Brexit - was it worth it? (Vol. 4)
Discussion
don'tbesilly said:
Mrr T said:
The ERG are using this claim to suggest they are still relevant. But the 48 tories did not abstain they failed to vote for reasons unknow. Some may have wished to express discontent but they also included 2 ministers Grant Shapps and Mims Davies also David Mundell and Maria Miller neither of whom are on the ERG wing.
LolHM-2 said:
crankedup5 said:
The Tories have always been a broad church
Historically yes, but definitely not since the Brexit vote. The aggressive purging of any pro-EU figures from the party hardly speaks to "broad church" does it?Possibly the most divisive political debate in my lifetime, seeing MPs desire to ignore a democratic vote.
I agree that the broad church was a divided congregation regarding this one issue.
crankedup5 said:
HM-2 said:
crankedup5 said:
The Tories have always been a broad church
Historically yes, but definitely not since the Brexit vote. The aggressive purging of any pro-EU figures from the party hardly speaks to "broad church" does it?Possibly the most divisive political debate in my lifetime, seeing MPs desire to ignore a democratic vote.
I agree that the broad church was a divided congregation regarding this one issue.
S600BSB said:
crankedup5 said:
HM-2 said:
crankedup5 said:
The Tories have always been a broad church
Historically yes, but definitely not since the Brexit vote. The aggressive purging of any pro-EU figures from the party hardly speaks to "broad church" does it?Possibly the most divisive political debate in my lifetime, seeing MPs desire to ignore a democratic vote.
I agree that the broad church was a divided congregation regarding this one issue.
crankedup5 said:
I disagree, sure some MPs do have a stronger pov on some issues, but the vast majority still conform to the whip when required. Nowhere near as bad as Labour who seem to bend in the breeze to please.
The continuum of views within the tory Party is as wide as that between the tories and Labour. Try telling the sensible one nation wing - Tobias Ellwood et al - that they share the views of ERG loons like Mark Francois or Jacob Rees-Mogg!S600BSB said:
crankedup5 said:
I disagree, sure some MPs do have a stronger pov on some issues, but the vast majority still conform to the whip when required. Nowhere near as bad as Labour who seem to bend in the breeze to please.
The continuum of views within the tory Party is as wide as that between the tories and Labour. Try telling the sensible one nation wing - Tobias Ellwood et al - that they share the views of ERG loons like Mark Francois or Jacob Rees-Mogg!I come back to my original point - a diverse range of opinion is a good thing and the whip still sees the majority vote with Government. For me that makes good Government, I would not want to see sheeple and enjoy hearing other pov.
crankedup5 said:
I didn’t say ‘share the views’ and you are making my point for me now. The ERG are a tiny proportion of the Conservative Parliament. The hugely divisive brexit debacle certainly brought out the differing views within the Conservative and Labour Parties. Lib - Dems not so much, so few MPs and the main policy was pro EU.
I come back to my original point - a diverse range of opinion is a good thing and the whip still sees the majority vote with Government. For me that makes good Government, I would not want to see sheeple and enjoy hearing other pov.
Ok Crank.I come back to my original point - a diverse range of opinion is a good thing and the whip still sees the majority vote with Government. For me that makes good Government, I would not want to see sheeple and enjoy hearing other pov.
crankedup5 said:
HM-2 said:
crankedup5 said:
The Tories have always been a broad church
Historically yes, but definitely not since the Brexit vote. The aggressive purging of any pro-EU figures from the party hardly speaks to "broad church" does it?You are yet again demonstrating you don't really understand how electoral politics works.
HM-2 said:
crankedup5 said:
HM-2 said:
crankedup5 said:
The Tories have always been a broad church
Historically yes, but definitely not since the Brexit vote. The aggressive purging of any pro-EU figures from the party hardly speaks to "broad church" does it?You are yet again demonstrating you don't really understand how electoral politics works.
crankedup5 said:
In principle that’s all fine and dandy
It's not "in principle", it's literally the rules by which MPs are sworn to abide. crankedup5 said:
the reality was the Government had responsibility to ensure that the referendum result was enacted.
You appear not to understand the difference between Parliament and government. crankedup5 said:
We can all dance around the semantics and shout about people not knowing how electoral politics works
Mindlessly parroting ERG rhetoric doesn't magically make my argument, which you've failed entirely to rebut, invalid. HM-2 said:
crankedup5 said:
In principle that’s all fine and dandy
It's not "in principle", it's literally the rules by which MPs are sworn to abide. crankedup5 said:
the reality was the Government had responsibility to ensure that the referendum result was enacted.
You appear not to understand the difference between Parliament and government. crankedup5 said:
We can all dance around the semantics and shout about people not knowing how electoral politics works
Mindlessly parroting ERG rhetoric doesn't magically make my argument, which you've failed entirely to rebut, invalid. crankedup5 said:
Sadly for you, all the posturing and manoeuvring performed by MPs following the 2016 referendum proved to be toilet bowl value, thanks Boris.
Are you going to actually respond directly to anything I've said, or just post irrelevancies all evening? I'm far from convinced you're even capable of comprehending what my argument is, given this feeble display. It's almost unsporting. Mrr T said:
don'tbesilly said:
Mrr T said:
The ERG are using this claim to suggest they are still relevant. But the 48 tories did not abstain they failed to vote for reasons unknow. Some may have wished to express discontent but they also included 2 ministers Grant Shapps and Mims Davies also David Mundell and Maria Miller neither of whom are on the ERG wing.
Loldon'tbesilly said:
Mrr T said:
don'tbesilly said:
Mrr T said:
The ERG are using this claim to suggest they are still relevant. But the 48 tories did not abstain they failed to vote for reasons unknow. Some may have wished to express discontent but they also included 2 ministers Grant Shapps and Mims Davies also David Mundell and Maria Miller neither of whom are on the ERG wing.
LolThe only people who seem to be making the same claim as you are the ERG but no one is listening mainly because the list of those who where adsent from the vote contains minister and goverment loyalist.
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