Kitchens - cheap vs expensive
Discussion
And manufacturers of all appliances (or probably any goods really) test them to the tightest margins to ensure they do not outlast there life expectancy. They will no doubt now how many hours they will run for before failing. It is then a fine balance of meeting the customer expectations. With white goods I would say they design them to last 10 years. When I worked in R&D for consumer electronics we could tell you how many button presses it would take for the button to fail, within a few 1000 presses. We could even tell you how many times you could slip it in your jeans pocket before finish was looking tatty.
48k said:
Sheepshanks said:
48k said:
Just boinging this FWIW - the combi oven that was due on 30th March was delivered yesterday. Still no date for the main oven. The kitchen company have said they are not going to be offering NEFF products going forward as it's not worth it (I think they are running out of loaner ovens 
)
Can I asked which microwave you went for? )Microwaves are the one applicance we've had lots of trouble with and we (well my wife) only use it for warming stuff up so spending a chunky amount on one grates. But I don't want a standalone one on the worktop (which is what we do now).
48k said:
NEFF oven and combi 
Apparently the only ones (of these models) in the country right now.
Don't know whether to let them go ahead and fit them, or flip them on eBay for a profit
I see Neff/Bosch are keeping on with the polystyrene packaging, one negative aspect at least for the person who has to get rid of it. Apparently the only ones (of these models) in the country right now. Don't know whether to let them go ahead and fit them, or flip them on eBay for a profit
Just a further word on Miele re. Six appliances ordered last November…..,
Hob delivered faulty now fixed by Miele repairman.
Oven finally delivered in March now installed and working properly.
Fridge apparently being delivered and fitted next Wednesday so we’ll finally get its cabinet door off our lounge floor.
And just when we were toasting the end of this horrendous appliance drama, today, after only a few weeks use, the f
king 2 grand integrated fridge packs up ruining a couple of hundred quids worth of rapidly defrosting grub and by the morning we will no doubt have a huge puddle on our thankfully not yet replaced kitchen floor.
If you’re considering buying Miele for your kitchen on the strength of their reputation, DON’T BE STUPID like we were. Get something else instead.
I’m sure back in the day they were the best of the mass produced, but now they’re not. They’re ste. And the worst kind of ste. Expensive ste.
Hob delivered faulty now fixed by Miele repairman.
Oven finally delivered in March now installed and working properly.
Fridge apparently being delivered and fitted next Wednesday so we’ll finally get its cabinet door off our lounge floor.
And just when we were toasting the end of this horrendous appliance drama, today, after only a few weeks use, the f
king 2 grand integrated fridge packs up ruining a couple of hundred quids worth of rapidly defrosting grub and by the morning we will no doubt have a huge puddle on our thankfully not yet replaced kitchen floor.If you’re considering buying Miele for your kitchen on the strength of their reputation, DON’T BE STUPID like we were. Get something else instead.
I’m sure back in the day they were the best of the mass produced, but now they’re not. They’re s
te. And the worst kind of ste. Expensive ste.Edited by Groat on Friday 29th April 12:11
I am having similar issues related to appliances. Called up the supplier a couple of weeks ago, as the appliances were meant to be delivered this week (other than the Neff ovens, which I knew would be slow) and I wanted to check everything else was on track. Nope - Neff induction hob and extractor fan are delayed, and their best estimate is third week of July ...
They promised a loan electric hob (and oven) but this will obviously delay installation of the worktop and final decorations. Painful. The rest of the appliances were meant to be delivered this week but no sign off them or any correspondence on a delivery date.
The DIY Kitchen arrived last week and we are overall pleased with it. There are a few issues though:
- All six corner posts for the corner units, and both tall filler panels, have scratches and or marks on them. Fairly minor ones, but not acceptable.
- They have sent me a 400 wall unit rather than a 350. Thing is, they have delivered what the final order said but it doesn't align with the plan and obviously I didn't notice.
- The soft close hinges are the clip on type and are a bit naff.
- The double oven unit has a small drawer on the bottom and a big drawer on top which means the lower single oven will be extremely low. Not really what I thought it would be but that ones on me as well.-
- Cornicing won't fit given ceiling heights, which is obviously not really their fault but a bit frustrating. What's the views on going sans cornice? I think it will look a bit naff but not sure I have much alternatives.
- Fitter seems to think the quality is pretty decent compared to what he usually fits, though the fact it comes with drawers fitted and doors attached annoys him a bit as it makes it easier to cause damage and makes the units really heavy when fitting. Obviously they could come off if needed.
They promised a loan electric hob (and oven) but this will obviously delay installation of the worktop and final decorations. Painful. The rest of the appliances were meant to be delivered this week but no sign off them or any correspondence on a delivery date.
The DIY Kitchen arrived last week and we are overall pleased with it. There are a few issues though:
- All six corner posts for the corner units, and both tall filler panels, have scratches and or marks on them. Fairly minor ones, but not acceptable.
- They have sent me a 400 wall unit rather than a 350. Thing is, they have delivered what the final order said but it doesn't align with the plan and obviously I didn't notice.
- The soft close hinges are the clip on type and are a bit naff.
- The double oven unit has a small drawer on the bottom and a big drawer on top which means the lower single oven will be extremely low. Not really what I thought it would be but that ones on me as well.-
- Cornicing won't fit given ceiling heights, which is obviously not really their fault but a bit frustrating. What's the views on going sans cornice? I think it will look a bit naff but not sure I have much alternatives.
- Fitter seems to think the quality is pretty decent compared to what he usually fits, though the fact it comes with drawers fitted and doors attached annoys him a bit as it makes it easier to cause damage and makes the units really heavy when fitting. Obviously they could come off if needed.
Cascade360 said:
Cornicing won't fit given ceiling heights, which is obviously not really their fault but a bit frustrating. What's the views on going sans cornice? I think it will look a bit naff but not sure I have much alternatives.
Sounds very much like my experience with DIY kitchens, delivery was by a pair of gorillas who took zero care of the units, consequently lots of damaged parts. Get on to them, they were very good at replacing damaged parts quickly.As for the cornice, what about using pelmet (designed to go under the top units) instead, only about 25mm high. It's what I've done to squeeze in 2300mm high units and gives a more modern look.
jfdi said:
Cascade360 said:
Cornicing won't fit given ceiling heights, which is obviously not really their fault but a bit frustrating. What's the views on going sans cornice? I think it will look a bit naff but not sure I have much alternatives.
Sounds very much like my experience with DIY kitchens, delivery was by a pair of gorillas who took zero care of the units, consequently lots of damaged parts. Get on to them, they were very good at replacing damaged parts quickly.As for the cornice, what about using pelmet (designed to go under the top units) instead, only about 25mm high. It's what I've done to squeeze in 2300mm high units and gives a more modern look.
Cascade360 said:
- The double oven unit has a small drawer on the bottom and a big drawer on top which means the lower single oven will be extremely low. Not really what I thought it would be but that ones on me as well.-
I modified my unit, by positioning the shelves where I wanted them and then putting filler panel (cut down draw front) above bottom drawer. Behind the filler panel (which I magnetised for removal, is a shelf with all the LED controllers for the under cupboard lighting and plinth lighting)
Edited by DavidY on Thursday 12th May 14:32
My Wren kitchen was delivered a couple of weeks ago
Almost fitted now.. worktop chap came out the other day to template, quartz fitted next Thursday
Very impressed with Wren tbh. 2 doors were missing, they told me, but coming on Monday.
Nothing damaged.
Appliances being fitted on Monday.
We ordered them last Dec, to ensure here in time, stacked up in new extn now!
Almost fitted now.. worktop chap came out the other day to template, quartz fitted next Thursday
Very impressed with Wren tbh. 2 doors were missing, they told me, but coming on Monday.
Nothing damaged.
Appliances being fitted on Monday.
We ordered them last Dec, to ensure here in time, stacked up in new extn now!
We replaced ours 3 years ago. Spent c24k inc units, appliances, flooring, decorating and new lighting. As others have said the fitter is key. We bought from a local chain that have showrooms typically in garden centres. They recommended the fitter who organised the other trades. They all knew each other and everything ran to plan. The kitchen company were professional. Sales guy gave us loads of useful tips. Then the estimator captures all the detail and confirms the final price. The process was like a military operation.
So have now comprehensively checked everything for damage and rather disappointed in the number of things with scuffs and marks. I don't know how particular I am being, but in my mind I shouldn't have visible scuffs and marks (noting on things like filler panels I checked both sides) on a brand new kitchen! Also, it is extremely difficult to take decent photos of scuffed and scratched dark panels. Sent them 35 images which are just various poor photos of green with marks on them ...
This is the list of damages:
- 6 x Heritage Green - Corner Post
- 2 x Heritage Green - Tall End Panel
- 1 x Heritage Green - Left-hand Hinged Base Door
- 1 x Heritage Green - Right-hand Hinged Base Door
- 1 x Heritage Green- Wall End Panel
- 3 x Heritage Green - Base Unit End Panel
- 1 x Mussel - Filler Panel
- 1 x Mussel Wall End Panel
Plus the fact the final order had a 400 Wall Unit rather than a 350 as in the final plan, and they seem to be saying that's my fault as the final order said 400. Which is fine, but easy one to miss and not sure how it got in there.
Asked them if they will agree to return the cornicing and send the new pelmets that we want as part of the delivery and return of the items above. Let's see what they say, and how fussy they get on damages.
Oh and appliances - no sight of them, no emails about them. Was told they would be here last week ...
Other battle we are having - floor layers were instructed to level kitchen and utility, as the latter was quite a bit lower. They used loads of latex self leveller, put a hump between the rooms, and aggresively feathered it down (so raised it by about 2mm at the outer walls and about 30mm between the rooms). I told them their quote was to level it, and they got pretty aggressive, and it ended up in them using some choice words and leaving, then sending me a bill for the dpm and half the quote to level, and presumably won't be coming back for the laying. Have another floor layer lined up, but not yet decided whether and if so what to pay the first crew ...
Last annoying thing - water softener won't fit in cabinets. My fault, had read 495mm as internal diameter under belfast sink but that is outer diameter and softener is 490mm. Nowhere else to put it without a pipework nightmare so current plan is to chop a hole in the bottom of the unit so it sits on the floor ...
This is the list of damages:
- 6 x Heritage Green - Corner Post
- 2 x Heritage Green - Tall End Panel
- 1 x Heritage Green - Left-hand Hinged Base Door
- 1 x Heritage Green - Right-hand Hinged Base Door
- 1 x Heritage Green- Wall End Panel
- 3 x Heritage Green - Base Unit End Panel
- 1 x Mussel - Filler Panel
- 1 x Mussel Wall End Panel
Plus the fact the final order had a 400 Wall Unit rather than a 350 as in the final plan, and they seem to be saying that's my fault as the final order said 400. Which is fine, but easy one to miss and not sure how it got in there.
Asked them if they will agree to return the cornicing and send the new pelmets that we want as part of the delivery and return of the items above. Let's see what they say, and how fussy they get on damages.
Oh and appliances - no sight of them, no emails about them. Was told they would be here last week ...
Other battle we are having - floor layers were instructed to level kitchen and utility, as the latter was quite a bit lower. They used loads of latex self leveller, put a hump between the rooms, and aggresively feathered it down (so raised it by about 2mm at the outer walls and about 30mm between the rooms). I told them their quote was to level it, and they got pretty aggressive, and it ended up in them using some choice words and leaving, then sending me a bill for the dpm and half the quote to level, and presumably won't be coming back for the laying. Have another floor layer lined up, but not yet decided whether and if so what to pay the first crew ...
Last annoying thing - water softener won't fit in cabinets. My fault, had read 495mm as internal diameter under belfast sink but that is outer diameter and softener is 490mm. Nowhere else to put it without a pipework nightmare so current plan is to chop a hole in the bottom of the unit so it sits on the floor ...
Edited by Cascade360 on Sunday 15th May 19:45
Cascade360 said:
Last annoying thing - water softener won't fit in cabinets. My fault, had read 495mm as internal diameter under belfast sink but that is outer diameter and softener is 490mm. Nowhere else to put it without a pipework nightmare so current plan is to chop a hole in the bottom of the unit so it sits on the floor ...
If it’s a hole so you maintain its structural integrity (bearing in mind it’s holding the sink) rather than cutting away part of the cabinet then that seems an OK solution.Sorry to hear the rest of your woes. We’re out of our house for the final part of the refurb and I’m finding it very stressful. Even my wife, who normally doesn’t get bothered by anything, is getting quite mithered that the builders have put some services in the kitchen in the wrong places - they’ve gone off the architects drawings which was supposed to be rough idea of a kitchen.
Cascade360 said:
Plus the fact the final order had a 400 Wall Unit rather than a 350 as in the final plan, and they seem to be saying that's my fault as the final order said 400. Which is fine, but easy one to miss and not sure how it got in there.
This is a classic. You tell them what you want, they do something else and then it's your fault for not telling them what you want enough times.I had this with some windows where everything was right, because I went through it and corrected everything 3 or 4 times, then on the final correction they reverted the window cills from 270mm down to 150mm depth, which was the first thing I'd corrected. Bespoke colour too so a total pain to sort out, would have been a massive delay if they hadn't had an offcut in the same colour lying around.
It's a total pisstake that they can't just setup what you've asked for without screwing it up, let alone blaming you after the fact. In my case I had something like 10 emails going back and forth that were all completely explicit on the spec and they still screwed it up and wanted me to pay for it. FFS.
Cascade360 said:
and how fussy they get on damages.
In my experience they are very quick and efficient in resolving these issuesSheepshanks said:
Cascade360 said:
Last annoying thing - water softener won't fit in cabinets. My fault, had read 495mm as internal diameter under belfast sink but that is outer diameter and softener is 490mm. Nowhere else to put it without a pipework nightmare so current plan is to chop a hole in the bottom of the unit so it sits on the floor ...
If it’s a hole so you maintain its structural integrity (bearing in mind it’s holding the sink) rather than cutting away part of the cabinet then that seems an OK solution.BTW re the 400/350 cabinet - these sort of mistakes do happen, but in the grand scheme of things the additional costs of a different cupboard pale into insignificance to that of the overall kitchen, delays caused by it are more of a hassle though.
The fitter still isn't sure if the softener will fit given it is a double belfast sink with two wastes, so it remains to be seen whether we might just have to ditch the idea altogether.
Forgot about the other frustrating thing, we got a boiler fitted about a year ago and got one that would fit in a kitchen cupboard deliberately. However because we went with tall DIY Kitchens wall units it wasn't in quite the right place and we have had to pay to get it lifted by about an inch. Then some of the new pipework leaked all over our floor yesterday. Urgh.
The delay on the damaged pieces is certainly the more annoying thing, as it is holding things up. Though given how many filler and end panels were damaged, I am not confident that the next ones they send us will not be...
Forgot about the other frustrating thing, we got a boiler fitted about a year ago and got one that would fit in a kitchen cupboard deliberately. However because we went with tall DIY Kitchens wall units it wasn't in quite the right place and we have had to pay to get it lifted by about an inch. Then some of the new pipework leaked all over our floor yesterday. Urgh.
The delay on the damaged pieces is certainly the more annoying thing, as it is holding things up. Though given how many filler and end panels were damaged, I am not confident that the next ones they send us will not be...
We nearly moved on a new kitchen before covid hit and are now re exploring.
I had 3 quotes - Howdens Clerkenwell with quartz worktops (large kitchen so about 30 units) £14k plus fitting £2800 not inc appliances. Benchmarx similar, Bespoke was £28k all in inc appliances - no thanks.
Naturally I expect prices have gone up but does anyone know the current situation with stock and appliances. Has supply largely returned to normal or would it be better to wait ?
I had 3 quotes - Howdens Clerkenwell with quartz worktops (large kitchen so about 30 units) £14k plus fitting £2800 not inc appliances. Benchmarx similar, Bespoke was £28k all in inc appliances - no thanks.
Naturally I expect prices have gone up but does anyone know the current situation with stock and appliances. Has supply largely returned to normal or would it be better to wait ?
DT1975 said:
We nearly moved on a new kitchen before covid hit and are now re exploring.
I had 3 quotes - Howdens Clerkenwell with quartz worktops (large kitchen so about 30 units) £14k plus fitting £2800 not inc appliances. Benchmarx similar, Bespoke was £28k all in inc appliances - no thanks.
Naturally I expect prices have gone up but does anyone know the current situation with stock and appliances. Has supply largely returned to normal or would it be better to wait ?
Beat Howdens up on the price excluding worktops + get a local granite / quartz place to quote to supply and fit.I had 3 quotes - Howdens Clerkenwell with quartz worktops (large kitchen so about 30 units) £14k plus fitting £2800 not inc appliances. Benchmarx similar, Bespoke was £28k all in inc appliances - no thanks.
Naturally I expect prices have gone up but does anyone know the current situation with stock and appliances. Has supply largely returned to normal or would it be better to wait ?
Edited by bennno on Friday 10th June 18:57
Cascade360 said:
Other battle we are having - floor layers were instructed to level kitchen and utility, as the latter was quite a bit lower. They used loads of latex self leveller, put a hump between the rooms, and aggresively feathered it down (so raised it by about 2mm at the outer walls and about 30mm between the rooms). I told them their quote was to level it, and they got pretty aggressive, and it ended up in them using some choice words and leaving, then sending me a bill for the dpm and half the quote to level, and presumably won't be coming back for the laying. Have another floor layer lined up, but not yet decided whether and if so what to pay the first crew ...
I wouldn't be paying them a thing tbh - as you say, they didn't complete the contract and decided to walk, what they have done will need re-doing.Alternatively, look to the new quote and anything which is left over to their initial quote (for the same work) pay them. Eg initial quote of £1k and £800 to fix pay them £200
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