Cost of living squeeze in 2022, 23 & 24 (Vol. 2)

[Scrump]

The cost of living squeeze continues into 2023, will it still be there in 2024?
Continued from here:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

[irc]

Looking at UK holiday cottages. Already have an August week booked. Slightly less than last year. That looks to be against the tend though.

I see two trends. Prices hiked massively. Same cottage we had two years ago in same month - June, up from £660 to £980.

Though there seems to be more weeks available. More punters reverting to abroad rather than £3k for a July/August two week self catering cottage in the UK?

[a311]

irc said:

Looking at UK holiday cottages. Already have an August week booked. Slightly less than last year. That looks to be against the tend though.

I see two trends. Prices hiked massively. Same cottage we had two years ago in same month - June, up from £660 to £980.

Though there seems to be more weeks available. More punters reverting to abroad rather than £3k for a July/August two week self catering cottage in the UK?

You'd expect owners who aren't on an old normal fixed price tariff for utilities to need try and pass some of that cost on. I don't think many people will give two about being energy efficient in a holiday let-heating on full whack etc etc.

Likewise owners who have a mortgage could be coming out of a fixed deal and refinance. It's either smaller margins or pass those on to customers who are also being squeezed.

[skwdenyer]

irc said:

Looking at UK holiday cottages. Already have an August week booked. Slightly less than last year. That looks to be against the tend though.

I see two trends. Prices hiked massively. Same cottage we had two years ago in same month - June, up from £660 to £980.

Though there seems to be more weeks available. More punters reverting to abroad rather than £3k for a July/August two week self catering cottage in the UK?

Anecdotally up my way (Yorkshire Dales) quite a few cottage owners selling-up and occupancy rates way down.

[hotchy]

a311 said:

irc said:

Looking at UK holiday cottages. Already have an August week booked. Slightly less than last year. That looks to be against the tend though.

I see two trends. Prices hiked massively. Same cottage we had two years ago in same month - June, up from £660 to £980.

Though there seems to be more weeks available. More punters reverting to abroad rather than £3k for a July/August two week self catering cottage in the UK?

You'd expect owners who aren't on an old normal fixed price tariff for utilities to need try and pass some of that cost on. I don't think many people will give two about being energy efficient in a holiday let-heating on full whack etc etc.

Likewise owners who have a mortgage could be coming out of a fixed deal and refinance. It's either smaller margins or pass those on to customers who are also being squeezed.

Surely you can put controls in? Iv been in plenty hotels where whatever I do to the thermostat it doesn't actually do anything it stays how the hotel wants it to stay.

[madbadger]

hotchy said:

a311 said:

irc said:

Looking at UK holiday cottages. Already have an August week booked. Slightly less than last year. That looks to be against the tend though.

I see two trends. Prices hiked massively. Same cottage we had two years ago in same month - June, up from £660 to £980.

Though there seems to be more weeks available. More punters reverting to abroad rather than £3k for a July/August two week self catering cottage in the UK?

You'd expect owners who aren't on an old normal fixed price tariff for utilities to need try and pass some of that cost on. I don't think many people will give two about being energy efficient in a holiday let-heating on full whack etc etc.

Likewise owners who have a mortgage could be coming out of a fixed deal and refinance. It's either smaller margins or pass those on to customers who are also being squeezed.

Surely you can put controls in? Iv been in plenty hotels where whatever I do to the thermostat it doesn't actually do anything it stays how the hotel wants it to stay.

Aka 'broken'.

Not sure in a holiday let. If you want to sit in the cold with a coat on you can stay at home. Reviews are king and you don't want people complaing about being too cold

[Jambo85]

madbadger said:

Aka 'broken'.

Not sure in a holiday let. If you want to sit in the cold with a coat on you can stay at home. Reviews are king and you don't want people complaing about being too cold

Agreed - I’ve often wondered why billing for actual energy use in holiday let’s isn’t more of a thing here? I’ve seen it abroad, meter readings in and out, flat price per unit, job done. Take a deposit if necessary.

[ben5575]

hotchy said:

Surely you can put controls in? Iv been in plenty hotels where whatever I do to the thermostat it doesn't actually do anything it stays how the hotel wants it to stay.

I've been renting airbnb's to temporarily house some purchasers due to delays and in one of the them the landlord had installed a Tado system and spent each evening playing cat and mouse with the tenant. Whenever the tenant turned it up in the house, he would turn it down on his phone. Got proper arsey over it as well, so obviously they went out of their way to turn it up as high as poss

[princeperch]

in a fit of rage I emailed my daughters nursery last night asking how they could justify a 20% increase in fees.

they replied saying oh the living wage has gone up, we need to retain and motivate staff, our rent has gone up, as has our energy costs.

fair enough but are you telling me that overall the cost of running the business has gone up 20pc? and they've made no efforts to offset it?

I seem to recall there are about 100 kids that go to the nursery overall - something like that. their fee increases will bring in the best part of something in the region of 1/4 million extra in fees a year. I can appreciate thing have gone up, somethings have gone up a lot, but this seems to me to be opportunistic - most nurseries have put their fees up this year by 10pc and I would have thought that was about the right figure.

10pc most people would swallow. 20pc ? and then probably another 5-10pc next year too? if their operation costs are genuinely going up by that amount then the writing is on the wall for their business. some people have 2 kids at nurseries - how on earth are they meant to find another 500 quid a month on top of everything else?

[okgo]

Went into mine this morning, aircon set to 24.5c and the windows open.

Sums it up really.

[princeperch]

okgo said:

Went into mine this morning, aircon set to 24.5c and the windows open.

Sums it up really.

I'm not sure I'd be able to hold my tongue!

I can find the extra they want every month, and yes childcare is only for a relatively short amount of time. It's still very painful tho and they know they have you over a barrel.

[a311]

princeperch said:

in a fit of rage I emailed my daughters nursery last night asking how they could justify a 20% increase in fees.

they replied saying oh the living wage has gone up, we need to retain and motivate staff, our rent has gone up, as has our energy costs.

fair enough but are you telling me that overall the cost of running the business has gone up 20pc? and they've made no efforts to offset it?

I seem to recall there are about 100 kids that go to the nursery overall - something like that. their fee increases will bring in the best part of something in the region of 1/4 million extra in fees a year. I can appreciate thing have gone up, somethings have gone up a lot, but this seems to me to be opportunistic - most nurseries have put their fees up this year by 10pc and I would have thought that was about the right figure.

10pc most people would swallow. 20pc ? and then probably another 5-10pc next year too? if their operation costs are genuinely going up by that amount then the writing is on the wall for their business. some people have 2 kids at nurseries - how on earth are they meant to find another 500 quid a month on top of everything else?

How much notice were you given? In any case it’s piss take IMO. I’m glad our youngest is now in nursery and get the 30 hours. My wife is PT and he doesn’t go in fulltime. We’re in the NW so childcare costs for us have never been at the eye watering levels I’ve heard further south-we’ve usually be in the £6.50 an hour bracket. Our kids after school clubs have put on a 10% increase but also decided to close an hour earlier so on an hourly basis it’s probably a fair whack.

Businesses like nurseries have you over a bit of a barrel, I don’t imagine unless they really have to parents will uproot their kids from their routine and familiar surroundings from somewhere both the kid and parents are happy with.

[CharlesdeGaulle]

princeperch said:

I'm not sure I'd be able to hold my tongue!

I can find the extra they want every month, and yes childcare is only for a relatively short amount of time. It's still very painful tho and they know they have you over a barrel.

I know that childcare is expensive, and it's frustrating to be presented with higher bills, but isn't this just the other side of the coin?

We would probably all agree that staff should get sensible pay rises to offset inflation; we all know that energy costs are higher; we all recognise that small businesses inevitably have to pass-on cost increases; and we would probably all agree that COVID hit places like that pretty hard. So where was the money to retain viability to come from, if not the customers? Who else is going to pay?

20% might feel a lot, but if their prices have remained static for some time it might be a 'catch-up' after trying to contain costs for some years.

[a311]

hotchy said:

a311 said:

irc said:

Looking at UK holiday cottages. Already have an August week booked. Slightly less than last year. That looks to be against the tend though.

I see two trends. Prices hiked massively. Same cottage we had two years ago in same month - June, up from £660 to £980.

Though there seems to be more weeks available. More punters reverting to abroad rather than £3k for a July/August two week self catering cottage in the UK?

You'd expect owners who aren't on an old normal fixed price tariff for utilities to need try and pass some of that cost on. I don't think many people will give two about being energy efficient in a holiday let-heating on full whack etc etc.

Likewise owners who have a mortgage could be coming out of a fixed deal and refinance. It's either smaller margins or pass those on to customers who are also being squeezed.

In the UK I've only ever been to one place-some lodges in the Highlands of Scotland where you paid for what you used. Personally I'd rather it was included in the price-it's not too bad if you know upfront then can factor in X cost per day.

Surely you can put controls in? Iv been in plenty hotels where whatever I do to the thermostat it doesn't actually do anything it stays how the hotel wants it to stay.

[okgo]

They’re also not stupid enough not to be too out of kilter price wise. Going rate here is now 1800-2500 per month for 5 day weeks for under 3’s.

From when we started I think with 15 hours and my son becoming 3 we will be back to the price they charged us in the first place such are the rises.

But to run a big Victorian building with the extremes of weather we seem to get these days must be vast. But if only it had a ‘few’ people with some brainpower they could be vastly more efficient.

[skwdenyer]

princeperch said:

in a fit of rage I emailed my daughters nursery last night asking how they could justify a 20% increase in fees.

they replied saying oh the living wage has gone up, we need to retain and motivate staff, our rent has gone up, as has our energy costs.

fair enough but are you telling me that overall the cost of running the business has gone up 20pc? and they've made no efforts to offset it?

I seem to recall there are about 100 kids that go to the nursery overall - something like that. their fee increases will bring in the best part of something in the region of 1/4 million extra in fees a year. I can appreciate thing have gone up, somethings have gone up a lot, but this seems to me to be opportunistic - most nurseries have put their fees up this year by 10pc and I would have thought that was about the right figure.

10pc most people would swallow. 20pc ? and then probably another 5-10pc next year too? if their operation costs are genuinely going up by that amount then the writing is on the wall for their business. some people have 2 kids at nurseries - how on earth are they meant to find another 500 quid a month on top of everything else?

Is it feasible for the cost of running the business to have gone up 20% or more? Yes, absolutely. If they were coming out of, say, a 5-year fix, energy prices alone could have swallowed the whole of that rise and more. Electricity has gone up >>4x in that time, gas >> 3x. Energy bills of, say, £25k / year could now easily be up £70k or so. Wages are a dominant cost. Business rates are going up this year. And so on.

When was their last fee increase?

[vulture1]

skwdenyer said:

princeperch said:

in a fit of rage I emailed my daughters nursery last night asking how they could justify a 20% increase in fees.

they replied saying oh the living wage has gone up, we need to retain and motivate staff, our rent has gone up, as has our energy costs.

fair enough but are you telling me that overall the cost of running the business has gone up 20pc? and they've made no efforts to offset it?

I seem to recall there are about 100 kids that go to the nursery overall - something like that. their fee increases will bring in the best part of something in the region of 1/4 million extra in fees a year. I can appreciate thing have gone up, somethings have gone up a lot, but this seems to me to be opportunistic - most nurseries have put their fees up this year by 10pc and I would have thought that was about the right figure.

10pc most people would swallow. 20pc ? and then probably another 5-10pc next year too? if their operation costs are genuinely going up by that amount then the writing is on the wall for their business. some people have 2 kids at nurseries - how on earth are they meant to find another 500 quid a month on top of everything else?

Is it feasible for the cost of running the business to have gone up 20% or more? Yes, absolutely. If they were coming out of, say, a 5-year fix, energy prices alone could have swallowed the whole of that rise and more. Electricity has gone up >>4x in that time, gas >> 3x. Energy bills of, say, £25k / year could now easily be up £70k or so. Wages are a dominant cost. Business rates are going up this year. And so on.

When was their last fee increase?

It's also a definative minimum wage job playing on the enjoyment factor of the job to retain staff. But if are struggling financially they will eventually move on.

[skwdenyer]

vulture1 said:

It's also a definative minimum wage job playing on the enjoyment factor of the job to retain staff. But if are struggling financially they will eventually move on.

NMW is going up almost 10%, too.

[leef44]

I rented a holiday cottage in Wales once and the landlord did not turn the heating on before we arrived.

It's two foot of concrete walls. It took two days to heat it up so we spent the two days with so many layers on and still freezing. It only had economy-saver wall heaters which would throw out medium heat for about six hours during the day and no heat in the evening.

We had to turn the oven on full with the oven door open to try to get some heat in the house.

[princeperch]

skwdenyer said:

Is it feasible for the cost of running the business to have gone up 20% or more? Yes, absolutely. If they were coming out of, say, a 5-year fix, energy prices alone could have swallowed the whole of that rise and more. Electricity has gone up >>4x in that time, gas >> 3x. Energy bills of, say, £25k / year could now easily be up £70k or so. Wages are a dominant cost. Business rates are going up this year. And so on.

When was their last fee increase?

Their last fee increase was 15pc last April.

So 35pc increase in two bloody years.

Edited by princeperch on Wednesday 4th January 17:19