Transfer of (small) Barclays DB Pension
Discussion
Wondering if anyone can help. My wife has a very small DB Pension from years ago when she worked at Barclays (1964 Scheme, 100% pre - 1988 GMP). She has received an upto date transfer figure from WTW (increased 20% in 18 months) and it appears compelling, particularly as the projected pension does not have annual increases. HL will accept a transfer in to her SIPP but this is obviously subject to her receiving advice from a PTS. The challenge is that due to the relatively small transfer value (less than £60K), unless I can find a PTS able to do this for a reasonable fee, it doesn’t make sense.
Can anyone point me in the right direction? I think the fact that there is no annual increase from 60 makes it a sensible thing to do.
Can anyone point me in the right direction? I think the fact that there is no annual increase from 60 makes it a sensible thing to do.
Stay in Bed Instead said:
What fee do you consider reasonable?
What she doesn’t need to pay for is a ‘financial review’. I know this pot is small for a DB transfer, but it’s also a small element of her overall position, which does not require an overhaul. What she needs is someone who knows this Scheme to review the numbers in isolation and say, yes, it makes sense to transfer. Barclays even send the form to sign. It can’t be a lot of work. I’m thinking a couple of hours of time at a rate I’d pay a solicitor. What do you think is reasonable? I actually thought is was capped ?
If not then too right it should be. They are banned from transferring and charging commission so this is how they got round it. Basically commission by another name.
5 years ago it would cost £750 to have a report done giving you the advise you need whether you heeded it or not.
Same thing now could be 10k and be on the basis of restricted advise tying you to there company (and their IFA commission) as they will not deal with insistent clients.
I understand the liability aspect but they do not make themselves look good in this part of the market.
If not then too right it should be. They are banned from transferring and charging commission so this is how they got round it. Basically commission by another name.
5 years ago it would cost £750 to have a report done giving you the advise you need whether you heeded it or not.
Same thing now could be 10k and be on the basis of restricted advise tying you to there company (and their IFA commission) as they will not deal with insistent clients.
I understand the liability aspect but they do not make themselves look good in this part of the market.
troika said:
What she doesn’t need to pay for is a ‘financial review’. I know this pot is small for a DB transfer, but it’s also a small element of her overall position, which does not require an overhaul. What she needs is someone who knows this Scheme to review the numbers in isolation and say, yes, it makes sense to transfer. Barclays even send the form to sign. It can’t be a lot of work. I’m thinking a couple of hours of time at a rate I’d pay a solicitor. What do you think is reasonable?
It is a legal requirement that she seeks regulated financial advice on the transfer, and the Financial Conduct Authority only permit suitably qualified individuals to do so.In order to assess whether or not the transfer is in her best interest the adviser must assess her current financial position, potential financial position in retirement, attitude to risk, health, etc and consider that against the guaranteed benefits from the defined benefit scheme which will require specific enquiries to the scheme in question.
Then they have to cover the cost of their PI insurance as people who don't get out what they thought they would are all too ready to blame someone else (often assisted by NWNF scumbags).
I would be amazed if you could get anyone to do it for under £1500.
Brads67 said:
I actually thought is was capped ?
If not then too right it should be. They are banned from transferring and charging commission so this is how they got round it. Basically commission by another name.
5 years ago it would cost £750 to have a report done giving you the advise you need whether you heeded it or not.
Same thing now could be 10k and be on the basis of restricted advise tying you to there company (and their IFA commission) as they will not deal with insistent clients.
I understand the liability aspect but they do not make themselves look good in this part of the market.
Quite. The costs being mentioned for something very straightforward and boiler plate is quite ridiculous. It makes my lawyer / accountant look very, very cheap for what they do and they also have strict compliance / PI insurance etc etc. If not then too right it should be. They are banned from transferring and charging commission so this is how they got round it. Basically commission by another name.
5 years ago it would cost £750 to have a report done giving you the advise you need whether you heeded it or not.
Same thing now could be 10k and be on the basis of restricted advise tying you to there company (and their IFA commission) as they will not deal with insistent clients.
I understand the liability aspect but they do not make themselves look good in this part of the market.
Stay in Bed Instead said:
It is a legal requirement that she seeks regulated financial advice on the transfer, and the Financial Conduct Authority only permit suitably qualified individuals to do so.
In order to assess whether or not the transfer is in her best interest the adviser must assess her current financial position, potential financial position in retirement, attitude to risk, health, etc and consider that against the guaranteed benefits from the defined benefit scheme which will require specific enquiries to the scheme in question.
Then they have to cover the cost of their PI insurance as people who don't get out what they thought they would are all too ready to blame someone else (often assisted by NWNF scumbags).
I would be amazed if you could get anyone to do it for under £1500.
My solicitor and accountant also have to be suitably qualified. My accountant would have this sussed out in minutes. Why can’t these ‘experts’ charge for the time it takes at a rate which reflects their qualifications? In order to assess whether or not the transfer is in her best interest the adviser must assess her current financial position, potential financial position in retirement, attitude to risk, health, etc and consider that against the guaranteed benefits from the defined benefit scheme which will require specific enquiries to the scheme in question.
Then they have to cover the cost of their PI insurance as people who don't get out what they thought they would are all too ready to blame someone else (often assisted by NWNF scumbags).
I would be amazed if you could get anyone to do it for under £1500.
troika said:
Quite. The costs being mentioned for something very straightforward and boiler plate is quite ridiculous. It makes my lawyer / accountant look very, very cheap for what they do and they also have strict compliance / PI insurance etc etc.
When I saw the report it was basically a transcript of a questionnaire I had filled in.Very bad taste in mouth about the whole thing tbh.
Brads67 said:
When I saw the report it was basically a transcript of a questionnaire I had filled in.
Very bad taste in mouth about the whole thing tbh.
https://www.ftadviser.com/pensions/2019/12/31/will-2019-mark-the-death-of-db-transfers/Very bad taste in mouth about the whole thing tbh.
Obtaining the mandatory specialist pension transfer advice qualifications is one thing, but getting professional indemnity cover in place for advisers is another - costs have skyrocketed for this cover because of the volume of poor advice claims, so many PI firms no longer cover this activity (so advisers can't legally give this type of advice under FCA guidelines) and many advisory firms that still have PI cover and the necessary FCA permissions are either pulling out of providing defined benefit transfer advice for smaller fund values or are putting up their fees to cover the PI costs
This quote from the linked article sums up the situation succinctly..
..also thought the industry could “swing” too far against DB transfers. He said: “Clearly the big danger here is that the market swings to the point where people who would be better off transferring are simply unable to access the advice they need
“The regulator will need to consider this potential area of consumer detriment in formulating its final proposals.”
The courts are also in no mood to seek any changes in regulation for 'insistent clients'
https://www.ftadviser.com/regulation/2019/12/19/wa...
The complainant said: "I am being forced by a 'catch-all' and unnecessarily blunt regulatory protocol to pay a significant sum of money for advice that I neither need nor want, and am qualified so to decide, and that is on an increasingly challenged assumption I can even find an IFA prepared to execute the transaction in the first place.
https://www.ftadviser.com/regulation/2019/12/19/wa...
The complainant said: "I am being forced by a 'catch-all' and unnecessarily blunt regulatory protocol to pay a significant sum of money for advice that I neither need nor want, and am qualified so to decide, and that is on an increasingly challenged assumption I can even find an IFA prepared to execute the transaction in the first place.
phope said:
The courts are also in no mood to seek any changes in regulation for 'insistent clients'
https://www.ftadviser.com/regulation/2019/12/19/wa...
The complainant said: "I am being forced by a 'catch-all' and unnecessarily blunt regulatory protocol to pay a significant sum of money for advice that I neither need nor want, and am qualified so to decide, and that is on an increasingly challenged assumption I can even find an IFA prepared to execute the transaction in the first place.
The more I look into this, the more I’m starting to think the whole thing is a sham. https://www.ftadviser.com/regulation/2019/12/19/wa...
The complainant said: "I am being forced by a 'catch-all' and unnecessarily blunt regulatory protocol to pay a significant sum of money for advice that I neither need nor want, and am qualified so to decide, and that is on an increasingly challenged assumption I can even find an IFA prepared to execute the transaction in the first place.
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