RE: Audi RS4 Avant (B7) | The Brave Pill

RE: Audi RS4 Avant (B7) | The Brave Pill

Saturday 21st May 2022

Audi RS4 Avant (B7) | The Brave Pill

Eight at the front and a four on the back


While the PH forums are great at raising awkward questions, they rarely come up with definitive answers. This week’s choice of Pill inspired in large part by TeaVR’s excellent post about the likely long-term fate of large-engined cars: “will they be much sought after, or will they be pretty much worthless?” And while this isn’t intended to be a unassailable reply, this attractively priced B7 generation RS4 certainly offers a bit of food for thought.

Because we’ve been here before. Pill featured a similar, if slightly leggier, RS4 wagon back in December 2020, that relatively brief sliver of time where the world had experienced the collective shock of Covid but we hadn’t seen the prices of used cars starting to climb like Rebekah Vardy’s legal fees. That RS4 was being offered for an entirely enticing £12,000 – leading to the big query at the top of the story if they would ever get cheaper. This week’s is £14,650, making it the least expensive in the classifieds, but suggesting that even with the Audi’s favoured diet of super unleaded heading for the £2/ litre barrier, interest is still increasing.

While Americans had been stuffing V8s into pretty much anything from the late ‘50s onwards, Europe took much longer to get with the programme of more is more. Many of our early V8s were actually imported Yank Tanks, frequently ones that were left here by US service personnel. Or, in the case of the Rover V8, an engine that had been directly nabbed from an American manufacturer. Europe’s native eight-bangers were almost universally reserved for bigger and grander offerings, cars like the Porsche 928 or brawnier versions of the Mercedes S-Class.

But the 21st century changed that. In 1998 the idea of a V8-powered BMW M5 seemed pretty radical, but the next generation moved to a V10, with the M3 getting a similar cylinder upgrade to a 4.0-litre V8. It was a similar story at Audi, where the V8 powered C5-generation RS6 was followed by a V10 successor, and so it became entirely obvious for the junior RS4 to get its own upgrade to a 4.2-litre V8. (Even the S4 got a less powerful version of the same base engine.) It was the done thing: other notable members of the compact-saloon-big-motor club included the Lexus IS-F, Mercedes C63 and – on the other side of the Atlantic – Cadillac CTS-V.

But while previous Audi RS models had combined performance with disinterested dynamics, the B7 RS4 was also an impressively sharp steer. Its predecessors had usually felt hard to the point of harshness, and had handling balances as front loaded as Lolo Ferrari driving a fork-lift. But the B7 had a level of throttle steerability that felt very un-Audi like, especially when – as in the case of most of the press cars – it was fitted with the clever torque-biasing Sport differential option. The first time I ever encountered power oversteer in an Audi was in a B7, and the fact this took place in a wet field only slightly diminished the novelty.

The new-found finesse didn’t distract from the RS4’s ability to deliver huge speed. The V8 wasn’t quite as vocal as those in the M3 or C63, but it sounded good when worked hard and was happy to be revved past 8,000rpm. Traction was brilliant –stickier than most sticks – and the RS4 gave huge confidence even in the sort of slippery conditions that had its rear-driven rivals slipping and sliding. Even the standard fit manual gearbox suited it, this being the time before Audi allowed autos to sully its RS models; the B7’s shift had a long throw, but the engine had enough mid-range to ensure you didn’t need to always be chasing the perfect gear.

Audi offered saloon and convertible versions of the RS4, but the Avant always felt like the bodystyle that made most sense, and was reflected in the way the wagon outsold the volumes of the other versions combined. In the days before the performance SUV the Avant’s combination of pace and practicality was almost unmatched. Yet another part of its appeal was its relative subtlety compared to blingy alternatives. Spotters would recognise the significance of the deep, well vented front bumper and widened arches, but most people would just see another Audi estate.

As the RS4 grew older, it picked up a reputation for a few pricey mechanical issues. The best-known is the tendency for the direct injection engine to suffer from carbon build up, this sometimes getting bad enough to require cylinder heads to be removed for cleaning. Active dampers are also prone to expensive borkage. The B7 tends to consume its consumables at a ravenous pace, too, especially when used hard, with its keenest appetite for pricey discs, pads and tyres. One of the comments on our last Pill was from a former owner who said they had spent more keeping their Audi shod and braked than their Porsche 911.

Our Pill’s MOT history bears testament to that with multiple advisories – and a few outright failures – for worn rubber and brakes. The most spectacular of these came in 2017 when it failed with all four tyres showing lumps “caused by separation or partial failure.” The check engine light has also made semi-frequent appearances, and its most recent pass in January still carried warnings for thin pads and discs all round and three tyres close to the legal limit. Getting all that fully sorted is going to add a significant chunk to the asking price.

The engine light may be down to an aftermarket Milltek exhaust system noted by the dealer selling the car, which should have added some snarl to the soundtrack. It is also sitting on Bilstein coilover suspension, which is another mark against originality but may well have sharpened the driving experience a bit further. Regardless of the mods it looks well priced for 2022, and gives a good indication of what the lower reaches of the B7 RS4 market looks like these days. And 123,000 miles is hardly a scary total for a car that dates from 2007.

What does the future hold? PH’s crystal ball is being used to support a wonky desk at the moment, so predictions are necessarily vague. To return to TeaVR’s question, it is hard to see our Pill being one of the those cars once in relatively high abundance that will end up as part of a cherished collection. The strong possibility of both rising ownership taxes and ever increasing petrol prices means it is likely to ultimately face a cost-based reckoning, one that will see it recycled into something much less interesting.

But that is no reason it can’t be enjoyed for a while longer. Get ‘em while they’re still hot.


See the original advert here

 

Author
Discussion

drpep

Original Poster:

1,758 posts

168 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
I remember one of these pulling up to the lights beside me some years ago when they were pretty new. The driver launched the thing when the lights turned green, and I had never at that point, seen a car take off with such ferocity and drama. What a fantastic noise. Definitely a soft spot for these, though it takes a braver soul than I to dabble now they're at this vintage.

Sure it'll make someone a very happy camper.

Chubbyross

4,545 posts

85 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
I have rather a warm fuzzy feeling about Pill’s choice this morning. The mods are tasteful, it doesn’t look as if it’s been tarred, feathered and dragged backwards through Halfords and the colour is right. The price is a trifle high but, hey ho, what isn’t these days. It probably works out the same price as a couple of Greggs sausage rolls for all I know. I’d take a punt on this.

lrdisco

1,448 posts

87 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
I’ve got the R8 with pretty much the same engine. Absolutely love the thing.
The engine is the star of the show.

PokiGTA

86 posts

190 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
In Australia, B7s are demanding more dollars than the B8 RS4. For a wagon you’re looking at $70-80k AUD for something with over 100-130k kms.

Wab1974uk

991 posts

27 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
Love the B7 RS4. My old man had a Saloon from new. Loved driving it.

They may not have been as powerful as Audi claimed, but it left my then Subaru Impreza STI PPP for dead.

The noise from that V8 was awesome, and for me the B7 had the best interior Audi has produced in an A4.

My only regret was not buying it off him when he traded it in for an R8. I didn't make the same mistake when he got rid of the R8.

Just a shame Audi never kept giving the option of a Saloon version in later RS4's.

Court_S

12,894 posts

177 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
I love these, partially because it was way first properly quick car that I got to drive and a family member gave me the keys to his saloon on Boxing Day. It sounded fantastic even stock; a little grey saloon making that racket seemed quite funny at the time.

Prices are pretty strong for these nowadays but they still look great (from a time when fast cars were muscular yet subtle) and the bucket seats are still fab. I love the small, very simple flat bottomed steering wheel too.

I dint think the article should be too harsh re the Bilsteins. Lots of these have had the DRC removed in favour of coil overs due to the cost and fragility of the stock system.

Oil coolers seem to be a bit of an issue and are pretty expensive to sort.

Cakes

45 posts

223 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
Fabulous car, I love mine.

One thing - there was no sport differential option on these - they were introduced with the B8.

I can't help but think the Avants will hold their value, and potentially increase sharply when they can be imported to the US - they were never sold there.

Edited by Cakes on Saturday 21st May 07:52

bakerstreet

4,762 posts

165 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
The price of these is only going to increase and I can't see why it wouldn't go any other way. However, I'm quite surprised by how cheap this one is. That's about the same as what the cheapest one was when I looked a few years ago.

Also worth noting that I think the PH classifieds often have cars that are more expensive than what they would be on Autotrader.

Even the lesser S4 V8 is slowly creeping up in value.

Not sure what is 'brave' about buying one of these.

Naturally aspirated so no complicated turbos and considerably less electronics than modern equivalents. At least you can add an aftermarket stereo too, which is something that's much harder than later cars.


phumy

5,674 posts

237 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
I bought a Cambridge Green Avant with 70k miles in January this year, a lovely car but not cheap to run, im sure the values on these will start to rise soon if they havent already. One sold for over 23k this week on Collecting Cars.

AC43

11,474 posts

208 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
lrdisco said:
I’ve got the R8 with pretty much the same engine. Absolutely love the thing.
The engine is the star of the show.
That engine is pretty special.

As is the car's ability to accelerate hard gound greasy bends.

Firebobby

527 posts

39 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
Hmm! I recall being in a friend's B7, in front was a 120d 1 series. From about 40mph cruising on a clear rd it took what I thought was quite an effort to stay on the beemers tail up to the legal limit. He'd shifted it on within a week of that episode, very disappointing!!

AC43

11,474 posts

208 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
Firebobby said:
Hmm! I recall being in a friend's B7, in front was a 120d 1 series. From about 40mph cruising on a clear rd it took what I thought was quite an effort to stay on the beemers tail up to the legal limit. He'd shifted it on within a week of that episode, very disappointing!!
Once you get past the fact that a diesel has plenty of torque you're left with a horrible noise and a nasty smell.

You couldn't pay me to sit behind a 4 pot diesel banger. The V8 in that RS4, however......



phumy

5,674 posts

237 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
Firebobby said:
Hmm! I recall being in a friend's B7, in front was a 120d 1 series. From about 40mph cruising on a clear rd it took what I thought was quite an effort to stay on the beemers tail up to the legal limit. He'd shifted it on within a week of that episode, very disappointing!!
He wasnt trying.

ws323f

56 posts

179 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
phumy said:
He wasnt trying.
The 120d?

AC43

11,474 posts

208 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
phumy said:
Firebobby said:
Hmm! I recall being in a friend's B7, in front was a 120d 1 series. From about 40mph cruising on a clear rd it took what I thought was quite an effort to stay on the beemers tail up to the legal limit. He'd shifted it on within a week of that episode, very disappointing!!
He wasnt trying.
I just looked up the 0-100's. The RS4 does it in 10s. The coal burner finally clanks over the line in 19s.

jason61c

5,978 posts

174 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
Firebobby said:
Hmm! I recall being in a friend's B7, in front was a 120d 1 series. From about 40mph cruising on a clear rd it took what I thought was quite an effort to stay on the beemers tail up to the legal limit. He'd shifted it on within a week of that episode, very disappointing!!
I think your mum needs to learn how to drive an N/A engined car properly.

BrotherMouzone

3,169 posts

174 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
phumy said:
I bought a Cambridge Green Avant with 70k miles in January this year, a lovely car but not cheap to run, im sure the values on these will start to rise soon if they havent already.
I remember that car being advertised! Great colour and very rare.

epom

11,489 posts

161 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
Oh that arse smile

TVR Pablo

79 posts

226 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
I've had mine for 10 years. Once you've done the coil-overs there isn't anything too scary, so that's a plus for this one.

The gearing doesn't help how fast it feels in a straight line. 3rd is tall and the action is at the top end, so you're mostly relying on mid-range which struggles against modern diesels.

The fun is all cross-country.


rickk

12 posts

118 months

Saturday 21st May 2022
quotequote all
Just me or does the front bumper look to be mismatched on colour and gappy on fit?

Which might be reflected in the price to be fair.