Georgian House Renovation Up North - 5 Years and Counting
Discussion
Ilovejapcrap said:
Great thread but cutting those floor boards nooooo.
You can't get good boards nowadays should have taken up carefully de nailed and kept to one side.
You could also use to make other floors good.
Anyway good thread
Don't worry, I did - apart from the ones they'd battered previously and when I was frantically trying to get at the water leak.You can't get good boards nowadays should have taken up carefully de nailed and kept to one side.
You could also use to make other floors good.
Anyway good thread
The building is listed and I've been as sensitive as I can throughout and been in touch with conservation all the way through.
There was no way to avoid a step up to the bathroom without cutting and taking them out complete without cutting would have meant taking down the stud wall as they ran under it :/
In parallel to getting the bathroom sorted, the most pressing thing when I bought it was making it weatherproof and fixing the damp.
The roof was the biggest gamble when I bought the place as I wasn't sure how much could be saved at the back versus having to take it all off. I'd estimated a max of about 10k worst case but I wasn't sure how extensive the rot was and therefore how much would have to be lifted off.
Here's what the roof looked like when I moved in,
The roof was the biggest gamble when I bought the place as I wasn't sure how much could be saved at the back versus having to take it all off. I'd estimated a max of about 10k worst case but I wasn't sure how extensive the rot was and therefore how much would have to be lifted off.
Here's what the roof looked like when I moved in,
I did have a full monty building survey of the house done as a condition of purchase from the lender because it was listed and they didn't want some mental just buying a knackered old house that fell down and then went bankrupt.
Even so, it wasn't until the builders had gone home for the night and I'd jumped up on the scaffolding that I was relieved the roof wasn't so bad. The rot hadn't got too far and it was mainly the gable end that had also just rotted away and caused slates to slip and let in water.
In what would become a recurring theme, if it had been dealt with immediately, there wouldn't have been any major cost associated with it but as it had been left the purlins and timbers needed further attention.
Conservation insisted on a like for like so it was a replacement wood gable end an I got off lightly with some slates needing replacement and the roofline needing retiled.
The wooden gutter was shot to s
t too and as it was the only bit of wooden gutter left on the house, I again did it like for like.
It does mean eventually it will need replacing again but it's nice to keep the odd nod to how it was. The new gutter has been treated so should last a good ten years or more.
I managed to salvage the old gutter which turned out to be massive once it was at ground level and it made a handy seasonal spot of bedding plants...(naturally this is not a photo from when the building work was going on but a time travel to 2014!)
Even so, it wasn't until the builders had gone home for the night and I'd jumped up on the scaffolding that I was relieved the roof wasn't so bad. The rot hadn't got too far and it was mainly the gable end that had also just rotted away and caused slates to slip and let in water.
In what would become a recurring theme, if it had been dealt with immediately, there wouldn't have been any major cost associated with it but as it had been left the purlins and timbers needed further attention.
Conservation insisted on a like for like so it was a replacement wood gable end an I got off lightly with some slates needing replacement and the roofline needing retiled.
The wooden gutter was shot to s
t too and as it was the only bit of wooden gutter left on the house, I again did it like for like.It does mean eventually it will need replacing again but it's nice to keep the odd nod to how it was. The new gutter has been treated so should last a good ten years or more.
I managed to salvage the old gutter which turned out to be massive once it was at ground level and it made a handy seasonal spot of bedding plants...(naturally this is not a photo from when the building work was going on but a time travel to 2014!)
Whats the local area for this? (don't need to specify exact street) Im just interested as it still seems super cheap, even compared to my home town of Hull.
When I was looking even in 2004 at Leeds, places were not this cheap unless near bradford... I ended up paying a lot more than you paid for this when I disappeared to London convinced I had missed the boat and finally joined the grown up world in 2007.
To give an example in 2004-2005 I was looking at a 1/2 bed flat in a chapel conversion in Thorner, that was £110-120k... thankfully I did not get that as the price now (looked last night) was only £115-125k for 12 years of ownership... I made that in one month alone in London.
When I was looking even in 2004 at Leeds, places were not this cheap unless near bradford... I ended up paying a lot more than you paid for this when I disappeared to London convinced I had missed the boat and finally joined the grown up world in 2007.
To give an example in 2004-2005 I was looking at a 1/2 bed flat in a chapel conversion in Thorner, that was £110-120k... thankfully I did not get that as the price now (looked last night) was only £115-125k for 12 years of ownership... I made that in one month alone in London.
It was sold for £249k in 2004 and the previous occupier got themselves into major difficulties with multiple charges on the house, repossession and finally bankruptcy.
It was a Northern Rock repo and they were just after shifting it as quickly as possible so it was a complete steal.
Don't get me wrong, it has needed a shed load of work and even though I've done most of it myself, I've probably spent about 70k on refurbishment so would have been a lot more paying someone labour.
It was a Northern Rock repo and they were just after shifting it as quickly as possible so it was a complete steal.
Don't get me wrong, it has needed a shed load of work and even though I've done most of it myself, I've probably spent about 70k on refurbishment so would have been a lot more paying someone labour.
This was the living room when I got the keys, with one of the few surviving original fireplaces in the house. As the central heating wasn't working, when I moved in, I did a smoke pellet and stick your head up test on the flue and then lit a fire to warm the place up.
It was about the time it was burning quite nicely that it occurred to me it would have been a good idea to get the water turned back on first, just in case.
In any event, the house didn't burn down and once I'd got the contents of my bachelor pad form down south in the living room, it felt a lot better.
This particular room is huge at about 18'ft square and the stuff from my old flat was clearly not up to the scale of the task
This is all probably giving you some kind of impression this was an orderly renovation but outside of this room, I'd decided it had to get worse before it got better...
It was about the time it was burning quite nicely that it occurred to me it would have been a good idea to get the water turned back on first, just in case.
In any event, the house didn't burn down and once I'd got the contents of my bachelor pad form down south in the living room, it felt a lot better.
This particular room is huge at about 18'ft square and the stuff from my old flat was clearly not up to the scale of the task
This is all probably giving you some kind of impression this was an orderly renovation but outside of this room, I'd decided it had to get worse before it got better...
At the same time as moving all my stuff in, I was busy trying to fix the core issues. I'd done the roof but a walk around outside had revealed the most likely cause of the damp in the house was the fact they'd backfilled the ventilation holes/windows in the cellar with earth and concreted/shaled up the ground outside so the air bricks were also half covered.
I set about digging out the soil from the top and chucking it in buckets to cart off to a pile round the back of the house.
this plan lasted all of about five minutes as somehow when digging out, I lost my balance and managed to pirouette on the shovel so my fat arse landed in the bucket, causing this to happen.
I then decided to just dig it out form the bottom and went into the cellar and took it our form there.
Soon I was finished on the other window too and left nature to take its cause drying out the cellar with fresh air circulating.
I set about digging out the soil from the top and chucking it in buckets to cart off to a pile round the back of the house.
this plan lasted all of about five minutes as somehow when digging out, I lost my balance and managed to pirouette on the shovel so my fat arse landed in the bucket, causing this to happen.
I then decided to just dig it out form the bottom and went into the cellar and took it our form there.
Soon I was finished on the other window too and left nature to take its cause drying out the cellar with fresh air circulating.
I was quite pleased the cellar seemed to be sorted and then it rained heavily for a day or so and I was greeted with this when I went to get something from downstairs.
The water was that clear and still when I went down there that I didn't realise it was there until I'd got both my slippers wet in the icy water. In hindsight, the red tray full of car parts floating around should have been a giveaway.
We have clay soil that can saturate and the cellar is low to the water table but it was a surprise to find it flooded. I didn't solve the problem immediately as speaking to my neighbour he said the cellar always used to flood in here so I just bought myself a submersible pump and cleared the cellar out that way.
For the next year or so, it flooded about twice more and the pump sorted it in a day or so each time so I put it down as a necessary but infrequent joy of ownership to trudge into to cellar when it was pissing it down and check if the pump was working.
The water was that clear and still when I went down there that I didn't realise it was there until I'd got both my slippers wet in the icy water. In hindsight, the red tray full of car parts floating around should have been a giveaway.
We have clay soil that can saturate and the cellar is low to the water table but it was a surprise to find it flooded. I didn't solve the problem immediately as speaking to my neighbour he said the cellar always used to flood in here so I just bought myself a submersible pump and cleared the cellar out that way.
For the next year or so, it flooded about twice more and the pump sorted it in a day or so each time so I put it down as a necessary but infrequent joy of ownership to trudge into to cellar when it was pissing it down and check if the pump was working.
Edited by stewjohnst on Friday 9th September 16:24
Shall bookmark this as you are in a very similar situation to myself.
As a 1st time buyer I bought a ridiculously big, neglected, grade 2 listed house for less than what a 3 bed semi in the midlands costs.
I have then spent the last 4 years finding/rectifying the bodges/neglect the house has suffered over the last 200 years. It has cost me way more than I'll ever see back and I still reckon I'm only 50% done in the last 4 years. But I will get there and it will be very special indeed when finished.
How far on do you reckon you are with yours now?
As a 1st time buyer I bought a ridiculously big, neglected, grade 2 listed house for less than what a 3 bed semi in the midlands costs.
I have then spent the last 4 years finding/rectifying the bodges/neglect the house has suffered over the last 200 years. It has cost me way more than I'll ever see back and I still reckon I'm only 50% done in the last 4 years. But I will get there and it will be very special indeed when finished.
How far on do you reckon you are with yours now?
KTF said:
Is it normal/expected for it to flood? What is the point of having it if you need to raise everything off the ground when there is prolonged rain?
Its absolutely not supposed to do that!When I was doing some further work outside a bit later (like a year or so) I discovered that the downpipe on the left rather unhelpfully drained into a broken and capped drain that meant 50% of all the rainwater from the roof was going under the house, leading to the groundwater coming up.
I have since rectified that and we never had a problem again form the rain/weather and it's the next thing on the list to get renovated so I can use it for its proper purpose - Storing wine and hiding from the missus.
Ug_lee said:
Shall bookmark this as you are in a very similar situation to myself.
As a 1st time buyer I bought a ridiculously big, neglected, grade 2 listed house for less than what a 3 bed semi in the midlands costs.
I have then spent the last 4 years finding/rectifying the bodges/neglect the house has suffered over the last 200 years. It has cost me way more than I'll ever see back and I still reckon I'm only 50% done in the last 4 years. But I will get there and it will be very special indeed when finished.
How far on do you reckon you are with yours now?
I'm about 80% done on ours, except that there's more than just me now so there are plans afoot for an extension and a few bits that will begin the cycle again As a 1st time buyer I bought a ridiculously big, neglected, grade 2 listed house for less than what a 3 bed semi in the midlands costs.
I have then spent the last 4 years finding/rectifying the bodges/neglect the house has suffered over the last 200 years. It has cost me way more than I'll ever see back and I still reckon I'm only 50% done in the last 4 years. But I will get there and it will be very special indeed when finished.
How far on do you reckon you are with yours now?
The other major problem with the house was the sheer volume of artex on every wall and ceiling. It was like they'd tried to make every room look like a different sort of meringue. I had toyed with getting it skimmed over but there was so much of it and it was laid on so thick that I decided to knock most of it off and start again.
The thinking here was that it would also give me chance to see the state of the plaster underneath and deal with any areas that were showing signs of damp, rot or any other such malady.
Given the age of the place and the predilection of previous generations to include asbestos with everything, I paid for an asbestos sample to be done in each room and when that was all clear, set about removing the artex.
There was one room where I tried a weird chemical treatment that was supposed to soften the artex so it would scrape off. It wasn't that effective and just made a load of blue goo so I sacked that off and bought an SDS hammer drill to get through the heavy work.
It was old lime plaster in most places and was coming off in massive thick lumps. I reckon I gained a few CM internal dimension for each room just by doing this...
It was about this time that I realised keeping all my tools tidy down in the cellar was a stupid idea when working upstairs so one of the bedrooms was turned into the control room for the build.
Each blue line on the wall separate a room and the post its were jobs for each room, mainly demolition it has to be said. I'm a design consultant by profession and naturally, I required a whiteboard to be able to think properly...
The thinking here was that it would also give me chance to see the state of the plaster underneath and deal with any areas that were showing signs of damp, rot or any other such malady.
Given the age of the place and the predilection of previous generations to include asbestos with everything, I paid for an asbestos sample to be done in each room and when that was all clear, set about removing the artex.
There was one room where I tried a weird chemical treatment that was supposed to soften the artex so it would scrape off. It wasn't that effective and just made a load of blue goo so I sacked that off and bought an SDS hammer drill to get through the heavy work.
It was old lime plaster in most places and was coming off in massive thick lumps. I reckon I gained a few CM internal dimension for each room just by doing this...
It was about this time that I realised keeping all my tools tidy down in the cellar was a stupid idea when working upstairs so one of the bedrooms was turned into the control room for the build.
Each blue line on the wall separate a room and the post its were jobs for each room, mainly demolition it has to be said. I'm a design consultant by profession and naturally, I required a whiteboard to be able to think properly...
Speaking to conservation, they were keen for me to use lath and lime plaster in the hallway again. I ordered job lot of lath and set about nailing all the walls up with new lath ready for the plaster to set to on them.
Fair play to my dad for mucking in (what else are retired parents for?)
As this point I'd like to point out how tricky lime is to work with. One week it was insanely hot weather and the plaster was drying too fast to cure, meaning I was having to spray it down with a bug sprayer filled with water twice a day to help it go off. Then the next week it was so cold and damp that the plaster wouldn't dry and go off either.
First coat of lime on
Fair play to my dad for mucking in (what else are retired parents for?)
As this point I'd like to point out how tricky lime is to work with. One week it was insanely hot weather and the plaster was drying too fast to cure, meaning I was having to spray it down with a bug sprayer filled with water twice a day to help it go off. Then the next week it was so cold and damp that the plaster wouldn't dry and go off either.
First coat of lime on
We tried to leave the ceiling laths in place as they were the original riven (split) oak laths but much to the dismay of my plasterers noggin when it collapsed on him, they weren't strong enough to hold the new plaster.
Before any lime expert jumps in, the ceiling plaster was using goats hair not horse hair, like the walls, but the laths were too old and just pulled down in a clump.
You might notice the beam in the photo above is now exposed.
When I moved in, the beam was covered over and artexed up so I ripped it all off to see what it looked like and I guess it was the fashion to box this stuff in but it seemed a waste of the character of the house to me.
Before
During
When the beam was clear, I gave it a good clean up and then used Tung Oil to bring out the natural colour of the beam.
It had been nailed into with lath and then covered so I took out the most dangerous nails but left some in so you could still read into the history of it being covered in the past.
Other jobs in the hallway included fitting a new radiator, wiring in some newer lights, whacking up pictures and old newspapers that link to the house plus a bit of upcycled furniture and a carpet...
As of today - it looks like this.
Before any lime expert jumps in, the ceiling plaster was using goats hair not horse hair, like the walls, but the laths were too old and just pulled down in a clump.
You might notice the beam in the photo above is now exposed.
When I moved in, the beam was covered over and artexed up so I ripped it all off to see what it looked like and I guess it was the fashion to box this stuff in but it seemed a waste of the character of the house to me.
Before
During
When the beam was clear, I gave it a good clean up and then used Tung Oil to bring out the natural colour of the beam.
It had been nailed into with lath and then covered so I took out the most dangerous nails but left some in so you could still read into the history of it being covered in the past.
Other jobs in the hallway included fitting a new radiator, wiring in some newer lights, whacking up pictures and old newspapers that link to the house plus a bit of upcycled furniture and a carpet...
As of today - it looks like this.
KTF said:
How did you decide the order of work? Did you basically gut everything and start from scratch, do the rooms that would be used the most first - bathroom, kitchen, lounge, etc - or just work on a floor by floor basis?
Exactly that.I went round the whole house and made a list of things that needed doing in every room. Had a punt on what they would cost and decided on priority.
Priority was
1. Secure the fabric of the building (roof/walls/damp)
2. Fix bathroom properly
3. Fix kitchen so it was usable
4. Destroy all artex
5. Sort my main bedroom
6. Sort my office
7. Fix up the aftermath of artex room by room based on funds and levels of energy.
I'm glad I did it that way in some respects as having all the jobs laid out for each room meant if my arms were shot after a weekend of plaster clearing and rubble sack carrying, I could always find a different job so I didn't get bored.
For about 8 months solid after the purchase, I was coming home from work at 6 and working nights till around midnight or after just doing demolition and refurb work so being able to change tasks (fitting skirting boards, painting, fitting lights, plumbing, etc) was a good thing.
I enjoy a challenge so having to learn something new all the time was good. I'd never plumbed before I did the bathroom and central heating, nor had I fitted a kitchen myself or any other number of jobs.
I also lost about three stone in weight!
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