Drayton Wiser heating app question

[B'stard Child]

Useful thread thanks akk

[London1986]

juggsy said:

It’s better to think about it in rooms rather than TRVs. For example, we have a garden room which has 2 rads with wiser TRVs and a room stat. Both TRVs and the room stat are allocated to garden room, which means the room stat is the primary sensor to call for heat, and when below temp both TRVs on the rads will open.

Apologies resurrecting an old thread but why would you do this?

If you have the room stat which is the primary sensor, isn't it a waste of money to also have the two wiser TRVs as you already have a heating zone and these will be ignored in favour of the wiser room stat?

I am new to the wiser system and still learning so forgive any stupid questions, just curious to know what benefit you would get from your setup that you wouldn't get from having dumb TRVs or even none at all.

[B'stard Child]

London1986 said:

juggsy said:

It’s better to think about it in rooms rather than TRVs. For example, we have a garden room which has 2 rads with wiser TRVs and a room stat. Both TRVs and the room stat are allocated to garden room, which means the room stat is the primary sensor to call for heat, and when below temp both TRVs on the rads will open.

Apologies resurrecting an old thread but why would you do this?

If you have the room stat which is the primary sensor, isn't it a waste of money to also have the two wiser TRVs as you already have a heating zone and these will be ignored in favour of the wiser room stat?

I am new to the wiser system and still learning so forgive any stupid questions, just curious to know what benefit you would get from your setup that you wouldn't get from having dumb TRVs or even none at all.

OK I'll see if I can explain as it's very similar to one of my rooms - big room with a single very large rad one end - gets a lot of solar gain due to french doors if I let the Smart TRV control the room temp it never reaches target temp - so I use a Wiser room stat to control the TRV at the middle of the room,

Big room 2 rads each with wiser smart TRV's - well placed "Wiser Room stat" can control the both TRV's (they no longer have independant control) - the room stat is just a room stat for that room and does not turn off the CH if other rooms (smart TRV's) are still calling for heat

Same situation but with dumb TRV's and a well placed "Wiser room stat" room gets to temp what does the stat do - it has no control of dumb TRV's so cannot control the temp of that room - should it turn the heating off??

[AW10]

London1986 said:

Apologies resurrecting an old thread but why would you do this?

If you have the room stat which is the primary sensor, isn't it a waste of money to also have the two wiser TRVs as you already have a heating zone and these will be ignored in favour of the wiser room stat?

I am new to the wiser system and still learning so forgive any stupid questions, just curious to know what benefit you would get from your setup that you wouldn't get from having dumb TRVs or even none at all.

To answer your question in a different way - it's only the smart TRVs that separate each room into a sort of zone. They are what control an individual room getting heat (or not).

[London1986]

B'stard Child said:

OK I'll see if I can explain as it's very similar to one of my rooms - big room with a single very large rad one end - gets a lot of solar gain due to french doors if I let the Smart TRV control the room temp it never reaches target temp - so I use a Wiser room stat to control the TRV at the middle of the room,

Big room 2 rads each with wiser smart TRV's - well placed "Wiser Room stat" can control the both TRV's (they no longer have independant control) - the room stat is just a room stat for that room and does not turn off the CH if other rooms (smart TRV's) are still calling for heat

Same situation but with dumb TRV's and a well placed "Wiser room stat" room gets to temp what does the stat do - it has no control of dumb TRV's so cannot control the temp of that room - should it turn the heating off??

Thanks for clarifying.

I've done a more reading and it seems i've falling into the common trap of thinking that if you have a room stat, you don't need smart TRVs. Looks like I need to get a few more wiser TRVs!

[juggsy]

London1986 said:

Thanks for clarifying.

I've done a more reading and it seems i've falling into the common trap of thinking that if you have a room stat, you don't need smart TRVs. Looks like I need to get a few more wiser TRVs!

Exactly this. Without the smart TRVs, there is no control on whether the rads heat up or not based on the temp of that room. The rads will heat up whenever there is a call for heat from any other device/TRV/thermostat.

There’s a decision on whether you need a room stat on top of the TRVs as technically the TRVs provide this function, . However as has been discussed throughout the thread, the TRVs alone are not all that accurate, so for key rooms in the house it’s helpful to have a separate room stat for better accuracy and control.

[London1986]

juggsy said:

Exactly this. Without the smart TRVs, there is no control on whether the rads heat up or not based on the temp of that room. The rads will heat up whenever there is a call for heat from any other device/TRV/thermostat.

Yeah. I thought it's fine that they heat up whenever there is a call for heat from other rads as that will always happen throughout the day so it won't be an issue.

However I didn't account for the fact that the living room was constantly being heated, even when the room was already at the desired temperature, there was no way to turn it off! So heating up the bedrooms at night would also be heating the living room which is not what you want when you get a system like this.

juggsy said:

There’s a decision on whether you need a room stat on top of the TRVs as technically the TRVs provide this function, . However as has been discussed throughout the thread, the TRVs alone are not all that accurate, so for key rooms in the house it’s helpful to have a separate room stat for better accuracy and control.

Yes accuracy is one thing, but also it helps with inconstancy. I believe you do need a room stat if you have multiple TRVs in that room as the room stat acts as the source of truth for the temp. The TRVs may have varying temperatures.

[London1986]

I have another question...

I have a house that is about 20m wide. The boiler and wiser hub is installed in the garage on one side of the house, and my bedroom is upstairs on the opposite of the house and the wiser TRV in this room occasionally loses connection.

To be honest, I am actually very impressed that it even picks up signal at all due to the distance away from the hub. I think I heard once that the valves create a kind of mesh system so maybe the other valves across the house help strengthen the signal for the valve in my bedroom.

Anyway, I'm considering maybe investing in a wiser smart plug to help support this TRV in my bedroom. Has anyone here used the smart plugs and any feedback on them?

[Brum_Brum]

Had the same , one TRV intermittently dropping out (furthest from the hub) wiser smart plug placed approx halfway between sorted it.

[London1986]

Brum_Brum said:

Had the same , one TRV intermittently dropping out (furthest from the hub) wiser smart plug placed approx halfway between sorted it.

Nice one! Thanks for confirming

[juggsy]

London1986 said:

Yes accuracy is one thing, but also it helps with inconstancy. I believe you do need a room stat if you have multiple TRVs in that room as the room stat acts as the source of truth for the temp. The TRVs may have varying temperatures.

Absolutely right, although one thing to bear in mind that you have multiple TRVs they take an average between the two (assuming they’re assigned to the same room). But because of where they’re sited (near the floor, and next to the source of heat), the room stat is a much more accurate and consistent source of truth.

[AW10]

London1986 said:

I have another question...

I have a house that is about 20m wide. The boiler and wiser hub is installed in the garage on one side of the house, and my bedroom is upstairs on the opposite of the house and the wiser TRV in this room occasionally loses connection.

To be honest, I am actually very impressed that it even picks up signal at all due to the distance away from the hub. I think I heard once that the valves create a kind of mesh system so maybe the other valves across the house help strengthen the signal for the valve in my bedroom.

Anyway, I'm considering maybe investing in a wiser smart plug to help support this TRV in my bedroom. Has anyone here used the smart plugs and any feedback on them?

The TRVs don’t create a mesh; you need hardwired accessories like a smart plug or an electrical heat controller to act as nodes in the mesh.

[London1986]

AW10 said:

The TRVs don’t create a mesh; you need hardwired accessories like a smart plug or an electrical heat controller to act as nodes in the mesh.

Ahh yes that's it, I knew it was something along those lines. Thanks for filling in the gaps.