Crypto Currency Thread
Discussion
Behemoth said:
Nothing is put to bed, it's way way too early to determine that. Zoom out beyond the last 12 months.
When traders are margin called, they pull from any and all assets to pay up. Including bitcoin, including gold. If/when there's a bigger financial crash then neither bitcoin or gold are going to be any sort of safe haven. When average Joes come under pressure, they will also pull any and every asset to pay bills & put food on the table.
Including gold? When traders are margin called, they pull from any and all assets to pay up. Including bitcoin, including gold. If/when there's a bigger financial crash then neither bitcoin or gold are going to be any sort of safe haven. When average Joes come under pressure, they will also pull any and every asset to pay bills & put food on the table.
So crypto is controlled by the average joe who needs to sell it off to pay the bills? So a terrible store of wealth. Like I said, that argument has been firmly put to bed.
DonkeyApple said:
Including gold?
So crypto is controlled by the average joe who needs to sell it off to pay the bills? So a terrible store of wealth. Like I said, that argument has been firmly put to bed.
You're going to bed too early, come back in a decade and let's see where we are. I'm surprised you're looking at such short time frames for transformative concepts.So crypto is controlled by the average joe who needs to sell it off to pay the bills? So a terrible store of wealth. Like I said, that argument has been firmly put to bed.
Bitcoin isn't controlled by anyone, which is the essence of it. Volatility is expected for a long while to come and there's plenty of room for price to drop further this round. It's just one of many popped bubbles that Bitcoin has experienced and speculation will continue unabated.
Please expand your gold comment. I don't know where you're placing that, in response to what?
You said gold isn’t a safe haven yet this week we saw massive flows precisely because it is. My point is that there has been an argument that cryptos are a safe haven. This has manifestly been proven not true. Ten year horizons aren’t pertinent. We are talking about it as a market today. It behaves like a crappy little penny share and will do so until it finds a purpose in the real world.
As for bitcoin not being controlled by anyone that’s manifestly not true. It’s just a classic illiquid market that can be controlled by anyone with the means and the desire to do so.
As for bitcoin not being controlled by anyone that’s manifestly not true. It’s just a classic illiquid market that can be controlled by anyone with the means and the desire to do so.
DonkeyApple said:
As for bitcoin not being controlled by anyone that’s manifestly not true. It’s just a classic illiquid market that can be controlled by anyone with the means and the desire to do so.
So I presume that you think the massive btc sale that happened was the US government disposing of part of their Silk Road stash to deflate the btc price artificially and to distract the public from seeing btc as a safe haven? I see where you’re coming from....
James B we have another conspiracy theorist over here. Feel free to flog him in public.
He's not wrong, i've posted before about Bitfinex with its spoof trading(spoofy) and 'print your own money' tether propping up tcs price, a top 3 exchange has had massive impact on btc price, through massive manipulation and supply control.
Something is currently afoot with tether at moment as well.
just noticed this article.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-10-12...
''Griffin and Shams noticed that when Bitcoin fell to certain levels, purchases using Tether would flood in to stabilize prices. After crunching the data, they concluded this fit a pattern consistent with someone, or a group of people, trying to manipulate Bitcoin prices.''
edited for the pedantic nitpickers.
Something is currently afoot with tether at moment as well.
just noticed this article.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-10-12...
''Griffin and Shams noticed that when Bitcoin fell to certain levels, purchases using Tether would flood in to stabilize prices. After crunching the data, they concluded this fit a pattern consistent with someone, or a group of people, trying to manipulate Bitcoin prices.''
edited for the pedantic nitpickers.
Edited by Thesprucegoose on Saturday 13th October 19:30
Behemoth said:
For the third time (I've actually lost count), there are no conspiracy theories
bks are there not. There are JFK ones, vaccine ones, UFO ones, Jewish ones and banker ones. To claim that there are not is ludicrous.I’m happy to take you at your word that you don’t subscribe to any, but claiming that they don’t exist suggest quite a strange mindset.
Have you genuinely never heard any?
DonkeyApple said:
You said gold isn’t a safe haven yet this week we saw massive flows precisely because it is. My point is that there has been an argument that cryptos are a safe haven. This has manifestly been proven not true. Ten year horizons aren’t pertinent. We are talking about it as a market today. It behaves like a crappy little penny share and will do so until it finds a purpose in the real world.
As for bitcoin not being controlled by anyone that’s manifestly not true. It’s just a classic illiquid market that can be controlled by anyone with the means and the desire to do so.
Back when I used to trade USD assets in a EUROPEAN bank, I used to cover the guy who traded agency bond once in a while if he was out for the day.As for bitcoin not being controlled by anyone that’s manifestly not true. It’s just a classic illiquid market that can be controlled by anyone with the means and the desire to do so.
Others did it a bit too, and his fury when someone misunderstood the difference between total issue size and free float, and so sold something that we’d never be able to buy back was always amusing to see.
It’s the same here, very few accounts own far too much for it to be played around in.
dimots said:
DonkeyApple said:
As for bitcoin not being controlled by anyone that’s manifestly not true. It’s just a classic illiquid market that can be controlled by anyone with the means and the desire to do so.
So I presume that you think the massive btc sale that happened was the US government disposing of part of their Silk Road stash to deflate the btc price artificially and to distract the public from seeing btc as a safe haven? I see where you’re coming from....
James B we have another conspiracy theorist over here. Feel free to flog him in public.
But surely anyone who thinks that the bitcoin market is being deliberately manipulated for gain is a conspiracy theorist unless they have evidence?
We know that the price can be moved by big transactions. MT Gox sell off seems to have partly contributed to holding the market down in 2018. But evidence for anything beyond that? Where is it?
We know that the price can be moved by big transactions. MT Gox sell off seems to have partly contributed to holding the market down in 2018. But evidence for anything beyond that? Where is it?
dimots said:
But surely anyone who thinks that the bitcoin market is being deliberately manipulated for gain is a conspiracy theorist unless they have evidence?
We know that the price can be moved by big transactions. MT Gox sell off seems to have partly contributed to holding the market down in 2018. But evidence for anything beyond that? Where is it?
Where is what? Let’s start with where the claim it’s being manipulated is? That’s the logical starting point. We know that the price can be moved by big transactions. MT Gox sell off seems to have partly contributed to holding the market down in 2018. But evidence for anything beyond that? Where is it?
dimots said:
But surely anyone who thinks that the bitcoin market is being deliberately manipulated for gain is a conspiracy theorist unless they have evidence?
We know that the price can be moved by big transactions. MT Gox sell off seems to have partly contributed to holding the market down in 2018. But evidence for anything beyond that? Where is it?
I don't have any evidence. I'm not saying I'm sure its being manipulated, but at the same time, I also think its naïve to think its not being manipulated. Overall, I think a healthy scepticism is advisable and not to take Bitcoin at face value. We know that the price can be moved by big transactions. MT Gox sell off seems to have partly contributed to holding the market down in 2018. But evidence for anything beyond that? Where is it?
TheAngryDog said:
Has anyone heard much about initiative q? Is it another crypto or something else?
I came here to ask the same - various sources are either for or against it, this one seems to be the most informative link I can find so far:https://davidgerard.co.uk/blockchain/2018/06/24/in...
Lots of friends on Facebook circulating a generic sign-up message. Has all the hallmarks of a pyramid scheme but people I hold in high esteem are sharing so... go figure.
Personally I think initiative q is an experiment rather than a con. I can’t see any technology behind it and the way it reads suggests it’s a kind of thought experiment along the lines of ‘what is money’? It appears that a ‘Q’ does not exist and is in fact just a device to highlight how ethereal the concept of money really is.
Could be wrong, would like to hear from anyone who sees value in it.
Could be wrong, would like to hear from anyone who sees value in it.
If you look, there is a incentive for signing up your friends in the form of more coins, and at the moment there is no cost involved, so hence people are going to push it hard. Their entire marketing policy is around social media.
To me it looks like everything else. An idea which someone either A) hopes to get rich on, or B) actually believes will change the world.
Its far more likely to do A than B IMO, and I still dont buy the argument that there is much wrong with Pounds, Dollars and Yen.
Read the website, there are so many holes and unanswered questions I cant even begin to think it will ever get anywhere beyond an IPO and subsequent failure. I certainly wouldnt pay money for it, while they're being given out for free you've got nothing to loose I guess.
To me it looks like everything else. An idea which someone either A) hopes to get rich on, or B) actually believes will change the world.
Its far more likely to do A than B IMO, and I still dont buy the argument that there is much wrong with Pounds, Dollars and Yen.
Read the website, there are so many holes and unanswered questions I cant even begin to think it will ever get anywhere beyond an IPO and subsequent failure. I certainly wouldnt pay money for it, while they're being given out for free you've got nothing to loose I guess.
I checked their website, and indeed looked for information from non-affiliated sources. A lot of people in my circle are signing up and giving links out so at the moment it looks like a pretty successful data mapping exercise and little more.
I'm assuming in order to get this off the ground, potential investors need to be confident that there is a pool of potential users - and with the incentive being 'we just need your email address' most will have little to lose with the chance of some reimbursement or being there for the birth of something ground-breaking.
Yet here I am, feeling very cynical about the whole thing. It'll take something extraordinary to move the globe from the current financial model - and I don't personally feel cards and cash are all that outdated.
I'm assuming in order to get this off the ground, potential investors need to be confident that there is a pool of potential users - and with the incentive being 'we just need your email address' most will have little to lose with the chance of some reimbursement or being there for the birth of something ground-breaking.
Yet here I am, feeling very cynical about the whole thing. It'll take something extraordinary to move the globe from the current financial model - and I don't personally feel cards and cash are all that outdated.
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