Fitted Air conditioning
Discussion
Sorry, no - we have been able to hide the units in a side alley. D you have a small flat roof where you could install and then screen them? I get the rooms at the front of the house could be a pig to do.
Can you consider the one-box units above as a last resort?
More advice - anyone do a step by step for connecting an R290 (propane) split unit? It is pre-gassed. Do I need a vacuum pump? if so, will a cheap ebat special do?
And what is the actual process here...? I found the manual below, but it talks about parts without labelling them. I don't want to lose all the gas and then have to pay someone to come out and re-gas it. Or point me toa youtube video by someone competent.
Manual is below. Gives instructions, but I would like some idiot proof ones...
https://www.appliancesdirect.co.uk/files/pdf/Elect...
Can you consider the one-box units above as a last resort?
More advice - anyone do a step by step for connecting an R290 (propane) split unit? It is pre-gassed. Do I need a vacuum pump? if so, will a cheap ebat special do?
And what is the actual process here...? I found the manual below, but it talks about parts without labelling them. I don't want to lose all the gas and then have to pay someone to come out and re-gas it. Or point me toa youtube video by someone competent.
Manual is below. Gives instructions, but I would like some idiot proof ones...
https://www.appliancesdirect.co.uk/files/pdf/Elect...
Edited by Harry Flashman on Friday 18th June 12:35
Bought a cheap standalone unit for my home office and love it, planning to get split units installed over the winter.
Ideally I'd like it in 3 rooms on one side of the house and 2 on the other. There is an ideal spot for an external unit on the 3 room side - is it better/possible to have one big unit and two long pipes (~20m) or have two separate systems for each side of the house?
Ideally I'd like it in 3 rooms on one side of the house and 2 on the other. There is an ideal spot for an external unit on the 3 room side - is it better/possible to have one big unit and two long pipes (~20m) or have two separate systems for each side of the house?
Finally had an engineer out today to investigate our two LG units we inherited when we bought the house. One of the units turns on, cools for 5 minutes then condenser turns off. The other unit is based on R22 gas and the condenser doesn't turn on!
We are having some repointing work done at the moment so I'm going to remove the LG units, let the guys repoint the wall then thinking of installing the electriQ dual units.
Will I need an electrician to wire in the ElectriQ units?
We are having some repointing work done at the moment so I'm going to remove the LG units, let the guys repoint the wall then thinking of installing the electriQ dual units.
Will I need an electrician to wire in the ElectriQ units?
Harry Flashman said:
More advice - anyone do a step by step for connecting an R290 (propane) split unit? It is pre-gassed. Do I need a vacuum pump? if so, will a cheap ebat special do?
And what is the actual process here...? I found the manual below, but it talks about parts without labelling them. I don't want to lose all the gas and then have to pay someone to come out and re-gas it. Or point me toa youtube video by someone competent.
Manual is below. Gives instructions, but I would like some idiot proof ones...
https://www.appliancesdirect.co.uk/files/pdf/Elect...
No vacuum pump required - although it's mentioned in the manual, the R290 units are very obviously set up for DIY. Some have a little purge valve with an allen key (like an oil boiler bleed valve, if you've ever had one of those), some don't - but there is no real need for purging the lines - there is more than enough refrigerant and the amount of air likely to be in the lines after connection is so small that you won't lose any noticeable cooling power. There were scare stories in the news spread by BESA about air in the lines creating an explosive mixture - complete rubbish, you have so much more propane in the lines than air that you couldn't reach the HEL for propane in air if you tried - you would be an order of magnitude above it.And what is the actual process here...? I found the manual below, but it talks about parts without labelling them. I don't want to lose all the gas and then have to pay someone to come out and re-gas it. Or point me toa youtube video by someone competent.
Manual is below. Gives instructions, but I would like some idiot proof ones...
https://www.appliancesdirect.co.uk/files/pdf/Elect...
Likewise there were more scare stories about propane leaking and creating an explosive mix in the room - that's why the units have a "suitable for rooms between" marking, to make sure there is not enough propane in the unit that even if it ALL leaked out, you would never reach the LEL for propane in air. I wouldn't fit a massive capacity unit in an unventilated basement, but other than that really wouldn't worry - most of us have deadly methane gas piped directly into our homes and are more than happy to have it. And also have a look at the R1234yf scare stories from 2014. - it is flammable and releases some very evil chemicals on burning, but if your car is post 2017 chances are that's what it uses. https://www.labnews.co.uk/article/2026999/refriger...
Thanks for listening to my TED talk.
Back to A/C. Ignore the torque wrench advice, if you have ever connected a copper pipe you'll know that you can "feel" when it is nipped up tight enough - refrigerant lines are generally flared rather than fitted with olives but the same applies. Tighten them up past "I could undo this with my bare hands" and stop before "this is about to round off" and you'll be fine for your initial install.
Assuming you aren't bothering to vacuum the lines down, you can bleed the refrigerant either by loosening the bleed valve if fitted, or loosening off one of your flared pipes - you don't need to, but if you feel you must - slacken it until you hear a hiss, and keep smelling the gas coming out. Air smells like air, R290 will either smell like normal propane gas (I suspect a lot of the Chinese cheap units are just filled with plain old propane, and to complicate thing further some refrigerant manufacturers say they add an odorant to their R290 - I suspect these are the same ones selling plain propane as R290 to achieve a suitable mark-up), or it will be odorless but "feel" different when you smell it, if you know what I mean. Sort of hard to explain, but you will know when it is coming through, and when it does then you can nip up your connection again or close your bleed valve.
Then just check all connections for leaks - if you have leak detection spray on hand then that will do it (it's only about £3 a can), if not then use water with plenty of Fairy liquid in it. Any bubbles at the joints - nip them up until bubbles cease. You probably won't have any bubbles if you have tightened them up - don't worry, bubbles are not compulsory.
That's an overly wordy and probably useless guide, but memorize it anyway because I wrote it, so it is just great all round.
QuartzDad said:
Bought a cheap standalone unit for my home office and love it, planning to get split units installed over the winter.
Ideally I'd like it in 3 rooms on one side of the house and 2 on the other. There is an ideal spot for an external unit on the 3 room side - is it better/possible to have one big unit and two long pipes (~20m) or have two separate systems for each side of the house?
Yes, you can go with a multi-split - but check the specs for maximum pipe length (normally 15 or 20 metres), as well as maximum pipe lift if that applies - some units will just need a bit more gas added at commissioning (from the way you worded it I assume you are using an F-gas installer?), some will have a maximum beyond which they will not guarantee they will work. They normally do work beyond that, a metre or two over won't kill anything but don't go running 100m of pipe to the end of the garden.Ideally I'd like it in 3 rooms on one side of the house and 2 on the other. There is an ideal spot for an external unit on the 3 room side - is it better/possible to have one big unit and two long pipes (~20m) or have two separate systems for each side of the house?
One other thing worth mentioning - a 5 unit split will mean you are limited to the high-end manufacturers. If that's what you were going to go for anyway then no problem, but if you want to go for lower end stuff then 4 units is really the maximum available. So you might want to go for a double at one side of the house and a triple at the other. Up to you!
Also don't forget your condensates - if you need them to go up before they go down then get a BlueDiamond one and mount it remotely, condensate pumps built into or next to indoor units are annoying because they kick on and off at their leisure.
Stupeo said:
Finally had an engineer out today to investigate our two LG units we inherited when we bought the house. One of the units turns on, cools for 5 minutes then condenser turns off. The other unit is based on R22 gas and the condenser doesn't turn on!
We are having some repointing work done at the moment so I'm going to remove the LG units, let the guys repoint the wall then thinking of installing the electriQ dual units.
Will I need an electrician to wire in the ElectriQ units?
Most ElectriQ units take their power from a socket inside, in which case you can either just use an existing socket or take a spur off that and wire the indoor unit to it - no need for a spark in either case. Unless you are terrible with electrics, if so it might be wise to get someone in.We are having some repointing work done at the moment so I'm going to remove the LG units, let the guys repoint the wall then thinking of installing the electriQ dual units.
Will I need an electrician to wire in the ElectriQ units?
Other units take their power from outside - you might already have power out there from the LG units in which case it's sensible to fit an isolator if there isn't one there at the minute, then connect up to your new units. If no power outside and you need it out there, go out through the back of a socket near by, take your cable to the unit and fit an isolator at the same time.
Whether you need a spark in those cases? Up to your skill/knowledge level. I'll probably be attacked by sparks from all directions for even suggesting you do that yourself - but it's a small power draw for a single unit and not a complicated exercise if you have a clue about electrics.
Buprenorphine chic said:
No vacuum pump required - although it's mentioned in the manual, the R290 units are very obviously set up for DIY. Some have a little purge valve with an allen key (like an oil boiler bleed valve, if you've ever had one of those), some don't - but there is no real need for purging the lines - there is more than enough refrigerant and the amount of air likely to be in the lines after connection is so small that you won't lose any noticeable cooling power. There were scare stories in the news spread by BESA about air in the lines creating an explosive mixture - complete rubbish, you have so much more propane in the lines than air that you couldn't reach the HEL for propane in air if you tried - you would be an order of magnitude above it.
Likewise there were more scare stories about propane leaking and creating an explosive mix in the room - that's why the units have a "suitable for rooms between" marking, to make sure there is not enough propane in the unit that even if it ALL leaked out, you would never reach the LEL for propane in air. I wouldn't fit a massive capacity unit in an unventilated basement, but other than that really wouldn't worry - most of us have deadly methane gas piped directly into our homes and are more than happy to have it. And also have a look at the R1234yf scare stories from 2014. - it is flammable and releases some very evil chemicals on burning, but if your car is post 2017 chances are that's what it uses. https://www.labnews.co.uk/article/2026999/refriger...
Thanks for listening to my TED talk.
Back to A/C. Ignore the torque wrench advice, if you have ever connected a copper pipe you'll know that you can "feel" when it is nipped up tight enough - refrigerant lines are generally flared rather than fitted with olives but the same applies. Tighten them up past "I could undo this with my bare hands" and stop before "this is about to round off" and you'll be fine for your initial install.
Assuming you aren't bothering to vacuum the lines down, you can bleed the refrigerant either by loosening the bleed valve if fitted, or loosening off one of your flared pipes - you don't need to, but if you feel you must - slacken it until you hear a hiss, and keep smelling the gas coming out. Air smells like air, R290 will either smell like normal propane gas (I suspect a lot of the Chinese cheap units are just filled with plain old propane, and to complicate thing further some refrigerant manufacturers say they add an odorant to their R290 - I suspect these are the same ones selling plain propane as R290 to achieve a suitable mark-up), or it will be odorless but "feel" different when you smell it, if you know what I mean. Sort of hard to explain, but you will know when it is coming through, and when it does then you can nip up your connection again or close your bleed valve.
Then just check all connections for leaks - if you have leak detection spray on hand then that will do it (it's only about £3 a can), if not then use water with plenty of Fairy liquid in it. Any bubbles at the joints - nip them up until bubbles cease. You probably won't have any bubbles if you have tightened them up - don't worry, bubbles are not compulsory.
That's an overly wordy and probably useless guide, but memorize it anyway because I wrote it, so it is just great all round.
So helpful, thank you!Likewise there were more scare stories about propane leaking and creating an explosive mix in the room - that's why the units have a "suitable for rooms between" marking, to make sure there is not enough propane in the unit that even if it ALL leaked out, you would never reach the LEL for propane in air. I wouldn't fit a massive capacity unit in an unventilated basement, but other than that really wouldn't worry - most of us have deadly methane gas piped directly into our homes and are more than happy to have it. And also have a look at the R1234yf scare stories from 2014. - it is flammable and releases some very evil chemicals on burning, but if your car is post 2017 chances are that's what it uses. https://www.labnews.co.uk/article/2026999/refriger...
Thanks for listening to my TED talk.
Back to A/C. Ignore the torque wrench advice, if you have ever connected a copper pipe you'll know that you can "feel" when it is nipped up tight enough - refrigerant lines are generally flared rather than fitted with olives but the same applies. Tighten them up past "I could undo this with my bare hands" and stop before "this is about to round off" and you'll be fine for your initial install.
Assuming you aren't bothering to vacuum the lines down, you can bleed the refrigerant either by loosening the bleed valve if fitted, or loosening off one of your flared pipes - you don't need to, but if you feel you must - slacken it until you hear a hiss, and keep smelling the gas coming out. Air smells like air, R290 will either smell like normal propane gas (I suspect a lot of the Chinese cheap units are just filled with plain old propane, and to complicate thing further some refrigerant manufacturers say they add an odorant to their R290 - I suspect these are the same ones selling plain propane as R290 to achieve a suitable mark-up), or it will be odorless but "feel" different when you smell it, if you know what I mean. Sort of hard to explain, but you will know when it is coming through, and when it does then you can nip up your connection again or close your bleed valve.
Then just check all connections for leaks - if you have leak detection spray on hand then that will do it (it's only about £3 a can), if not then use water with plenty of Fairy liquid in it. Any bubbles at the joints - nip them up until bubbles cease. You probably won't have any bubbles if you have tightened them up - don't worry, bubbles are not compulsory.
That's an overly wordy and probably useless guide, but memorize it anyway because I wrote it, so it is just great all round.
Virtual beer is yours, with a real one on offer if you pass through SW2.
Buprenorphine chic said:
Most ElectriQ units take their power from a socket inside, in which case you can either just use an existing socket or take a spur off that and wire the indoor unit to it - no need for a spark in either case. Unless you are terrible with electrics, if so it might be wise to get someone in.
Other units take their power from outside - you might already have power out there from the LG units in which case it's sensible to fit an isolator if there isn't one there at the minute, then connect up to your new units. If no power outside and you need it out there, go out through the back of a socket near by, take your cable to the unit and fit an isolator at the same time.
Whether you need a spark in those cases? Up to your skill/knowledge level. I'll probably be attacked by sparks from all directions for even suggesting you do that yourself - but it's a small power draw for a single unit and not a complicated exercise if you have a clue about electrics.
Cool, ta. Actually removed the old LG units today so found the isolator outside, which is good news. Other units take their power from outside - you might already have power out there from the LG units in which case it's sensible to fit an isolator if there isn't one there at the minute, then connect up to your new units. If no power outside and you need it out there, go out through the back of a socket near by, take your cable to the unit and fit an isolator at the same time.
Whether you need a spark in those cases? Up to your skill/knowledge level. I'll probably be attacked by sparks from all directions for even suggesting you do that yourself - but it's a small power draw for a single unit and not a complicated exercise if you have a clue about electrics.
T5GRF said:
Could I check if a 3kw split aircon system would be sufficient to cool a 30sq meter room?
I wouldn’t think it would cope well at all. It will reduce the temps yes, but sufficiently and down to a comfortable level in a reasonable time frame… highly doubt it. I have a 9kw system in my 30sqm summer house, granted it gets far hotter than my house does , but it still puts some work in to get down to 17 degrees. There’s no ways a 3kw would have done it. I have 9kw units in the upstairs bedrooms too and they cope well.
T5GRF said:
Could I check if a 3kw split aircon system would be sufficient to cool a 30sq meter room?
One works OK in my kitchen, which is 40m2. As others have said, depends on other factors.We're I to do it again, I would go more powerful as cooling this room well in really hot weather means running it all day and starting nice and early. If you let the room get to 30 degrees and then starts cooking, will take a while to cool it down.
Thanks for the replies. The room is a timber built garden room, epdm roof, multi foil insulation, wood cladding with a plasterboard/plastered finish. It’s got a 3 meter bifold and 2 x 600 full height windows with internal blinds. It’s south west facing but gets a fair bit of shade from some large trees.
It seems worth the upgrade to a 5kw system - the room installer offers a 3kw system as standard.
It seems worth the upgrade to a 5kw system - the room installer offers a 3kw system as standard.
That's some potentially huge solar gain. Might be worth getting someone with Hevacomp or IES VE to do some calcs for you with roof/wall makeup etc. Wouldn't take too long to get a rough idea, or even to establish where you want your indoor unit - cooling the whole room or blowing cool air towards a particular area.
fastbikes76 said:
I wouldn’t think it would cope well at all. It will reduce the temps yes, but sufficiently and down to a comfortable level in a reasonable time frame… highly doubt it.
I have a 9kw system in my 30sqm summer house, granted it gets far hotter than my house does , but it still puts some work in to get down to 17 degrees. There’s no ways a 3kw would have done it. I have 9kw units in the upstairs bedrooms too and they cope well.
9kw or 9000BTU? 9kw seems an awful lot for a bedroom, unless it’s huge! I have a 9kw system in my 30sqm summer house, granted it gets far hotter than my house does , but it still puts some work in to get down to 17 degrees. There’s no ways a 3kw would have done it. I have 9kw units in the upstairs bedrooms too and they cope well.
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