Tory peer Michelle Mone - Received £29m from PPE Medpro

[anonymous-user]

The outrage is the fact that it even happened, but also so blatantly. People with parliament connections negotiated contracts for supply, set up companies on the fly, didn't deliver what they said they would or what they did deliver was of no use.

You or I couldn't set up a PPE company and "win" a multi million pound contract but those with connections could. The fact they have all tried to hide it, suppress it and treat us like idiots fuels the outrage.

But yes let's await the results of the investigation....

[Pupp]

Murph7355 said:

I was thinking similar.

From the articles linked to, it 100% seems like she ran by the letter of the rules and not the spirit of them in terms of declarations. Assuming that is proven, it would be nice to see her stripped of her peerage etc.

Fraud will be an interesting one too if proven.

Has any investigative journalist done a proper deep dive on the PPE debacle? What sort of profit margins do these sort of companies usually make? What were the contractual terms regarding suitability of products? In calmer times, how much PPE gets ditched because of non-suitability and who picks up the tab? etc. etc. If there has genuinely been piss-taking, I'll polish up my pitchfork. But I'm more interested, initially, on the real details of what happened. What was the marginal dinging we suffered due to, on the face of it, dumb-arsed reactionary behaviour by those who are meant to lead us.

Someone mentioned about off-shore accounts too. It's another area where I'd be more than happy for stricter measures on them being implemented, but also suspect it would have unintended consequences. I would also expect companies involved to have paid taxes etc...govt needs to get smarter on how we tax companies and consumption to make it harder to shelter money off-shore.

Can be a bit of a marmite set-up but the Good Law Project have probably done as much as anyone to expose these procurement abuses to judicial and public scrutiny; for example:

https://goodlawproject.org/case/100m-contract/

The one linked to stalled due to a procedural failure around service, but is now due to be considered by the Supreme Court.

Picking up a previous post, outrage is entirely appropriate; these extreme lengths should not have to be gone to in order to address the serial and routinely nepotistic plundering of public funds these fkers have alighted on as their business model in times when the old, sick and vulnerable are literally being left to fend for themselves whilst essential services and infrastructure crumble.

[DeejRC]

Sigh.
It shouldn’t be happening in the first place? Well neither should bloody murder or GBH etc, guess what…EXACTLY!

Good grief, journalists are investigating her, the police are investigating her companies. Let the investigations continue and see what they find. Strangely enough “lessons will be learnt” is generally not what usually happens in fraud investigations!
As for “you and I couldn’t, blah do blah” well actually you could. I was offered the chance to and I said as much on here at the time.
Many of these companies did win contracts and did deliver, some did not. Again, at the time, I posted about this on here. Almost every company I knew was offering their PPE stocks for sale and earn some of this dosh. Shock, bloody horror the police are looking into some them who didn’t deliver but just pocketed some cash.
This woman is in the sights of the fraud squad. By and large they don’t normally dick about.

[Miocene]

pablo said:

The outrage is the fact that it even happened, but also so blatantly. People with parliament connections negotiated contracts for supply, set up companies on the fly, didn't deliver what they said they would or what they did deliver was of no use.

You or I couldn't set up a PPE company and "win" a multi million pound contract but those with connections could. The fact they have all tried to hide it, suppress it and treat us like idiots fuels the outrage.

But yes let's await the results of the investigation....

An acquaintance ran a medical supply company. Ticking along quite nicely pre covid, comfortable lifestyle. Got a contract supplying test kits... and has now effectively retired in his early 40s.

At least his company was the right kind of one to receive these contracts, but to go from small company owner to retired in a couple of years is bonkers.

[Largechris]

Murph7355 said:

I was thinking similar.

Has any investigative journalist done a proper deep dive on the PPE debacle? What sort of profit margins do these sort of companies usually make? What were the contractual terms regarding suitability of products? In calmer times, how much PPE gets ditched because of non-suitability and who picks up the tab? etc. etc. If there has genuinely been piss-taking, I'll polish up my pitchfork. But I'm more interested, initially, on the real details of what happened. What was the marginal dinging we suffered due to, on the face of it, dumb-arsed reactionary behaviour by those who are meant to lead us.

Someone mentioned about off-shore accounts too. It's another area where I'd be more than happy for stricter measures on them being implemented, but also suspect it would have unintended consequences. I would also expect companies involved to have paid taxes etc...govt needs to get smarter on how we tax companies and consumption to make it harder to shelter money off-shore.

All of these questions are answered, with figures, (yes, before and after profit margins etc,) every two weeks in Private Eye. It's got to the stage for me it's actually too depressing to keep up to date with it all.

It's fraud against all us mug taxpayers.

[vonuber]

That 29million would nicely help fill the funding short gap on a public infrastructure project I'm working on, which is having to scaled back because there is apparently no money.

[Countdown]

redback911 said:

The company is under investigation by the National Crime Agency (NCA) for fraud; they did raid various properties Mone and her husband own. Not sure the Government have any appetite for admitting just how messed up (and corrupt) the PPE sourcing process was. Billions have been wasted (some of that stolen), and I'm sure "lessons will be learned".

i think that's the key thing. The amount of fraud arising from CV19 is shocking and the last thing the current Govt wants is for the level of incompetence to be exposed.

[Murph7355]

Largechris said:

All of these questions are answered, with figures, (yes, before and after profit margins etc,) every two weeks in Private Eye. It's got to the stage for me it's actually too depressing to keep up to date with it all.

It's fraud against all us mug taxpayers.

I'll have a read up when I get chance....

[Largechris]

Countdown said:

redback911 said:

The company is under investigation by the National Crime Agency (NCA) for fraud; they did raid various properties Mone and her husband own. Not sure the Government have any appetite for admitting just how messed up (and corrupt) the PPE sourcing process was. Billions have been wasted (some of that stolen), and I'm sure "lessons will be learned".

i think that's the key thing. The amount of fraud arising from CV19 is shocking and the last thing the current Govt wants is for the level of incompetence to be exposed.

I've written about it before, but this is why Lord Agnew quit the government in January, in protest at the lack of action being taken to recover public money:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jan/24/m...

He's done a good job since then giving various interviews where he's strongly suggesting that the government absolutely doesn't want to recover the money because it would expose their (at best) incompetence, at worst their own (Baroness Mone) corruption.

(Yes, this was more about loan fraud than PPE but same principle).

[IroningMan]

If I remember correctly then the very existence of the ‘VIP Lane’ was denied until legal action forced it into the open.

[Pupp]

Countdown said:

i think that's the key thing. The amount of fraud arising from CV19 is shocking and the last thing the current Govt wants is for the level of incompetence to be exposed.

I think it’s being a tad generous to attribute the failings to incompetence. The whole Covid emergency was cynically hyped and exaggerated to heighten demand for PPE and the like, which demand was then responded to by mates of those doing the hyping and exaggerating quite outside procurement controls. Rotten beyond belief.

[monkfish1]

Largechris said:

Countdown said:

redback911 said:

The company is under investigation by the National Crime Agency (NCA) for fraud; they did raid various properties Mone and her husband own. Not sure the Government have any appetite for admitting just how messed up (and corrupt) the PPE sourcing process was. Billions have been wasted (some of that stolen), and I'm sure "lessons will be learned".

i think that's the key thing. The amount of fraud arising from CV19 is shocking and the last thing the current Govt wants is for the level of incompetence to be exposed.

I've written about it before, but this is why Lord Agnew quit the government in January, in protest at the lack of action being taken to recover public money:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/jan/24/m...

He's done a good job since then giving various interviews where he's strongly suggesting that the government absolutely doesn't want to recover the money because it would expose their (at best) incompetence, at worst their own (Baroness Mone) corruption.

(Yes, this was more about loan fraud than PPE but same principle).

Which goes back to whjat i said yesterday. NOTHING will happen because those responsible for making something happen are directly, or indirectly, the perpetrators.

I willing to be that Mone will keep the cash and her liberty. Some whitewash report, a slap on thw rist maybe. But nothing much else. Certainly not, recovery of said moneies back to the tax payer or imprisonment,

[troika]

Always felt there was something iffy about her. This is fraud, simple as. Requires a full forensic investigation, the type of which HMRC are very capable of carrying out, with full consequences commensurate with you or I carrying out such a crime.

[Olivera]

Murph7355 said:

Has any investigative journalist done a proper deep dive on the PPE debacle? What sort of profit margins do these sort of companies usually make?

The contracts for vastly overpriced PPE via the 'VIP lane' were a grifters dream. There are probably bigger scandals than this Mone story, such as this one:

https://bylinetimes.com/2020/10/15/uk-ppe-stockpil...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10529007/...

A small family business making less than £1m profit getting awarded a multi billion pound PPE contract...

[JuanCarlosFandango]

DeejRC said:

I must admit I don’t quite get the outrage. Currently the system is working exactly as it should. She is being investigated for fraud, which is exactly, what, er, you are all demanding.
So, you have what you want, but many of you are complaining.
Let the investigation run its course and see what happens. Don’t forget judges and the justice system aren’t exactly besties with the govt right now!

My outrage is two fold. Firarly the fact that it happened at all. As others have said this was not a bit of fiddling but fraud and theft on an epic scale. Those around her must have known and condoned it, and many were doing similar things. Secondly, "there will be an investigation" by whom? By other politicians and appointees with their snouts in the trough, protecting their own place on the ark.

If she'd claimed a bit of home improvement on expenses or got herself a holiday under the guise of a work trip then fine, investigate her and punish her accordingly.

She, and a load others have made off with grotesque amounts of money that will put us in crippling debt for decades to come under a pack of cynical lies. It's regime change stuff, not won't do it again.

[rah1888]

Seems she has managed to recall her Twitter log-in details, after not appearing there for nearly a year:

https://twitter.com/MichelleMone/status/1595734300...

[Disastrous]

Murph7355 said:

DeejRC said:

I must admit I don’t quite get the outrage. Currently the system is working exactly as it should. She is being investigated for fraud, which is exactly, what, er, you are all demanding.
So, you have what you want, but many of you are complaining.
Let the investigation run its course and see what happens. Don’t forget judges and the justice system aren’t exactly besties with the govt right now!

I was thinking similar.

From the articles linked to, it 100% seems like she ran by the letter of the rules and not the spirit of them in terms of declarations. Assuming that is proven, it would be nice to see her stripped of her peerage etc.

Fraud will be an interesting one too if proven.

Has any investigative journalist done a proper deep dive on the PPE debacle? What sort of profit margins do these sort of companies usually make? What were the contractual terms regarding suitability of products? In calmer times, how much PPE gets ditched because of non-suitability and who picks up the tab? etc. etc. If there has genuinely been piss-taking, I'll polish up my pitchfork. But I'm more interested, initially, on the real details of what happened. What was the marginal dinging we suffered due to, on the face of it, dumb-arsed reactionary behaviour by those who are meant to lead us.

Someone mentioned about off-shore accounts too. It's another area where I'd be more than happy for stricter measures on them being implemented, but also suspect it would have unintended consequences. I would also expect companies involved to have paid taxes etc...govt needs to get smarter on how we tax companies and consumption to make it harder to shelter money off-shore.

Staggered to read you two don’t understand the outrage!

[Halmyre]

Bonefish Blues said:

hyperblue said:

Of course this will be brushed under the carpet. Shameless.

They will need a bigger carpet. I reckon it will put it out to tender.

An excellent suggestion and I just happen to have a carpet factory with spare capacity.

Well, planning permission for a carpet factory.

Look, at least I've got a vague plan for a carpet factory, I just need a few million quid to get it started.

[Bonefish Blues]

Halmyre said:

Bonefish Blues said:

hyperblue said:

Of course this will be brushed under the carpet. Shameless.

They will need a bigger carpet. I reckon it will put it out to tender.

An excellent suggestion and I just happen to have a carpet factory with spare capacity.

Well, planning permission for a carpet factory.

Look, at least I've got a vague plan for a carpet factory, I just need a few million quid to get it started.

My wife has always encouraged me to spend more time in the carpet area, maybe there's an opportunity for a JV?

[CallThatMusic]

Never met her other half but have some experience of Mone and no trouble believing she is capable of de-frauding the public purse and lying to cover it up.
At the very least she should be thrown out of the Lords ( bringing the place into disrepute ) and banged up in jail for a very long time.
Proceeds can then be recovered under current legislation.