Help identifying grandfather clock?
Discussion
dickymint said:
Ahh, all seems to match up. Prices are wildly different though, I've seen a couple listed at £7k, and one at £550 - could hardly tell the difference to my untrained eye!https://archive.org/stream/librarychronicle34univ/librarychronicle34univ_djvu.txt said:
Another reference in the Bury library states that he was in busi-
ness there from 1770-1785, and T. H. Hayhurst lists an entry in
the Middleton Parish Register stating that a Jonathan Lees was
buried there in 1785.^^ Further identification is not forthcoming.
His son Thomas carried on the business in Fleet Street, Bury,
after his father's death. His name appears in the directories of
Bury for 1818 and 1824 as a clockmaker. Cescinsky shows in his
work an illustration of a clock made by Thomas Lees in 1790, and
his comment on it is unfavorable.^^ His son, also Thomas, is
listed in the Bury Directory for 1850 as a clockmaker. Thus three
generations of the family are known to have remained in the
business.
ness there from 1770-1785, and T. H. Hayhurst lists an entry in
the Middleton Parish Register stating that a Jonathan Lees was
buried there in 1785.^^ Further identification is not forthcoming.
His son Thomas carried on the business in Fleet Street, Bury,
after his father's death. His name appears in the directories of
Bury for 1818 and 1824 as a clockmaker. Cescinsky shows in his
work an illustration of a clock made by Thomas Lees in 1790, and
his comment on it is unfavorable.^^ His son, also Thomas, is
listed in the Bury Directory for 1850 as a clockmaker. Thus three
generations of the family are known to have remained in the
business.
dickymint said:
I did similar a few years back - I found this site about the best to start at ......
http://www.clockmakersandrepairs.co.uk/page6.htm
Type of dial and it's decoration is the first giveaway.
Main thing is to see if it's a "bitsa" or not. The movement will almost certainly have the makers mark engraved on it.
Good luck and enjoy the journey it's fun
Interesting site. Looks like my clock is a lot older than I thought, 1710 to 1725!http://www.clockmakersandrepairs.co.uk/page6.htm
Type of dial and it's decoration is the first giveaway.
Main thing is to see if it's a "bitsa" or not. The movement will almost certainly have the makers mark engraved on it.
Good luck and enjoy the journey it's fun
eldar said:
dickymint said:
I did similar a few years back - I found this site about the best to start at ......
http://www.clockmakersandrepairs.co.uk/page6.htm
Type of dial and it's decoration is the first giveaway.
Main thing is to see if it's a "bitsa" or not. The movement will almost certainly have the makers mark engraved on it.
Good luck and enjoy the journey it's fun
Interesting site. Looks like my clock is a lot older than I thought, 1710 to 1725!http://www.clockmakersandrepairs.co.uk/page6.htm
Type of dial and it's decoration is the first giveaway.
Main thing is to see if it's a "bitsa" or not. The movement will almost certainly have the makers mark engraved on it.
Good luck and enjoy the journey it's fun
clockworks said:
I've repaired plenty of English longcase clocks. Never seen a maker's mark or name on the movement. Quite likely to be some repairers marks though. There will probably be a maker's name on the falseplate (the iron plate between the dial and the movement), but most were made in a few factories in the Birmingham area.
The majority of white dial longcase clocks were assembled and finished by the clockmaker, using a kit of parts bought from a factory. Dials were bought in too, although the painted decoration may have been added locally.
Cases were usually made to order by a cabinet maker, the clockmaker just cutting the cheeks and seatboard to fit the movement and dial.
The clockmaker had very little input on these late longcase clocks. Quite different to earlier clocks, where many parts were made in-house, by hand or with rudimentary machines.
Still nice objects though, and worth saving. If it needs work, find a one man band clock repairer to take care of the mechanical parts, and a furniture restorer/cabinet maker to do the case. Very easy to pay through the nose in some places. If it's working and keeping good time, and the case is solid, I'd leave it alone. If it's at all dirty, don't be tempted to oil it.
Oops! The majority of white dial longcase clocks were assembled and finished by the clockmaker, using a kit of parts bought from a factory. Dials were bought in too, although the painted decoration may have been added locally.
Cases were usually made to order by a cabinet maker, the clockmaker just cutting the cheeks and seatboard to fit the movement and dial.
The clockmaker had very little input on these late longcase clocks. Quite different to earlier clocks, where many parts were made in-house, by hand or with rudimentary machines.
Still nice objects though, and worth saving. If it needs work, find a one man band clock repairer to take care of the mechanical parts, and a furniture restorer/cabinet maker to do the case. Very easy to pay through the nose in some places. If it's working and keeping good time, and the case is solid, I'd leave it alone. If it's at all dirty, don't be tempted to oil it.
I bought a house in 1977 and it came with a long case clock that had been given as a retirement gift to the previous owner of the house back in the 1930s. It is a weight driven striking/chiming movement with choice of Whittington or Westminster chimes, a wooden shaft pendulum and glass door on the body. It looks mass produced and has a 1930s quality to the case. It wasn't running when we moved in so I gave it a dose of WD40 which did the trick. The trick carried on working without further application until about thirty years later when it began to gain increasingly. After a while it stopped and would no longer run for long, and more WD40 didn't sort it sadly. A local firm has quoted £380 to service it plus any unusual worn parts. 'Usual' parts are included apparently. I was once told it might be Smiths Industries made but there's no maker's marks at all. It remains unrepaired currently, but I am intending to have it done. The tame fixer near where it was when we bought the house (Beaconsfield) has since died so am stuck with a bloke near Stokenchurch - an unknown quantity.
motco said:
Oops!
I bought a house in 1977 and it came with a long case clock that had been given as a retirement gift to the previous owner of the house back in the 1930s. It is a weight driven striking/chiming movement with choice of Whittington or Westminster chimes, a wooden shaft pendulum and glass door on the body. It looks mass produced and has a 1930s quality to the case. It wasn't running when we moved in so I gave it a dose of WD40 which did the trick. The trick carried on working without further application until about thirty years later when it began to gain increasingly. After a while it stopped and would no longer run for long, and more WD40 didn't sort it sadly. A local firm has quoted £380 to service it plus any unusual worn parts. 'Usual' parts are included apparently. I was once told it might be Smiths Industries made but there's no maker's marks at all. It remains unrepaired currently, but I am intending to have it done. The tame fixer near where it was when we bought the house (Beaconsfield) has since died so am stuck with a bloke near Stokenchurch - an unknown quantity.
Before you spend money - have you moved it? If so did you level it?I bought a house in 1977 and it came with a long case clock that had been given as a retirement gift to the previous owner of the house back in the 1930s. It is a weight driven striking/chiming movement with choice of Whittington or Westminster chimes, a wooden shaft pendulum and glass door on the body. It looks mass produced and has a 1930s quality to the case. It wasn't running when we moved in so I gave it a dose of WD40 which did the trick. The trick carried on working without further application until about thirty years later when it began to gain increasingly. After a while it stopped and would no longer run for long, and more WD40 didn't sort it sadly. A local firm has quoted £380 to service it plus any unusual worn parts. 'Usual' parts are included apparently. I was once told it might be Smiths Industries made but there's no maker's marks at all. It remains unrepaired currently, but I am intending to have it done. The tame fixer near where it was when we bought the house (Beaconsfield) has since died so am stuck with a bloke near Stokenchurch - an unknown quantity.
When I say level it I don't mean the case but the actual movement as there can be a big difference.
This may seem daft but does the tick equal the Tok?
Don't know what sort of movement you have escapement wise but I'll try and find the link to very useful site that explains better than I can.
dickymint said:
motco said:
Oops!
I bought a house in 1977 and it came with a long case clock that had been given as a retirement gift to the previous owner of the house back in the 1930s. It is a weight driven striking/chiming movement with choice of Whittington or Westminster chimes, a wooden shaft pendulum and glass door on the body. It looks mass produced and has a 1930s quality to the case. It wasn't running when we moved in so I gave it a dose of WD40 which did the trick. The trick carried on working without further application until about thirty years later when it began to gain increasingly. After a while it stopped and would no longer run for long, and more WD40 didn't sort it sadly. A local firm has quoted £380 to service it plus any unusual worn parts. 'Usual' parts are included apparently. I was once told it might be Smiths Industries made but there's no maker's marks at all. It remains unrepaired currently, but I am intending to have it done. The tame fixer near where it was when we bought the house (Beaconsfield) has since died so am stuck with a bloke near Stokenchurch - an unknown quantity.
Before you spend money - have you moved it? If so did you level it?I bought a house in 1977 and it came with a long case clock that had been given as a retirement gift to the previous owner of the house back in the 1930s. It is a weight driven striking/chiming movement with choice of Whittington or Westminster chimes, a wooden shaft pendulum and glass door on the body. It looks mass produced and has a 1930s quality to the case. It wasn't running when we moved in so I gave it a dose of WD40 which did the trick. The trick carried on working without further application until about thirty years later when it began to gain increasingly. After a while it stopped and would no longer run for long, and more WD40 didn't sort it sadly. A local firm has quoted £380 to service it plus any unusual worn parts. 'Usual' parts are included apparently. I was once told it might be Smiths Industries made but there's no maker's marks at all. It remains unrepaired currently, but I am intending to have it done. The tame fixer near where it was when we bought the house (Beaconsfield) has since died so am stuck with a bloke near Stokenchurch - an unknown quantity.
When I say level it I don't mean the case but the actual movement as there can be a big difference.
This may seem daft but does the tick equal the Tok?
Don't know what sort of movement you have escapement wise but I'll try and find the link to very useful site that explains better than I can.
motco said:
Oops!
I bought a house in 1977 and it came with a long case clock that had been given as a retirement gift to the previous owner of the house back in the 1930s. It is a weight driven striking/chiming movement with choice of Whittington or Westminster chimes, a wooden shaft pendulum and glass door on the body. It looks mass produced and has a 1930s quality to the case. It wasn't running when we moved in so I gave it a dose of WD40 which did the trick. The trick carried on working without further application until about thirty years later when it began to gain increasingly. After a while it stopped and would no longer run for long, and more WD40 didn't sort it sadly. A local firm has quoted £380 to service it plus any unusual worn parts. 'Usual' parts are included apparently. I was once told it might be Smiths Industries made but there's no maker's marks at all. It remains unrepaired currently, but I am intending to have it done. The tame fixer near where it was when we bought the house (Beaconsfield) has since died so am stuck with a bloke near Stokenchurch - an unknown quantity.
Most of the 3 train weight driven 1930's "longcase" clocks that I've come across have been German, with no maker's name on the dial, just "foreign" in very small print. The rear plate is normally marked though. German stuff didn't sell well here between the wars, do they didn't advertise the fact. I don't think I've come across an English clock from that era that didn't have a name on the dial.I bought a house in 1977 and it came with a long case clock that had been given as a retirement gift to the previous owner of the house back in the 1930s. It is a weight driven striking/chiming movement with choice of Whittington or Westminster chimes, a wooden shaft pendulum and glass door on the body. It looks mass produced and has a 1930s quality to the case. It wasn't running when we moved in so I gave it a dose of WD40 which did the trick. The trick carried on working without further application until about thirty years later when it began to gain increasingly. After a while it stopped and would no longer run for long, and more WD40 didn't sort it sadly. A local firm has quoted £380 to service it plus any unusual worn parts. 'Usual' parts are included apparently. I was once told it might be Smiths Industries made but there's no maker's marks at all. It remains unrepaired currently, but I am intending to have it done. The tame fixer near where it was when we bought the house (Beaconsfield) has since died so am stuck with a bloke near Stokenchurch - an unknown quantity.
£380 for a service is a bit high, even for the Home Counties. I do them for less than £150, including local delivery and set up
clockworks said:
Most of the 3 train weight driven 1930's "longcase" clocks that I've come across have been German, with no maker's name on the dial, just "foreign" in very small print. The rear plate is normally marked though. German stuff didn't sell well here between the wars, do they didn't advertise the fact. I don't think I've come across an English clock from that era that didn't have a name on the dial.
£380 for a service is a bit high, even for the Home Counties. I do them for less than £150, including local delivery and set up
£380 for a service is a bit high, even for the Home Counties. I do them for less than £150, including local delivery and set up
Clockworks - I've an Edward Bilbie (of Chew Stoke) that I did get working a few years back until the pendulum fell off! It was a gift to my Dad from my Uncle (both passed on) so of obvious sentimental to me now. I'm pretty sure my Uncle 'bodged' it together as best He could as He was good at that. From memory it never chimed and the date never worked (no problem really).
To get it running I think it just needs the suspension arm fixed and possibly a new crutch (as I bent the hell out of it to set it up).
If I post it down to you (not the case
) would you be interested? Cash, beers and a good resto thread Here's what I do when I service an antique English 8 day longcase:
Customer brings everything but the trunk and hood to me
Visual check that no parts are missing or beyond repair
Remove hands, dial, lines/pulleys, seatboard, bell, back cock/pallet arbour.
Check both trains run
Strip
Check rack tail and pallets, repair as required
True and polish pivots
Bush holes as required
Ultrasonic clean
Reassemble, set strike train timing, and lube.
Fit new lines
Replace suspension spring if required
Test bare movement for a week
Fit dial and hands, test for a week
Deliver to customer and set up (free up to 15 miles)
Standard price of £150 includes consumables (lines, bushes, suspension) and minor repairs such as loose rack tail, pallet refacing, new centre rear pivot, etc.
Any other parts are charged at cost. Generic parts are available at reasonable prices, but getting wheels or pinions cut is expensive.
9 times out of 10, no extra parts or major repairs are needed, so the standard £150 covers it.
I can also polish and resilver brass dials for £100
I don't do woodwork, but I know a very good cabinet maker
I don't repaint white dials, and don't know anyone locally who can
I can repair just about any type of clock, except mains electric, cheap alarms (balance wheels with cone and cup pivots), and those Swiza things that are basically pocket watches ( too small for me to see what I am doing)
Customer brings everything but the trunk and hood to me
Visual check that no parts are missing or beyond repair
Remove hands, dial, lines/pulleys, seatboard, bell, back cock/pallet arbour.
Check both trains run
Strip
Check rack tail and pallets, repair as required
True and polish pivots
Bush holes as required
Ultrasonic clean
Reassemble, set strike train timing, and lube.
Fit new lines
Replace suspension spring if required
Test bare movement for a week
Fit dial and hands, test for a week
Deliver to customer and set up (free up to 15 miles)
Standard price of £150 includes consumables (lines, bushes, suspension) and minor repairs such as loose rack tail, pallet refacing, new centre rear pivot, etc.
Any other parts are charged at cost. Generic parts are available at reasonable prices, but getting wheels or pinions cut is expensive.
9 times out of 10, no extra parts or major repairs are needed, so the standard £150 covers it.
I can also polish and resilver brass dials for £100
I don't do woodwork, but I know a very good cabinet maker
I don't repaint white dials, and don't know anyone locally who can
I can repair just about any type of clock, except mains electric, cheap alarms (balance wheels with cone and cup pivots), and those Swiza things that are basically pocket watches ( too small for me to see what I am doing)
dickymint said:
Cornwall?
Mines a single chain 3 day movement. I'll dig out or take a few photos over the weekend.
Yes, I'm in Cornwall. I've never sent anything as heavy as a longcase by courier, I figured that it would be expensive.Mines a single chain 3 day movement. I'll dig out or take a few photos over the weekend.
Photos would be good. When you say "3 day movement", that makes me think that the strike has been disabled to increase the run time from the original 30 hours. I've done this for a few customers, by wiring up the lifting piece. Some people do it by removing (and losing) parts....
You're correct Clockman. Can't remember if my old man wanted it to run for longer or if the chime got on his nerves but it's certainly been 'disabled' on purpose.
The chime mechanism does work if tripped manually but I do suspect a part or two are missing.
I'm more than happy to let you work your magic on it so if your happy I'd like to start a new thread on the watch forum at some stage?
Here's a couple of pics to go on with........
PS apologies to Mattman for the thread hijack
The chime mechanism does work if tripped manually but I do suspect a part or two are missing.
I'm more than happy to let you work your magic on it so if your happy I'd like to start a new thread on the watch forum at some stage?
Here's a couple of pics to go on with........
PS apologies to Mattman for the thread hijack
C Lee Farquar said:
I lived in Chew Stoke for a few years and never knew there had been a clock maker from there.
It looks great BTW, What sort of budget is required for his clocks?
There's been a few of them ......It looks great BTW, What sort of budget is required for his clocks?
https://drive.google.com/drive/mobile/folders/0B2D...
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