handles, money, goods etc, fiddle with mask, then back into dirty pocket. Next day, out it comes again. I really think it's likely to spread germs more so than help in any way.

Last year I watched people in restaurants put their mask on to leave their table and use the loo, touch door handles, tap handles etc, then sit down and take mask off and back into the pocket ready to take out again for when they walk out.

How they can't see what they are actually doing is remarkable, potentially wrapping germs around their face, but from my observations, it's very common. They simply wear a mask as they have been instructed with no further thoughts about it.

Most people aren’t germaphobes. As you say they are doing it to avoid an argument with shop staff and the authorities.

It’s bonkers that they are effectively being forced to do it.

The issue is that while you can enforce mask wearing, you can enforce proper use which is why it all seems pretty pointless to me.

It has meant that I’ve avoided spending money in shops since last July though, so Amazon gain what the bricks and mortar outlets lose.

[Derek Smith]

deeps said:

Masks likely do more harm than good. Speaking as a germophobe and prolific hand washer, I won't wear a mask.

I think in perfect clinically clean conditions, single use disposable masks may have a benefit, but in the real world people use masks again and again, pull the mask from their pocket to go shopping, touch door handles, money, goods etc, fiddle with mask, then back into dirty pocket. Next day, out it comes again. I really think it's likely to spread germs more so than help in any way.

Last year I watched people in restaurants put their mask on to leave their table and use the loo, touch door handles, tap handles etc, then sit down and take mask off and back into the pocket ready to take out again for when they walk out.

How they can't see what they are actually doing is remarkable, potentially wrapping germs around their face, but from my observations, it's very common. They simply wear a mask as they have been instructed with no further thoughts about it.

While your experiences and observations are valuable, I still think I'll follow what the scientists suggest.

There is no evidence to suggest, apart from anecdotes, that wearing masks does more harm than good.

[Brave Fart]

oyster said:

When I think back to pre Covid times and all those threads decrying the feebleness of the snowflake generation for one reason or another, it amazes me now to see grown men on PH get into such a tortured state about a piece of light fitting fabric across their face for a few minutes each day.

I suggest these modern-day ‘snowflakes’ don’t take up scuba diving, mountaineering, DIY or careers as firemen, fighter pilots etc. as they will quit.

Groan. Why do we always get this nonsense comment? It's not about the hardship of a face covering. It's about the government making it mandatory. It is quite simply wrong to make something compulsory with no proof that it has any benefit.
Which is why when they cease to be mandatory, most people won't wear them any more.
And anyway, I suggest that it's the weirdo loons wearing masks when out walking in the open air (or when driving on their own in their car - mad!). They're the snowflakes, I think you'll find.

[TheJimi]

Derek Smith said:

deeps said:

Masks likely do more harm than good. Speaking as a germophobe and prolific hand washer, I won't wear a mask.

I think in perfect clinically clean conditions, single use disposable masks may have a benefit, but in the real world people use masks again and again, pull the mask from their pocket to go shopping, touch door handles, money, goods etc, fiddle with mask, then back into dirty pocket. Next day, out it comes again. I really think it's likely to spread germs more so than help in any way.

Last year I watched people in restaurants put their mask on to leave their table and use the loo, touch door handles, tap handles etc, then sit down and take mask off and back into the pocket ready to take out again for when they walk out.

How they can't see what they are actually doing is remarkable, potentially wrapping germs around their face, but from my observations, it's very common. They simply wear a mask as they have been instructed with no further thoughts about it.

While your experiences and observations are valuable, I still think I'll follow what the scientists suggest.

There is no evidence to suggest, apart from anecdotes, that wearing masks does more harm than good.

You do realise that scientists have been on record saying that masks are a behaviour modifier?

Edited by TheJimi on Thursday 4th March 19:34